Pie-Rats

GAME 10 REVIEW
CUBS 1 PIRATES 2 W: Zach Duke (1-1) L: Jerome Williams (0-1) S: Mike Gonzalez (2) Recap | Box Score | Play-by-play | Game Chart
Ugh, a tough game to lose. Zach Duke returned to last season's form. After the Cubs had forced him to scuffle and struggle and throw pitches in the first two innings, the lefty settled down, pitching seven strong innings. The Cub defense let down Jerome Williams, aiding the Pirates in the only two runs they would need. Cedeno got charged with a throwing error on a difficult play in the hole, which allowed Craig Wilson to score from third. Bynum, (who replaced Pagan in right field after Pagan seemed to seriously injure his left knee while running to first) misplayed a Wilson drive off the right field wall, and then jogged after the ball while Wilson legged out a triple. (What was up with Wilson's wheels? He stole a base in advance of the Cedeno error, and eventually scored after his triple. Wilson hit one triple and stole three bases all of last year!) Williams also threw a ball away on a pickoff play, giving Cub fans everywhere a sense of deja vu. The Cubs had one golden scoring opportunity in the eighth, with runners at first and second, one out, Duke out of the game, and Ramirez and Barrett up; Ramirez popped up, Barrett struck out, and that was pretty much the game. If that's the bad news (and indeed, it's considerable), the good news is that Williams pitched quite well - certainly well enough to merit another start, while our horde of supposedly near-ready injured starting pitchers continues to recuperate. Murton kept raking, and Eyre looked good in relief. While I'm not sure that this really counts as good news, I'll also add that Aramis managed to not pull a leg or butt muscle, when he had to go from a walk to a sprint in a single step upon realizing that his 410 ft. double was not, in fact, going to be a home run. Congrats, Aramis.
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Comments

From previous thread...

CUBS LOSE!!! FIRE DUSTY!!!

ha ha

Poor 9th inning. 4 pitches...Neifi and Cedeno swing at first pitch. When will Cedeno get his forst BB?? At least Jwill pitched well. Hope Rusch can put down the doughnuts for one day and pitch well tomorrow.

UGH..........

From previous thread...

Cedneo now has 3 errors and two of them were very costly, including todays. I think it is fair to start getting worried a little about his throws. His glove seems to be good, but he also had like 5-7 balls thrown into the dirt that Lee had to pick out.

He is batting .351 so far, so that is making up for his defense, but that will come down and with him swinging at everything and having ZERO walks so far, I hope he starts to calm down some and know he is the everyday SS and relax.

That really was a tough play that he got the error on. I'm not worried about that. He won't go the entire year batting .351, but he won't go the entire year without walking, either. Kid's got to keep playing.

Trans:
"That really was a tough play that he got the error on."

I really didn't think it was that tough. He fielded it cleanly and just made another bad throw. Most of his bad throws have been in the dirt, but that throw was too high for even Lee to get and stay on the bag. From what I have heard his defense is better than what we have seen, so I can only hope it rebounds. But as for him keep playing, I don't think that will be a problem considering he has started every game I think. He might get an offday soon, but he will keep playing unless he plays himself out of starting.

Cedeno had trouble gripping the ball after he got it out of his mitt and thus made a bad throw. He makes more spectacular plays than he does errors (for now) and he needs the work. I hope he gets about 85% of the starts this year.

You know you have a hurtin' bench when you're relying on Neifi for a clutch hit in the ninth inning.

If Dusty had made a double switch with Walker batting for the pitcher and taking out Bynum (putting Hairston out in right field), then the Cubs would not have had to worry about hitting for the pitcher in the ninth if either Neifi/Murton/Cedeno had gotten on base, though that point was moot after the hack-at-the-first pitch display. I see Bynum being the odd man out when the extra arm is added to the pitching corps in two weeks.

MacrV:
"I see Bynum being the odd man out when the extra arm is added to the pitching corps in two weeks."

Well, Pagan's injury looked pretty bad. It looked like his hamstring and he had to be helped off the field. I think you will see him put on DL and whoever gets called up as the 5th OF (hopefully not Pie), he will be sent back down when we go to the 12 man staff.

I posted in the other thread about the A's hitting back-to-back-to-back HRs on 3 straight pitches (Chavez-Thomas-Bradley). And I wondered if it ever happened before. Well, guess who was the last team to do it....

"The last time a team homered on three straight pitches was Sept. 29, 2001, when Fred McGriff, Rondell White and Todd Hundley did it for the Cubs against Houston's Dave Mlicki at Wrigley Field, according to the Elias Sports Bureau." -ESPN.com

Funny shit...

You have a good point about Pagan, though we'll have to see the extent of the injury. Who else besides Pie is available?

I wouldn't mind seeing Pie come up for a cup of coffee (4-5 games), just to remind him of the life he can be living if he keeps working hard in the minors.

What a great 9th inning in MINN. 2 out game winning 2 run single for Morneau of Mariano....Great baseball game.

#8 of 8: By Marc V (April 15, 2006 10:36 PM)
You have a good point about Pagan, though we'll have to see the extent of the injury. Who else besides Pie is available?

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MARC V: If it isn't a pitcher, it would almost certainly be somebody who is at least already on the 40-man roster, which probably means Ryan Theriot or Felix Pie.

However, since the 5th starter slot becomes permanent on April 25th, I suspect Dusty & Hendry will just go ahead and bring up the 12th pitcher right away. And that pitcher would likely be David Aardsma, who has the following line through five appearances at AAA Iowa (including tonight's game):

7 IP, 2 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 11 K, 2 SV

HIGHLIGHTS/LOWLIGHTS FROM SATURDAY ON THE FARM:

Certainly the highlight tonight would be the combined four-hitter by Rich Hill (7 IP, 4 H, 2 R, 1 BB, 10 K, 1 HBP, 91 pitches) & David Aardsma (two perfect innings of relief with 3 K for the save) at Round Rock, as the Iowa Cubs defeated the Astros AAA affiliate 2-1. Felix Pie was 2-4 with two doubles and 2 RBI, plus a BB & a K. Through 10 games, Pie is hitting .350 (.422 OBP) with 1 HR & 13 RBI, 3 2B, 2 3B, 5 BB, and 7 K in 45 PA, plus 3 out of 3 in SB, and one OF ASSIST.

Augie Ojeda (.438), Felix Pie (.350), and Buck Coats (.348) lead the Iowa Cubs in hitting.

Ryan Harvey hit another HR for Daytona (his 3rd), but he also struck-out three times (3 HR, 1 BB, and 14 K in 32 PA for Harvey so far).

On the negative side, 1B Brandon Sing (Iowa) continues to be overmatched by AAA pitchers, going 0-3 with 2 K (now batting .167 with no extra base hits and no RBI, 3 BB and 11 K in 33 PA).

----

BATTING (ALL LEVELS):

IOWA:
Felix Pie, CF: 2-4, 2 RBI, 2 2B, BB, K
Ryan Theriot, 2B: 0-3, K, SH
Casey McGehee, 3B: 0-3, BB
Jeff Deardorff, LF: 0-4, 2K, SB
Brandon Sing, 1B: 0-3, R, BB, 2 K
Geovany Soto, C: 0-3, K, SH (FIELDING: 1 OSB, 1 OCS)
Buck Coats, RF: 2-4, R, 2 K
Augie Ojeda, SS: 1-3, R, BB
Rich Hill, P: 0-2 , K, SH
Jamal Strong: 0-1

WEST TENN (AA):
Chris Walker, CF: 0-4
Eric Patterson, 2B: 0-3, BB, SB
Luis Montanez, LF: 0-4, K, SB
Micah Hoffpauir, 1B: 1-4, SOLO HR
Scott Moore, 3B: 1-4, 2 K
Jose Reyes, C: 2-4, 2 K (FIELDING: 2 OCS)
Adam Greenberg, RF: 2-3, BB, K, CS
Gary Cates, SS: 1-4, K

DAYTONA (A+):
Sam Fuld, CF: 1-5, R, SB (FIELDING: OF ASSIST AT HOME)
Jemel Spearman, 3B: 3-4, R, RBI, SH, CS, PICKED-OFF
Ryan Harvey, RF: TWO-RUN HR, 3 K, E
Nic Jackson, LF: 1-4, R, BB, 2 K
Jacob Fox, C: 2-4, 3-RUN HR, K
Matt Craig, 1B: 0-3, R, BB, K
Issmael Salas, 2B: 3-4, 2 R, RBI, 2B, K, E
Joe Simokaitis, SS: 2-4, R 2 RBI, 3B, E
Olin Wick, DH: 1-4, R, 2B

PEORIA (A)
Davy Gregg, CF: 3-4, R, K, (FIELDING: OF ASSIST AT HOME)
Matt Ciaramella, RF: 0-3, RBI
Jesus Valdez, LF: 0-3, K, SH
Ryan Norwood, 1B: 0-4, 2 K
Brandon Taylor, 3B: 0-4, GIDP
Alberto Garcia, DH: 1-4, K
Dylan Johnston: 0-0, SB
Robinson Chrinos, 2B: 1-2, 2 BB, SB, E
Jake Muyco, C: 0-3, BB (FIELDING: 2 OCS)
Luis Rivera, SS: 0-3, K, E
Mark Reed: 0-1, K

----

PITCHING (ALL LEVELS):

IOWA (AAA):
Rich Hill: 7 IP, 4 H, 1 R (1 ER), 1 BB, 10 K, HBP (W 1-0)
David Aardsma: 2 IP, 0 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 3 K
TO
Rich Hill: (1-0 1.38 ERA) 13 IP, 7 H, 3 R (2 ER), 1 BB, 16 K
David Aardsma (0-0 0.00 ERA 2-2 SV) 7 IP, 2 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 11 K

WEST TENN (AA):
Juan Mateo: 5 IP, 4 H, 2 R (2 ER), 3 BB, 3 K
Paul Schappert: 3 IP, 0 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 0 K, HBP
TO
Juan Mateo: (0-1 3.60 ERA) 10 IP, 7 H, 4 R (4 ER), 3 BB, 7 K

DAYTONA (A+) :
Grant Johnson: 5.1 IP, 8 H, 8 H, 4 R, 92 ER), 2 BB, 2 K, 1 HR (W 1-1)
Jonathan Hunton: 1 IP, 2 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 1 K
Carlos Vasquez: 1.2 IP, 0 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 1 K
Adelberto Mendez: 1 IP, 1 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 2 K
TO
Grant Johnson (1-1 4.91 ERA) 11 IP, 13 H, 8 R (6 ER), 6 BB, 6 K, 1 HR

PEORIA (A):
Mitch Atkins: 5 IP, 4 H,. 0 R, 1 BB, 6 K
Roberto Sotolongo: 2 IP, 3 H, 2 R (2 ER), 0 BB, 1 K, HR, HBP (L 0-1)
Jeff Teasley: 1 IP, 1 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 1 K
Edward Campusano: 1 IP, 1 H, 0 R, 1 BB, 0 K
TO
Mitch Atkins: (0-0 1.80 ERA) 10 IP, 6 H, 2 R (2 ER), 3 BB, 10 K

This was one of those frustrating games that all too often keep the Cubs from being where they need to be as big time contenders. Unearned run in a one-run loss, men left in scoring position, thin bench, cellar dweller opponent beats us. Brickhouse used to talk about these losses being the ones that keep managers from being able to sleep, whereas the ones like the 8-3 loss the other day being easier to turn the page on. All teams lose games like tonight's, of course. Our team just happens to do it entirely too often.

These posts and comments are surprisingly soft on Bynum. Cost you the winning run and the ballgame by loafing. First chance to play the field and get a couple of ABs and he can't be bothered with running down a ball in the outfield? Inexcusable.

He should go right to Peoria. The 25th man is for all intents and purposes a throw away position. Give it to someone who appreciates it and will bust his ass, not pick it.

bun assuming the double and WALKING to the ball in RF was inexcusable no matter how 'slow' the runner is. parachat in-game blew up about that for a while.

buck coats is gonna take his job if he dont watch out.

If they do call up a 12th pitcher to replace Pagan it will be Jae Kuk Ryu. He has been "shadowing" Rusch in AAA so that means he is fresh to give them innings out of the pen. Aardsma has been as worked as the rest of the guys in the pen and would not be helpful as Ryu.

Patpiper:
"These posts and comments are surprisingly soft on Bynum. Cost you the winning run and the ballgame by loafing."

That run would of most likely scored anyways if I recall...

Here is the play-by-play of the inning:
Craig Wilson: tripled to deep right.
Joe Randa: hit sacrifice fly to right, Wilson scored.
Jose Castillo: Castillo singled to center.
Castillo caught stealing
Humberto Cota: Cota grounded out to first.

I think he would of scored on the single anyways. Cedeno's error with 2 outs was the killer if you want to blame the defense.

I too good to bat at the bottom of this line-up.

I want to be traded.

Andy Sisco comes in with bases loaded, gives up all 3 inhereited runs and his ERA drops to 12.60 from 15.00...NICE!!

Gee what did you expect any pitcher to do with bases loaded and no outs? Get out of it with no damage? He walked a guy and gave up a base hit and struck out 2 batters. Hell that is an average inning from Dempster.

I know the Sisco haters have been waiting over a year to get on his case. What ever makes you feel better about losing a talented pitcher for nothing. You can justify it all you want, but Hendry screwed the pooch on that one.

There is NO REASON in that Pie shouldn't be called up. Even for a few games. its not like we have to worry about running out of options. I would shocked as shit if he wasn't on the ML roster for all 162 next year. So lets get him up. He can't do WORLSE than Pagan. Not to diss Pagan but we don't need much from him.

And MikeC, Sisco was never going to develop with the Cubs. and he had very little trade value. Hendry did not screw the pooch. Andy Sisco screwed the Cubs by being an asshole.

MIKEC:
"Hell that is an average inning from Dempster."

Dempster who?? The Ryan Dempster who closes for the Cubs has not given up an earned run now in like 30.0 IP. He has a WHIP of 0.67 this year. Sisco's is nothing but a head case who plays for a shit team and got to do mopup duty last year, thus somewhat padding his stats. Now this year they have put him in tough situations and he shits himslef with a 12.60 ERA with a 2.80 WHIP, 1 loss and 1 BL save. IF you look closely at his games, whenever he comes in in blowouts, he does great, but close games, well get teh depends out.

Yeah, I wish Hendry could of hoodwinked another GM and got something for this guy, but I think the other GM's realized what he is...a AAAA pitcher.

I still predict Sisco won't be that great of a ML pitcher.

Javier Martinez look him up.

Can anyone make sense of this comment by our resdent genius manager (from the Trib):

SETUP: Ramirez scored on Murton's single, but the Cubs wound up stranding two runners in the inning and two more in the eighth before going down in order on four pitches from Mike Gonzalez in the ninth.

DUSTY QUOTE: "The approach was right," Baker said. "Just the pitch selection wasn't."

from Couch article today in the Suntimes:

START QUOTE: What gives? He was grouchy and defensive coming into 2005 and relaxed and happy coming into this season. Was this offseason different than the last one?

"Yeah,'' he said. "Some of the stuff that happened through the winter [before last season] didn't set well with me. This winter, I said, 'What the hell?'

"You learn how to deal with stuff. Life is too short. All the stuff that happened here was [b.s.], by the way. But I have a nice family and my health after [prostate] cancer, and my mom and dad are doing well. What do I have to be upset about?''

It's hard to know whether to be encouraged by Baker's attitude and involvement this season or to be galled that he was sitting in the dugout stewing while the team needed help last season. He didn't have much to work with last season, but that was all the more reason the team needed him. END QUOTE

Superjimmer says: This is what I and others here have been saying the last two or three years. I was adament about the fact that Dusty was stewing and pouting and wasting Cub's time and money over his personal image concerns. People like Crunch would insist that Dusty was just having fun with the media . . . well Dusty SAYS directly that he was angry last year and that he is trying to deal with it now.

This Couch article by the way is PRO Dusty and saying we shouldn't give up on him yet, so save your venum Crunch and Manny. I (and others here) see Dusty's subtle energy draining tactics and ego as a very POWERFUL detriment to this teams' ability to win and Dusty basically spells it out for you here.

Also the bad news is I disagree with Couch. Baker is still angry (constantly points out that last years stuff (Stone, Sosa, Ivy League female) was all "BULLSHIT"). Translation: he hasn't admitted his denial was the problem and he is still CLEARLY angry no matter what he SAYS. It WILL surface this year and he will implode again. Guaranteed.

If he was a master strategist this might be acceptable but his personal egotistical denials and his poor management choices will NEVER win here (I am talking World Series, which is why he is here). Mark my words and I'll eat sh$t if I am wrong.

Also he insists on blaming the personel a LOT this year for last year's troubles. For $3 or $4 million per year, he should be able to make a decent effort no matter what talent level you are whining about Dusty.

What a tool.


SETUP: Ramirez scored on Murton's single, but the Cubs wound up stranding two runners in the inning and two more in the eighth before going down in order on four pitches from Mike Gonzalez in the ninth.


DUSTY QUOTE: "The approach was right," Baker said. "Just the pitch selection wasn't."

sj- it is not clear from the quote if baker was talking about the entire game, or specifically the 9th inning. for the sake of discussion i would offer it concerns the ninth inning only. and the pittsburgh pitcher/pitch coach/braintrust knew that, especially with neifi announced as the ph, that he and cedeno would be first ball/fastball swinging; throwing them unmanageable strikes resulted in the 2 pop-ups. for murton, there could have been no defense from the pitching standpoint, as he would have waited out anything that he couldn't hit to take the walk. the good news is he drilled the pitch he chose to swing at, the bad news is he drilled it at randa. inning over, game over, with not even enough time to squawk that it took 4 whole pitches.

and this is payback to the cubs, from a karmic point of view, for the 4 pitch victory ohman got when he took over on opening day from carlos "don't call me loco" zambrano. but sunday is a new day (in more ways than one), and a new conquest awaits the visitors from chicago.

If Jones can't start on Sunday, I'd bring Pie up for a few games. Start him on Sunday, let him pinch hit a couple of games, send him back with the taste in his mouth.

For a kid from the Carribean, what a better place to start a major league career than in RF in Pittsburgh, a few hundred feet away from the statue of Roberto Clemente?

I doubt you would be able to call up any player on Saturday night, fly him from Round Rock to Pittsburgh on Easter morning, and have him in the line-up for a 1 pm EDT start. I suspect we will see Bynum in RF today if Jones and Pagan cannot go, with the reliever "TBD" depending on how Rusch pitches today. If Rusch stinks, it could be Ryu, though I think Aardsma is a better bet as he has a chance of sticking long-term (over Novoa).

It was great to see JWill pitch well yesterday.

#26 of 26: By DC Tom (April 16, 2006 10:51 AM)
I doubt you would be able to call up any player on Saturday night, fly him from Round Rock to Pittsburgh on Easter morning, and have him in the line-up for a 1 pm EDT start. I suspect we will see Bynum in RF today if Jones and Pagan cannot go, with the reliever "TBD" depending on how Rusch pitches today. If Rusch stinks, it could be Ryu, though I think Aardsma is a better bet as he has a chance of sticking long-term (over Novoa).

It was great to see JWill pitch well yesterday.
-

DC TOM: You don't think John Mabry will play RF today? Even if Jones doesn't return Monday, I doubt Bynum will get any starts in RF. Much more likely a Mabry/Hairston platoon until Jones gets back in the lineup.

This Cubs' team seems like most of the recent Cubs' teams - - they are like the nursery rhyme about that girl with the curl . . . when she was good she was very, very good but when she was bad she was horrid.

The achilles heel of this team seems to be both the starting pitching and the offense (though there are concerns with other areas clearly, too).

You never know what you are gonna get with this team. You might occasionally see an offensive outburst. But just as often, or more often, we get little or no offense. You might occasionally see a good pitching performance, mostly from 40-year old Greg Maddux, but just as often, or more often, we get shelled.

Maddux clearly is the ace of this staff. I am beginning to wonder, well, actually well past that, if Zambrano will be yet another in a long line of Cubs' starting pitchers who supposedly had so very much promise who will not nearly live up to it.

I am getting a bit weary of Zambrano. The guy clearly has not gotten ahold of his emotions after years of people saying that he needs to. Sure, it is nice to have a bit of fire but Carlos cannot reign it in, he cannot channel it. It is clear from the way he stalks or sulks around the mound that calls on balls and strikes still bother him and he lets it get to him and it affects his performance too often. I wonder what, if anything, the Cubs have done the last couple of years to try to get Z to not get so distracted on the mound. My guess is that they have done nothing.

We pretty clearly are thin on offense yet again. The other day when our lineup included Perez, Hairston, Pagan, and Blanco, and we had Murton hitting clean-up, that was pathetic. That is not the line-up of a team that has any chance to make it to the playoffs. Yeah, I know, that is not our usual line-up but those are games that we basically have no chance at all to win even before the first pitch is thrown, especially with Pierre not hitting and ARAM not hitting. That left DLEE, Ronnie and Murton as the only real offensive threats.

I was excited initially about Pagan and Bynum but these guys seem like marginal hitters at best. And Pagan is besides the point now that he is injured, possibly for a long time. And now the talk is, well, we have to bring up Pie because who else do we have. I just question whether Hendry has done his job if that is what it has come to. We have a payroll that is, what, almost twice the Brewers' payroll? And yet our roster is full of holes.

So far we have played the likes of the Pirates and Reds, and one series against the Cards. Yes, we played well against the Cards. But I am wondering whether we will once again play them tough but do little else. I kind of wonder what is going to happen when our schedule gets tougher. It is still very early but my expectations for this team are, once again, very low.

Cedeno's error with 2 outs was the killer if you want to blame the defense.

Manny...there is a big difference between making a physical error and a mental error. Cedeno simply made a bad throw. Bynum was flat out lazy and not hustling, which should be unnacceptable.

And to assume that Wilson would have scored on the single does not work. One would pitch differently with a runner on third than with the bases empty.

I rarely post on this site, but I read the comments everyday. I was wondering why Juan Pierre seems to be getting a free pass from the fans? I for one am sick of the standard Juan Pierre at bat: take strike one, take a couple balls, foul off a pitch or two, then weekly ground out to the second baseman. With his sub-standard defense and hitting (so far) he is clearly holding the Cubs back.

My thoughts are to bat Ronny first and Todd second, then put Juan down at 7th or 8th to get him heated up, any thoughts?

Cedeno RH
Walker LH
Lee RH
Ramirez RH
Barrett RH
Jones LH
Murton RH
Pierre LH

Another thing, why are we even talking about Bynam starting in right field, JHJ should be the only consideration until Jones is back. This'll force Crusty to actually start his hottest hitter (walker) everyday, as an additional benefit.

I would much, much rather see Mabry out in right, if he is healthy, than Hairston. Jerry's bat lacks punch and with Pierre not hitting we just cannot afford to have two weak hitting outfielders in the lineup on a regular basis.

As for Pierre, he has slumped even more after leaving Wrigley. I suspect that, if he keeps hitting, or not hitting, like this, he will be booed when the team gets back to Wrigley.

Pierre's standard at bat often is not grounding out but rather dropping down a bunt with no one on that is just routinely picked up and tossed to the first baseman with Pierre out by a step or two. It is still early so let's give him a chance. But if he does not improve, at least he is only signed for one year.

#30 of 31: By bj1234568 (April 16, 2006 11:18 AM)
I rarely post on this site, but I read the comments everyday. I was wondering why Juan Pierre seems to be getting a free pass from the fans? I for one am sick of the standard Juan Pierre at bat: take strike one, take a couple balls, foul off a pitch or two, then weekly ground out to the second baseman. With his sub-standard defense and hitting (so far) he is clearly holding the Cubs back.

My thoughts are to bat Ronny first and Todd second, then put Juan down at 7th or 8th to get him heated up, any thoughts?

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BJ1234568: If Pierre continues to struggle, I would go with Walker-Murton or Hairston-Murton 1-2, followed by Lee-Ramirez-Barrett-Jones-Cedeno-Pierre vs LHP, flipping Jones with Barrett and Pierre with Cedeno vs RHP.

I like speed at the top of the order (distracting the pitcher & catcher and getting more fast balls for the 3-4-5 guys), but ONLY IF the speed guys can get on base. If a player is fast and is a good base-stealer but doesn't get on base consistently, he shouldn't be hitting 1-2.

The most important thing is to put the higher OBP guys ahead of the run producers, as long as the high OBP guys have at least average speed (Walker and Murton are borderline average runners) such that they can go from 1st to 3rd on a single, score from 2nd on a single to the OF, and score from 1st on a two-out double.

And what if Pierre continues to struggle and gets moved out of the lead-off spot to the #8 hole and then he still can't turn it around? Well, then it should be Pie Time, and Pierre becomes a highly-paid 4th OF and PR and 2007 FA begging for a contract.

I for one believe that before we start turning on pierre we need to give him at least a couple of months of sucking not just a couple of weeks. In the long run I bet that his bat will come alive and we will be very glad he is here.

You can't move Pierre to the 7 or 8 spot. You brought him in explicitly to be the leadoff man, and you're stuck with him.

I didn't realize that Pie was in Round Rock last night. With a day game today, the earliest he could get to the Pittsburgh airport on commercial service is 11:45am. At best he'd be a defensive replacement for Mabry, on minimal sleep. Better to just have him play today in Round Rock then fly straight to LA on Monday morning. American flies Austin-LA nonstop each morning.

Just remember one thing about Pierre. Three 200 hit seasons, career .305 batting average. There is NO ONE on our roster with that kind of track record.

Guys like him, the hits will come sooner rather than later.

Juan Pierre has a very long leash and will get every possible oportunity to "turn it around," but if he continues to struggle, he should not continue to hit in the lead-off spot.

I like Juan Pierre and was happy when Hendry acquired him after failing to sign Rafael Furcal, but the thing about Pierre is that he has had a +50 OBP over BA throughout his career, meaning for him to have a .350 OBP, he has to hit .300, and when he has hit .300, a lot of those hits were bunt singles or infield hits, and he is not getting those types of hits right now.

The idea of dropping Pierre to the #8 spot if he continues to struggle would only be an option if he continues to struggle in the lead-off spot into mid-season (June), and then the move would be just temporary. At that point, either he would get going and be moved back to the lead-off spot, or if he doesn't turn it around, he'll get benched and be replaced by Felix Pie sometime around the All-Star Break. And if that were to happen, then Pierre becomes a very expensive Tom Goodwin (4th OF and PR).

Oh and you don't bring up Pie unless you are going to play him day in and day out for atleast a 2 week+ stretch.

You don't bring up Pie to play 1-2 games and then have him ride the bench when Jones is back.

We are just going to have to suck it up with Bynum or Mabry till Jones gets back.

Part of the reason that we are (or at least I am) giving Pierre a free pass is that he's not going anywhere in 2006. He's our starting CF and leadoff guy. Period. Any arguments about him are purely academic.

The 25th man on the roster, the 2B situation and the 3rd through 5th spots in the rotation are worth discussing because important decisions about those things will need to be made by Dusty and Hendry in the coming weeks. But Pierre? He's not going anywhere, for better or worse. That decision was set in stone in the offseason.

#35 of 37: By MikeC (April 16, 2006 12:44 PM)
Just remember one thing about Pierre. Three 200 hit seasons, career .305 batting average. There is NO ONE on our roster with that kind of track record.

Guys like him, the hits will come sooner rather than later.

----

And what Mike C just stated seems like the most likely outcome. It's not like Pierre is dependent on hitting line shots into the gaps to get on base. Probably more than any other player in MLB today, Pierre knows how to get on base without the ball having to leave the infield.

As long as he doesn't incur a leg injury of some kind, he SHOULD be able to get on base and he SHOULD score a lot of runs.

His three year averages (2003-05) are:

200 hits (30-35 per month)
.300 BA
.350 OBP.
100 RUNS (15-16 per month)
50 SB (8-9 per month)

He's only 28, and so it should be just a matter of time before he comes back up close to his typical BA and OBP. Right now, he appears to be pressing.

But even with his slow start, he's on a pace to score 112 runs and steal 48 bases, so a 4-for-5 game followed by a 2-for-3 game (which he has done before in his career) and (presto) he's hitting .300.

I'd bring Pie up for the Dodgers series.

1. There's a risk Jones will reaggravate the injury
2. Even if Jones is 90%, I'd like a defensive replacement
3. Freddy Bynum is Jose Macias' illegitimate brother.
4. You want to see how the starters do before bringing up your 12th pitcher.

I'd start him once, bring him in for defensive purposes or on a double-switch twice. Then I'd send him back in time to bring up a 12th pitcher for the next series.

I think it's good for the AAA and AA players to see that a youth movement doesn't fear giving them an opportunity, even if it is just for a couple of days, to show what they can do at the highest level.

"Freddy Bynum is Jose Macias' illegitimate brother." Except the Gremlin would have run after the "triple".
Every 25th man is another 25th man's illegitimate brother.They are the most marginally talented people on the roster: ie 24 other guys on the team are better than they are.
I could never understand the whole Macias bashing last year. He did what was expected of him. If only the other 24 guys had.

Patpiper:
"I could never understand the whole Macias bashing last year. He did what was expected of him."

AMEN...

For all the complaining, none of which went towards Hendry who actually traded for the guy, Macias got 177 AB's last year. That is less than most 25th men.

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