Game 76 Thread / Rockies @ Cubs (2 of 3)

Game Chat Rodrigo Lopez vs. Ted Lilly Lineups:
Taveras CF Soriano LF
Tulowitszki SS Fontenot SS
Holliday LF Lee 1B
Helton 1B Ramirez 3B
Atkins RF Floyd RF
Spillborghs RF DeRosa 2B
Iannetta C Hill C
Carroll 2B Pie CF
Lopez P Lilly P
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Comments

Fonty at shortstop? Is there anything Godenot can't do?

Gameday shows Jones as being a reserve for the Cubs in tonight's game.

So Jones is about gone huh?

I like how the purge continues. Dumb baseball players don't last long on Lou's teams huh?

Pie had better start hitting soon or his chances of getting in the lineup will be just about nil.

Tonight’s game is a giveaway night…

Majestic® Michael Barrett
2007 home jersey
100 random winners*

Think they got a few extras?

I know Pie has been scuffling but does he have to hit behind Koyie Hill?

That's true, that is a bit hurtful. The fact that they are both int he same lineup is a bit scary. Talk about offensive black hole: Hill, Pie, Lily.

rosenthall calling the deal off..

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/6964484

Probably for the best. Jones can hopefully be traded for more closer to the deadline. Maybe he'll even get a few starts before then.

Jacque Jones deal with Florida is officially dead, and for good, per Dave Kaplan. It came down to $$. Both teams didn't believe the Commissioner would approve the deal on the table. The lowest $$ total the Marlins were willing to accept was $2 million so long as the Cubs also include a "well graded prospect."

It appears the Cubs are stuck with Jacque Jones. If the Commissioner is unwilling to approve a deal involving a few million dollars, then the only way the Cubs get rid of Jones is if they offer only $1 million and sweeten the pot with a top-shelf prospect. That being the case, Hendry is better DFAing Jock. But the Tribune Company will never in a million years do that. So either Jock rots on the bench, or perhaps Sweet Lou inserts him into right field and we cross our fingers he gets hotter than shit and helps this ballclub win ballgames.

3-0 Cubs, on Ramirez's double and Floyd leaving the yard.

bases loaded, 0 out colorado...ive seen this movie before. it sucks. let's slash the seats.

I thought JJ was such a great deal based on his contract? Now we are willing to dump him for a low A pitcher and pay 95% of his salary over the next 2 years? Woo!!! Go Hendry!!!!!

Good to see the manny spin machine is still running at peak performance.

Wes:
"Good to see the manny spin machine is still running at peak performance."

What spin? Should I say "GOOD JOB!!" to Hendry for dumping another player? When will you guys finally get off Hendry's jock?

The Marlins wanted to get on Hendry's Jacque.

Manny complaining about a move the Hendry has not yet even made is about as SHOCKING as Silent Towel now using the term "Jock Strap" to describe the player he previously called the Cubs best RFer since Dawson.

I'm not on his jock. I think he's made mistakes. That's not what I'm saying.

But, unlike you, I don't think every move he makes is the most retarded, simpleton move in baseball history.

If I recall every transaction in the last two years, you not only A) hated it, but B) blamed it solely on Hendry and no one else.

Fontenot remains red hot with a double to drive in Soriano (2 for 2, SB, 2 runs scored). 4-1 Cubs.

Manny - everyone knows that you do not like Hendry, but i think you are being a little tough on him this time. Jones was not a terrible signing, given the money involved, and he had a decent year last year, but look at his numbers this year and there just isn't going to be that much of a market for him. You can't blame hendry for signing a guy and then that guy playing way below his career numbers. It amazes me that someone who gave Dusty so much praise can be so hard on Hendry.

Newport:
"The Marlins wanted to get on Hendry’s Jacque."

That was a good one....Kudos!!!

Lilly not exactly sharp. At this rate, he won't go through 6. Come on Ted, throw strikes.

Wes:
If I recall every transaction in the last two years, you not only A) hated it, but B) blamed it solely on Hendry and no one else."

Well now I understand. You don't recall properly...cool.

Someguy:
"It amazes me that someone who gave Dusty so much praise can be so hard on Hendry."

It amazes me how so many Cubs fans can continue to give a free pass to Hendry after all the money he has been given and nothing to show for it. Teflon Jim!!

broken records are cool, broken records are cool, broken r........

Manny,

You just have a great rest of your day. How's that sound?

Lilly is all over the place -- 5 walks in 4 innings, gives up a 2-run double to a .186 hitter -- his ERA is now over 4.00. Will it ever go back into the threes? Seems unlikely.

Mr. Petrick! Paging Mr. Petrick!

Wes:
"You just have a great rest of your day. How’s that sound?"

If the Cubs win, it will be a great rest of the day...GO CUBS!!!

billybucks: "Lilly is all over the place — 5 walks in 4 innings, gives up a 2-run double to a .186 hitter — his ERA is now over 4.00. Will it ever go back into the threes? Seems unlikely."

At 3.98 after five innings.

Koyie rains down destruction and carnage upon the Rockies with 2-out 2-run double. 7-3.

Miami radio reporting the Marlins backed out of the Jacque Jones trade because they thought they were getting country singer George Jones to play the outfield. When they found out they were getting Jacque, they backed out.

Suttcliffe is so tanked.

If Dempster is out until the ASB, you gotta call up another reliever as soon as Jock or Izzy get dumped. Piggy may yet get his chance.

Here we go again.

That's not unusual for the Red Baron during broadcasts - if I remember correctly, he was caught slurring his words during an ESPN game last year, I think the Dodgers were playing at the time.

That's not unusual for the Red Baron during broadcasts - if I remember correctly, he was caught slurring his words during an ESPN game last year, I think the Dodgers were playing at the time.

Another nice win -- good all-around game.

If D-Lee ever finds his power stroke (last HR was June 3rd), this could get very interesting.

Soriano, Fontenot, Lee, Ramirez, Floyd, Derosa, __, __ is a hell of a lineup.

Fontenot, DLee, Soriano, ARAM, DeRosa should be the first five until DLee can figure out how to hit for power again. Maybe the wrist injury took away some of his power, who knows? His .450 OBP is pretty solid at the top of the lineup. Maybe Soriano's solo shots turn into 2/3R HRs?

Sorry, Floyd then DeRosa.

Fontenot
DLee
Soriano
ARam
Floyd
DeRosa
Whoever
Not JJ
Pitcher

I respectfully disagree, Jordan. They've won their last 5 games. I say don't change a thing. =)

Haha, well, I guess that's as valid a point as my lineup, so there you go. Why change things if they are winning and scoring a lot of runs.

But I do think you could tweak things a bit more optimally with DLee's lack of power and Soriano cranking balls outta the yard. Fontenot and Lee's OBP at the top of the order is no laughing matter.

Good to see Floyd flash some power. We need that. I also feel like Koyie Hill is hitting better than Bowen. Maybe we let the kid play a bit and see where it leads. Any idea from watching the games which one calls a better game?

Dmac, are you thinking of that game in San Diego when Sutcliffe was totally blitzed in the booth?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12745300/

Jordan: I don't think either are known for providing a lot of offense and I would loathe counting on either for a bunch of RBIs.

I don't have much basis for this, but my gut feeling is Bowen calls a slightly better game and does a pretty decent job blocking pitches. I see Bowen as a sufficient replacement for Blanco. Blanco always had a canon, but we haven't seen Bowen try to throw a runner out yet, so the jury is still out for me on his throwing abilities.

Koyie Hill has been passable defensively. Wuertz was charged with a wild pitch tonight, but it very easily could have been a passed ball charged to Koyie. Could have gone either way.

Any idea from watching the games which one calls a better game?
________________________________________________

Since that's next to impossible to judge, no.

I know this is going to ruffle some feathers. But wouldnt it seem to be a prudent move on Hendry's part to Keep Jack Jones for the time being? Our franchise saving Cfer is hitting .227 right now. As Gawdawful as Jack has been this year. He still hasnt been THAT bad? Lou is the Larry Brown of baseball. He is going to want everyone run out of town eventually. It deflects all criticism for his failures.

Vulva!

Our franchise saving Cfer is hitting .227 right now. As Gawdawful as Jack has been this year. He still hasnt been THAT bad?

Lets see...

JJ: .234/.295/.328
Pie: .227/.281/.367

It looks like offensively they have been equally bad. And being that Pie is the superior fielder and base runner, I would rather see Pie than JJ.

Our franchise saving Cfer is hitting .227 right now. As Gawdawful as Jack has been this year. He still hasnt been THAT bad?
------------------------------------

Jacque is hitting .234. They have 2 HRs each, and Jones has 2 more RBI in 20 more games. FWIW.

Anyone else notice that pie has a serious slice to his swing? With as much back swing as he has, you think he would be able to hit the ball a little more squarely. Instead he gets a ton of back spin on the balls he hits. I wonder if it is taking away from some of his line drive power.

The Cubs are sneaking into the WC hunt. 6 games out, 6th place, but two seriously flawed teams in 4th and 5th. Hopefully something to keep an eye on if they can keep the good play going. A sweep over the Brewers would be even better.

Michael Barrett just threw out Dave Roberts trying to steal to end the SD/SF game. Amazing- I don't even remember him doing that to end a Cubs game.

i cannot, for the life of me, understand why people keep on saying that we should move soriano. we signed him as a leadoff hitter, he likes to bat lead off. He had a rough start while in center. he goes back to left and catches fire. why are you guys advocating that Lou fucks with that? don't you know you don't fuck with a streak? oh wait that stuff doesn't exist at the TCR.

Why do you insist on the strawmen Chad? There is not one single person at TCR who has ever said streaks don't exist that I've ever read.

Trade Pie, Keep Jones!!!

just kidding...

though t's been about 2.5 weeks since Pie's had a multi-hit game. He's gone from 288/318/463 to 227/280/364

Careful Rob, you are coming dangerously close to the first TCR negative Pie post. ;)

I know you're jokin, however, if trends continue I think that we should start a pool to name the date of the first Pie suck and Cedeno unsuck posts. (.385 at Iowa)

Sam Fuld is coming...

Johann, I don't think that people do not believe in hot streaks. I was making that point that a hot streak is something that actually can't be proven with stats. What I mean by that is that when a player comes to bat with a .300 batting average who is a career .300 batting average but is 9 for his last 10, no number would suggest that his odds for getting a hit are any better than .300. However we know that he's 'hot' and the odds of him getting a hit are probably higher. As far as math goes, you cannot predict when a hot streak will start or end. These are things that make statheads mad. Like, chemistry and clutch.

Furthermore, forget whether or not streaks exist. people are still ignoring how well Soriano is playing and still insist that he moves down the order. Not smart.

Difference between Lou and Dusty: Lou's not afraid to make a mistake. Think about some the stuff he's done-Soriano in center, dumping Barrett, dumping Jones, putting Fontentot at shortstop, closing with Howry and Dempster. Lou is more like Zimmer than any other manager I can remember. He experiments..

Mistake? Dumping barrett and jones was risky? Closing with Howry and Demptser, his best options, was a risk? Even Soriano in center wasn't that much of a risk, although it didn't work out. I just don't get your post.

I might be wrong, but I think the point he was driving at was that Dusty and Lou have two distinctively different styles. For example, you never heard Michael Barrett saying it's "uncomfortable" working for Dusty Baker.

I was making that point that a hot streak is something that actually can’t be proven with stats.

Hmmm... this might be interesting, except you can then say this:

What I mean by that is that when a player comes to bat with a .300 batting average who is a career .300 batting average but is 9 for his last 10

You just showed, using stats (or at least numbers) that this player is on a hot streak.

I love how a month ago we found out that Lou was the reason JJ wasn't traded in the off-season, but now Lou is the reason that JJ is going to be traded, because he won't put up with those types of players.

Maybe JJ is going to be traded because he just plain sucks right now, and it has little to do with Lou?

Johann, I don’t think that people do not believe in hot streaks. I was making that point that a hot streak is something that actually can’t be proven with stats.

Sure it can. You can conduct tests to see if hits and/or outs are clustered more than one would expect by random chance.

What I mean by that is that when a player comes to bat with a .300 batting average who is a career .300 batting average but is 9 for his last 10, no number would suggest that his odds for getting a hit are any better than .300. However we know that he’s ‘hot’ and the odds of him getting a hit are probably higher.

This hypothesis is eminently testable.

champsummers:
Careful Rob, you are coming dangerously close to the first TCR negative Pie post. ;)

I know this post was in jest, but I haven't been much a Pie fan since ST '06. His swing is atrocious. It didn't take major league scouts long to figure out that long swing is hard to stop after you start it... and Pie has paid the price against major-league breaking balls. Once he starts picking up the ball better out of the pitcher's delivery he'll bust out of the slump, but he'll always be a flashy, strikes-out-a-lot type unless he finds a better swing.

I cut him some slack, though, because his defensive game is amazing, and defense is a huge deal in this fan's opinion.

News to me... from the Sun-Times article about the Jones deal that fell through...

The commissioner's office, which was not happy with the Cubs' huge offseason spending, might have played a role. All cash exchanges exceeding $1 million must be approved by the commissioner.

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/...

This is completely off topic, but any Fantasy experts want to weigh in on this for me?

I've been offered Chipper Jones, Carlos Ruiz, and Jorge Sosa for Michael Barrett, Dmitri Young, and my 2nd round pick next season. Would you take that? I've got Edwin Encarnacion at 3B right now. I can probably cut the draft pick out of the trade or at least drop it to a 4th/5th round pick.

Chad, I do believe that Soriano has hitter better since moving to left, but I'm not sure there are a bunch of stats to prove the leadoff thing all that clearly. I do believe players can be on a streak and be considered 'hot,' purely in baseball terms :)

Your argument that it will screw up the guys head is a difficult one to prove. I see your point, but I also lean toward a strong desire to have guys on base when Soriano decides to go yard. It simply scores more runs, which is the entire point.

dave — June 26, 2007 @ 10:10 pm
Our franchise saving Cfer is hitting .227 right now. As Gawdawful as Jack has been this year. He still hasnt been THAT bad?

Lets see…

JJ: .234/.295/.328
Pie: .227/.281/.367

It looks like offensively they have been equally bad. And being that Pie is the superior fielder and base runner, I would rather see Pie than JJ.
........................................................................

I agree Dave except for this. Jack Jones has shown he can hit ML pitching as late as last season. Felix Pie has yet to show that he can period. I am all for giving him time to prove himself at the major league level. But it seems like a good idea to keep a proven vet around in the event that Pie DOESNT prove able to hit at the ML level. Defense and flashyness aside. You are still going to have to hit to play at the ML level.

"What I mean by that is that when a player comes to bat with a .300 batting average who is a career .300 batting average but is 9 for his last 10, no number would suggest that his odds for getting a hit are any better than .300. However we know that he’s ‘hot’ and the odds of him getting a hit are probably higher.

This hypothesis is eminently testable."

I don't have it with me at work to check, but I think that might actually be in "The Book", the baseball stats book put out by that TangoTiger guy. Pretty interesting read, but only in small doses. There are only so many tables of stats you can look at without losing your mind.

I do believe players can be on a streak and be considered ‘hot,’ purely in baseball terms :)

I believe players could just be hot. :)

vorare--

No way are you getting fair value for Dmitri Young; Chipper is banged up and could go on the DL at any time. Plus, you always score fantasy points with Barrett because of his bat at C. I'd walk away from this trade.

Aaron, while the Cubs might not win with Pie in center, I am convident that the aren't going to win with Jones in center.

Thus, I would rather see them continue to play Pie to see if he can adjust to the league.

convident = confident

As long as the Cub's can keep up the inexplicable domination of Bill Hall and take the bat out of Fielder's hands, this could be a fun weekend!

No way are you getting fair value for Dmitri Young; Chipper is banged up and could go on the DL at any time. Plus, you always score fantasy points with Barrett because of his bat at C. I’d walk away from this trade.

Hmmm... not so sure. Barrett's value is much less hitting in a pitcher's park, as well as being backed up by a much better catcher (Bard) than he was with the Cubs. I would guess that Barrett's numbers do not rebound to his previous years' numbers due to playing most of his games in Petco as well as getting less playing time due to having a good backup catcher.

With that said, I still don't think I would make the trade - especially with a 2nd round pick.

The Sun Sentinal reporters have it that it was Zell who nixed the deal:

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/baseball/m...

Robr — June 27, 2007 @ 7:55 am
Aaron, while the Cubs might not win with Pie in center, I am convident that the aren’t going to win with Jones in center.

Thus, I would rather see them continue to play Pie to see if he can adjust to the league.
.......................................................................

I agree that you absolutely give Pie every opportunity to succeed this year. However at what point do you say that he isnt ready and use someone else? It hasnt been as big an issue with Mike Fontenot hitting .400. But with Barrett's bat out of the lineup and Izturis' in the lineup, along with the pitcher. Can the cubs really afford to have 4 weak links in the same lineup?

The Sun Sentinal reporters have it that it was Zell who nixed the deal:

Interesting... Zell is calling the shots? If that is the case, I can't see how it is a god thing for the Cubs. I would think that this makes it EXTREMELY unlikely that the Cubs will be able to add any money.

Observations...

1. Excellent win. Cubs are playing their best baseball of the season.

2. Milwaukee has got their mojo back. With that pitching and an exceptionally gifted young core, they are going to be tough to catch. But the wildcard can be had in my estimation, with Los Angeles and Arizona being the principal competition.

3. Mark DeRosa is a good, hard-nosed ballplayer. He is a professional baseball player and a solid asset on this ballclub. One of the few times where Hendry did something right.

4. Apparently "transitional owner" Sam Zell says no to the cash swap of $6.6 million in the deal to shed Jacque Jones. Guess old Sam never heard of a sunk cost before. Pisses me off that Zell is intefering in this matter, as it won't affect him nor compromise the sale of the franchise to the Canning group. Bastard.

5. Jacque Jones is with the Cubs for the duration. Unless he gets re-inserted into right field and goes on a major, major hot streak. Which is doubtful to occur. And unless the Cubs are willing to send several million in a deal, Jones is for all intents and purposes unmoveable. The only sliver of hope is for Hendry to identify another team with a similar crappy contract that it is anxious to shed. My crap for your crap kind of a deal.

I really hate to see this paragraph in the suntimes:

The Cubs' status on the selling block has reportedly quashed at least one other deal this season. They were close to signing pitcher Carlos Zambrano to a long-term contract around Opening Day when new ownership reportedly decided to table talks until a later date.

But with Barrett’s bat out of the lineup and Izturis’ in the lineup

I am not sure that we are going to see Izzy's bat the lineup that much. If Lou is confident with Godenot (or as Red Eye said this morning, Fontenot of Youth) playing SS, Izzy won't be getting much playing time.

Carlos Zambrano is as good as gone via free agency. It is very doubtful that the MLB owners will have a vote on a new ownership group until next spring at the earliest. Even if an owner gets teed up within the next month or so. It's how the process historically works. What this means is that Jim Hendry will hold onto his job and be a classic lameduck with minimal financial means to do anything next offseason. Except wave bye-bye to veterans whose contracts expire...Crazy Horse Z, Kerry Wood, Mark Prior, Cesar Izturis, Cliff Floyd.

"However at what point do you say that he isnt ready and use someone else?"

In the off season, maybe after next season.

"Can the cubs really afford to have 4 weak links in the same lineup?"

No they can't, but winning streak not with standing, this is not a complete team. Sadly, subbing Jones for Pie doesn't really improve things.

Better to see if Pie can turn into the player the scouts and his minor league numbers say he can be.

Luckily for us. Everyone other than Z will either make the team better when they leave, or will be easily replaceable. With all the backloaded deals. The payroll might stay the same even with all of the subtractions.

Thanks Eric and Dave, that's basically how I was feeling about it.

If Pie has a couple of more weeks like this one, with an average in the low .100s, he has to go back down. It won't do him any good to stay in the majors and get all Corey-ed up.

Cedeno five for five last night with three doubles. He was also in the middle of a triple play.

http://tinyurl.com/39flz8

Prediction: "Transitional owner" Sam Zell rapidly becomes the most despised man among Cub Nation.

tbone — June 27, 2007 @ 8:20 am
If Pie has a couple of more weeks like this one, with an average in the low .100s, he has to go back down. It won’t do him any good to stay in the majors and get all Corey-ed up.
........................................................................

This is how I feel about the situation. You dont have to dump Pie out of the organization if he continues to slump. Send him back to Iowa with a list of things to work on. I just think it is terribly short sighted to dump Jack Jones. Paying 92% of his remaining contract in the process. When it isnt a foregone conclusion that your CF position is secure. Hendry will look like a buffoon if he makes this trade. Then has to turn around and give up 2 prospects for Nook Logan or Darin Erstad.

"According to a high-ranking baseball official with direct knowledge of the talks, they even had a commitment from the Cubs' front office to cover roughly $6.6 million of the $7.2 million remaining on Jones' contract through next season.

The deal collapsed, however, when Sam Zell — who is in the process of purchasing a controlling interest in the Tribune Co., which publishes the Sun-Sentinel and owns the Cubs — vetoed the hefty cash exchange."

I hope this is true, if so, good for Zell... Paying all that money to FL is a joke.

Manny, why?

If the rumors are true, the Cubs were going to get back a front line SP prospect. It's like paying a signing bonus for a draft pick, only you've got two years of professional experience to judge the guy by rather than praying his high school numbers translate.

dave:
"If Lou is confident with Godenot (or as Red Eye said this morning, Fontenot of Youth) playing SS, Izzy won’t be getting much playing time."

Theriot, Pagan, Murton and Pie were hot at some point when they got called up or got their chance to start almost everyday, but they all slowed down drastically. Let's see if Fontenot is just a flavor of the week, or if he can really sustain it. Unfortunately I think deep down we all know the real answer.

Cubs don't pay those kinds of signing bonuses unless the prospect can play football as well.

If the rumors are true, the Cubs were going to get back a front line SP prospect.

Vorare - the rumors also said the Cubs were also going to be giving a good prospect away.

So basically they were going to swap prospects, and give them Jock, and give them significant money.

In other words, the prospects were probably somewhat of a wash, and then the Cube were going to pay the Marlins to take JJ. I have a hard time with that.

Chad, hot streaks exist. No on can deny players start hitting better in a string of games, followed by a string of games and then will also have a slump at some point. No one tries to deny that. You really do not understand how stats work.

I'm not even sure why I'm trying to do this, but here's an explanation for them: They aren't a magical entity that grow legs and play baseball. They are a way to measure what's happening on the field. Stats don't negate streaks, players likes and dislikes, team chemistry or anything else. Rather, with stats you can measure whether many of those exist.

You already gave a pretty clear example of how to measure hot streaks. Do streaks exist in general? You can measure that by looking how players hit. When you go through games, do players go through multiple games where they heat above the mean? Do they then go through multiple games where they hit below the mean?

I'd say certain players are far more streaky then others. I'd also go even further and say it's related to patience. Patient hitters, even if they lose their swing for a couple games, will still get on base. Patience isn't lost. If free swingers, on the other hand, go through periods where they aren't seeing the ball as well they aren't going to get on base at all because they're just going to swing anyway.

This is my hypothesis, and it can be tested. We know who the patient players are and who the free swingers are. We could look at stats and compare streaks of hot games and cold games between the two.

Another example where you can test with stats is clutch. To test whether such a thing as a clutch player exists, you figure out whether certain players consistently hit above their mean in pressure situations, such as with people on base and late and close. There are stats for all these situations. Consistently hitting above the mean is important, because good hitters hit well no matter what, so then you have to look whether they do even better on a consistent basis (not just part of a season) in pressure situations.

So, while I doubt this will do any good, I will again repeat: the stat movement doesn't inherently negate any of the time honored truisms of baseball, it says we should test them to see whether they actually are true. Some of the time honored truisms hold up, some don't, but either it helps us get a truer view of baseball then we had before.

Fontenot is absolutely going to cool down. We all know he wont be a 400 hitter. Yet he would have to burrow into the polar icecaps wearing speedos and carrying an industrial fan before he sinks to Izturis' level of batting ineptitude.

Hot streaks happen in life. All of us should be able to relate to this fact. When you have a girlfriend you always seem to meet girls whenever you go out without her. Yet when you are single. Sometimes it seems like you can go weeks without meeting a decent girl when you go out.

Theriot, Pagan, Murton and Pie were hot at some point when they got called up or got their chance to start almost everyday, but they all slowed down drastically.

Not quite... I will give you Theriot. Pie was never really hot - he only had a small handful of good games. Pagan is still hitting the ball quite well. And Murton absolutely did not slow down when he was given the change to play everyday. He slowed down when his playing time was drastically cut.

I think the deal was the high level prospect and a couple million plus Jones for what looks like Taylor. I think the $6.6 million in cash+Jones for Taylor is what got squashed. At least that Sun-Sentinel report says nothing about another player.

Well congratulations Tribco/Zell, even when you try to win you fuck it up somewhow.

PUT IN PERSPECTIVE:

In looking at what the team has done, relative to last year, the '06 team was 20 games UNDER .500 at the break @ 34-54 W/L

http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CHC/2...

Hey Uncle Lou,

See what happens when you use your LOOGY in the correct situation? He comes in and gets one of the best LH hitters in the last decade to hit a weak infield pop.

Not Holliday. Not Tulowitzki. Just Helton.

Are we learning something?

E-Man,

Its not too late for us to start our nose-dive :)

If the Cubs just release Jacque Jones and he gets signed by somebody to a one-year deal for the pro-rated portion of the MLB minimum in 2007 (about $210K at this point), and then signs another one-year deal with somebody else in 2008 for the MLB minimum (which is $390K next seeson), the Cubs would be on the hook for the balance of JJ's contract this year and next (which would cost the Cubs about $6.6M, and would save them about $600K over the next year-and-a-half), which is exactly what they would have saved if they made the (supposed) proposed deal with the Marlins.

So why bother exchanging middling prospects with the Fish? (And that part made no sense, BTW). The Cubs can just release Jones, and if they do, it will cost them exactly what it would have cost them if they had made the trade, and they would still save $600K, the same amount they would have saved if they had made the deal. And then Sam Zell and Bud Selig can't do anything to stop it.

Mike Fontenot is not the answer at shortstop, just like Ryan Theriot is not the answer at this most critical of defensive positions on the field. The only true shortstop on the roster is Cesar Izturis. Either the Cubs go out and acquire a legitimate shortstop, or they hope and pray Izturis gets his offensive game going to a sufficient degree. Sweet Lou knows he is playing with fire by putting Fontenot and Theriot at shortstop. It's okay as a stopgap measure, but it can't be depended upon as solution for the remainder of the season if the Cubs legitimately consider themselves playoff contenders.

If the cubs are dead set on dumping Jones. It would seem like some suitor will come out of the woodwork closer to the deadline. I don't see the downside in holding on to Jack Jones. Then evaluating if Felix Pie is able to hit at this point at that time. If Felix is still hitting .220 at the deadline. You had better think long and hard before dumping Jack Jones.

(This is a little redundant with what AZ Phil just said, but so what, I wrote it already.)

Whether the Jones trade went through or not was of minimal importance since the Cubs were continuing to pay his salary and getting next to nothing in return. They can DFA him for the same deal.

More significant was the "mea culpa" that the trade represented: Hendry admitting publicly for the first time that he owed $9 million (or whatever the sum) to a player that no other team in the majors wanted to pay a couple of million and give a roster spot to through 2008.

Confession is good for the soul, and I think Hendry has had twenty things go well this season and can survive the humiliation of eating Jones's contract. The important thing is to get it over with and free up the roster spot.

Trading him for another contract-encumbered player accomplishes nothing because it doesn't free up a spot. Roster spots on the Cubs today are valuable, which by the way is a credit to Hendry. There is at least one young ML-calibre player (and maybe three or four) at Iowa who want Jones's spot.

I don't know if the Cubs are allowed to park Jones in the minors until July 2008--when he could conceivably become tradeable--or not. Rob or AZ Phil will know. There's actually no room for him at Iowa, where Murton, Kroeger and Coats are better than Jones, besides having arrows next to their names that point UP. He could find a spot at Tennessee, maybe. Otherwise, just send him home to play golf at his country club.

Really I think that Aramis Ramirez isnt a legitimate Glove man at 3rd either. Lets see if we can get Jeff Cirillo here from Minnesota to tighten up that 3rd base defense.

It is anathema for the Cub organization to release a ballplayer with a decent chunk of money on his contract. Jim Hendry would rather be distracted for weeks and work 24/7 trying to move Jacque Jones. It is but one symptom of what is wrong with Cub ownership and the front office. Sam Zell pisses me off for getting involved in this. The billionaire venture capitalist IS GOING TO GET HIS MONEY as he buys and then spins off the myriad business units under the Tribune Company umbrella. The prick ought to leave well enough alone when it comes to the Cubs.

My crap for your crap kind of a deal.
------
If he could dump Todd Hundley in a my crap for your crap trade, there is always hope...

I wonder if there is a right handed pinch hitter in the crapper who might qualify for that role

I suspect the McDougal for JJones rumor was exactly what this category is defined as.

VA Phil:
"I think Hendry has had twenty things go well this season and can survive the humiliation of eating Jones’s contract."

Really?? Add that to dumping Barrett, Sosa, releasing Rusch, etc. If this team does not make the playoffs I can't see hoe he "survives" the offseason.

it would be ironic indeed if Murton lost at bats in Iowa to JJones

carmenfanzone — June 27, 2007 @ 12:18 am
Sam Fuld is coming…

===========================

CARMEN F: Even though this is only his third season in pro ball (Peoria in '05, Daytona in '06, and Tennessee in '07), Sam Fuld is an advanced player who could be an MLB 4th OF right now.

So if the Cubs decide at some point to send Felix Pie back to AAA for ten days to work on his hitting, or jettison Angel Pagan due to excessive brain farts, Sam Fuld is the one who could replace either of them.

Fuld has no HR power, but he is a plus-defender with above-average speed and an above-average arm, he is an excellent base-runner, he has outstanding command of the strike zone, he rarely strikes out, and (like Theriot and Fontenot) he hustles his ass off. And he has a high baseball IQ.

And just think. After the Jack Jones dump we only have 1 more multiyear dreg and a dreg in the final year of his contract. Scott Eyre, come on down. Cesar Izturis, Your on deck.

Aramis Ramirez is not a good third baseman. He is merely tolerable. He does a nice job fielding balls hit directly at him, and his throwing is pinpoint and consistent. But he has virtually zero range to his left or to his right. Given his bat, that's okay. But it make it all the more important to have a quality defensive shortstop out on the field.

Rich Hill isn't a gold glover pitching either. He needs to be quickly traded for someone better.

VA Phil:
“I think Hendry has had twenty things go well this season and can survive the humiliation of eating Jones’s contract.”

Manny:
Really??

Well... not sure about 20 things, but I just love how you point out all the bad, and none of the good. Since you want to point out Barrett, Sosa, Rusch, and Jones, I will point out the following:

A-Ram
D-Lee
Soriano
Lilly
Marquis
DeRosa
Not trading Hill
Dempster - and the foresight to see him as a closer

I could go on...

I disagree 100% that Jacque Jones will be more moveable as the trade deadline inches closer. Unless Hendry gets permission to include $4 million (or more) in a trade deal, he isn't going to find takers for Jones. Left-handed hitting outfielders of Jacque Jones are a dime a dozen commodity in late July terms. If somebody really craves a Jones type, then they can make a cheaper and wiser bid for a Reggie Sanders who is on the last year of his contract with Kansas City.

The Florida deal was Hendry's best chance to move Jones. The only option now is to DFA him. And that will NEVER happen.

Its a little premature to praise the Marquis/Lilly/Soriano deals just yet. Jack Jones was a terrific bargain last year. Now he is the duece sandwich that Hendry is about to publicly eat.

ST- I hope Fontenot his .320 and sticks it right up your ass this season.

I am really sick of your negativity, and BS attitude.
I hope that I am not alone.
Try some Lexipro, or maybe some Xanax....

FWIW, somebody above was hinting that Selig's office may have gotten in the way yesterday. Some dude from CBS Sportsline agrees:

"...the Cubs were set to pay roughly 97% of Jones' remaining salary but the deal unraveled at the Commissioner's Office. It seems that the Cubs couldn't get approval there because of their impending sale."

http://cbs.sportsline.com/mlb/story/10237921/rss

Jones is the same player he was last season, but on a team Floyd he has limited usefulness.

A guy that can play Center and has 25 HR power has value in MLB. Someone gets hurt and a club panics. It happens every year. Jack Jones is Michael Tucker circa 2001. Cubs sent 2 legit prospects to Cincy for him and his 2 years remaining on his contract. No reason to believe it won't happen again.

"Dmac, are you thinking of that game in San Diego when Sutcliffe was totally blitzed in the booth?"

Yes I was - thank you for reminding me of that hilarious performance.

God I can't write today.

, but on a team that also has Floyd [Jones] has limited usefulness.

Aramis Ramirez is not a good third baseman. He is merely tolerable. ...

Hmmm... lets see. Inconvenient facts, again:

A-Ram is ranked (in the NL) ...
2nd in fielding %
3rd in range factor
4th in zone rating

But you are right - just tolerable.

Virginia Phil — June 27, 2007 @ 9:14 am
I don’t know if the Cubs are allowed to park Jones in the minors until July 2008–when he could conceivably become tradeable–or not. Rob or AZ Phil will know. There’s actually no room for him at Iowa, where Murton, Kroeger and Coats are better than Jones, besides having arrows next to their names that point UP. He could find a spot at Tennessee, maybe. Otherwise, just send him home to play golf at his country club.

=================================

VA PHIL: Good morning, cousin!

The only way the Cubs can send Jones to Iowa is if Jones approves the move (players with at least three years of MLB service time can refuse an outright assignment to the minors, and players with at least five years of MLB ST can refuse an optional asignment), and I just can't see JJ accepting a demotion to AAA.

In case you're wondering if the Cubs can try to outright Jones, and if he refuses the assignment, he terminates his contract, it doesn't work that way. Jones has to give his pemission to even be placed on Outright Waivers in the first place.

And since he isn't going to make any less money if the Cubs just release him, why would he accept a AAA assignment when he has a right of refusal?

Jones is the same player he was last season

He is?

Jones, 2006, thru 6/27/06: .295/.325/.510 - OPS: .836 13 HR, 36 RBI, 18.54 AB/HR

Jones, 2007, thru 6/27/07: .234/.295/.328 - OPS: .624 2 HR, 20 RBI, 100.5 AB/HR.

I am pretty sure that Jacque Jones is nowhere close to the player that he was last year.

Dave - sample size.

Jones is a life time 278/326/455 hitter. So just as his 285/334/499 last season could reasonably have been expected to regress, his 234/295/328 line this season will likely improve.

exactly. Jones overachieved last year. He has underachieved this year. Even if he rebounds to a closer to career line in the 265/320/450 range. That is still SIGNIFICANTLY more productive than Felix Pie has proven to provide. This Jack Jones trade falling apart may turn into a blessing in disguise.

Lets hope the White Sox sign Mark Buerhle. Otherwise he is going to be pitching for his beloved hometown St. Louis Cardinals next season.

P.S. Dusty, you can pound sand up your ass. Did I wish ill-will on Mike Fontenot? No. What I did say is that he is not a major league shortstop. Reading is fundamental.

Off-topic:

Man in New Carlisle (near South Bend) builds miniature Wrigley replica in backyard for his whiffleball team.

http://heraldargus.com/hanews/archives/ha/dis...

Reggie Sanders is right handed.

Dave - sample size.

Yes... I understand sample size. But he does have 200 at-bats this year. That is not a small sample size.

And lets look at trends. His career numbers may be decent, but look at the last couple of years.
2004: .254/.315/.427 OPS - .742
2005: .249/.319/.438 OPS - .757
2006: .285/.334/.499 OPS - .833
2007: .234/.295/.328 OPS - .624

While 2007 is far below both any of his other numbers, 2006 was a clear outlier.

Don't get me wrong - I have been one of JJ's biggest supporters around here. I believe that he is wrongly scapegoated. I believe his defense is very much underrated. And I believe that he had a great year and was an incredible value last year.

But he has not looked anywhere close to the player he was last year. And it is seeming more and more likely that 2006 was an just an exception to an ugly downward trend.

Jacos, the POINT is that Jacque Jones is a dime a dozen commodity, and not some covetous type difference-maker that teams will be lining up to acquire as July 31st approaches. Unless Hendry is permitted to include a big check, Jones is unmoveable.

"That is still SIGNIFICANTLY more productive than Felix Pie has proven to provide."

Certainly if we ignore defense, and assume that 132 ABs have proven what kind of hitter Pie is.

Dusty, you can pound sand up your ass.

Since when are personal attacks like this allowed? This is getting really, really old from the not so Silent Towel.

I don't know about Jones rebounding. His struggles this year look a lot more like fading talent than a typical "slump." His bat seems slower, his contact is weaker, and his attempts to rehab his arm don't seem to have helped his throwing. I think you really have to wonder if the labrum injury has actually gotten worse to the point that it's hurting his swing.

I agree with you Dave. Jacque Jones was signed to a quite reasonable contract and delivered nicely in 2006. And he is a good outfielder in right, if you exclude his rag arm from the equation. But for whatever reason Cub fans turned on him last year and the connection with Dusty was an important one for him. This season he has been woefully lost at the plate, to the point where pitchers don't even throw him waste pitches. Given the choice, I'd rather have Cornelius Clifford Floyd in combination with Mark DeRosa in right field. Jones needs to go for the betterment of the team and himself.

"But he has not looked anywhere close to the player he was last year. And it is seeming more and more likely that 2006 was an just an exception to an ugly downward trend."

I guess I wasn't clear. I didn't mean to imply that Jones could be expected to put up numbers like he did last season. By saying he is the same player, I meant to imply that he can be expected to put unders closer to his career norms.

I don't act like I know hitting, because I don't.

But from my POV, it seems that Felix knows that Felix can't hit a breaking ball. So Felix sits on the breaking ball. Doesn't help Felix hit the breaking ball any, though. Still swings over the top an awful lot. All it does it make him late on every fastball he gets.

The prick ought to leave well enough alone when it comes to the Cubs.

So, Dempster is out until at least July 7th... We still need a 12th pitcher... Who's it gonna be? Piggy? Or does this little delay make Rapada available again?

I hadn't seen any word on a corresponding 40 man roster move, but it looks like Wade Miller got moved to the 60 day DL so that Petrick could get called up.

As soon as JJ gets traded (and I would be shocked if he doesn't), I would expect to see Piggy, Cotts, or Gallagher to come up.

132 at bats probably (hopefully) to show what kind of hitter Pie can become. But at his point it is enough to show what kind of hitter he currently is. I am not one of those Ronny Cedeno sucks because I said so people. I think that when all is equal, you play the younger/cheaper player. I just think it seems funny that Felix Pie can hit .220 and get a complete pass. Yet Matt Murton drops a fly ball and goes 3 games without a hit and he is the worst player ever to don cubbie blue. Bottom line is that you play to win the games. Personal axe grinding some people seem to have aside. You are not going to consistently win if you play a SS,C,Cf,Pitcher every day that hit less than .250 and bring 0 power to the plate. I dont care if they are Ozzie Smith and Brooks Robinson's love child on Defense.

Dave- in ST's defense, I fired a shot earlier.

Pie is better defensively in CF than Jones.
He is getting better. Jones is what he is: a stopgap veteran. If they keep Jones as insurance, fine. Unless Pie hits .170 the rest of the way, and Floyd and Pagan both get hurt, he should see only enough PT tokeep him fairly sharp.

dave:
"Well… not sure about 20 things, but I just love how you point out all the bad, and none of the good."

If the good outweighed the bad, I would point that out more. But do I really need to show you the record of hendry as a GM??

Dave- in ST’s defense, I fired a shot earlier.

Ah yes... you did. I am just so used to ST's unprovoked personal attacks that I missed your first shot. Which was also unnecessary. :)

dave:
"And lets look at trends. His career numbers may be decent, but look at the last couple of years."

Very good point...I was making the same point this offseason with Rob G. about him drooling over Marcus Giles. I said he was declining and so far this year he is still on the decline:

2003: .316/.390/.526
2004: .311/.378/.443
2005: .291/.365/.461
2006: .262/.341/.387
2007: .258/.335/.357

I don't think it takes a genius to see that his career is seriously in decline and to stay away.

If the good outweighed the bad, I would point that out more. But do I really need to show you the record of hendry as a GM??

No manny... but you know full well that Hendry has made both good and bad moves. I do not pretend that he has been perfect. Nor do I pretend that he is a great GM.

To only point out the bad, and to do so over and over and over and over again, is intellectually dishonest.

Manny... how is Marcus Giles relevant to this conversation, other than to say that Rob G was wrong once?

dave:
"you know full well that Hendry has made both good and bad moves."

Yes he has... But IMO he has made more bad ones than good ones (thus a horrible record as a GM). Trading for ARAM and Lee and Nomar were very good deals, outstanding ones. Signing Soriano was a pleasant surprise considering he had never signed a top tier FA before, but the deal is long from done (many on TCR kept saying how great of a deal JJ contract was, and now we are literally tring to give him away). He absolutely has done good before, and will likely even make good deals in the future, but overall I have very little confidence in him to build a perennially top tier major league squad with a good minor league system, even though he has and will continue to be given more than enough money to do so.

Wow, Manny. Nice completely unprovoked slam on Rob.

dave:
"Manny… how is Marcus Giles relevant to this conversation,"

Very relevant. I was giving another example to support your theory that one should look at recent years and if a decline is happening it is very reasonable to believe it will continue.

I was giving another example to support your theory that one should look at recent years ...

I didn't give a theory manny. I simply pointed out that I was not confident that JJ would come anywhere close to last year's numbers. Which is difficult for me, because I have been a JJ fan.

In turn, you used it to attack Rob.

Fun times, around TCR...

Aaron, Matt Murton is a "no-tool" player whose seemingly only quality is the ability to work the count. Felix Pie on the other hand is a true 4-tool player and a deeply gifted athlete. Comparing the two is ridiculous. Murton will be fortunate to eek out a couple year existence in the big leagues, while Pie has the "potential" to be a productive 15 year player in this league. And he has the ceiling to possibly become a star.

Comparing the two is ridiculous.

As soon as Pie puts together a half of a season with these numbers, let us know: .319/.390/.522 OPS - .911

Shoot... if Pie EVER puts up an OPS over 900 in a half of a season, let us know.

I think no tool is a bit of a reach. He has shown the ability to hit for average and the ability to get on base. Prior to this year, he's hit 303 with a 370 OBP in nearly 600 big league at-bats.

While those aren't ideal components (power, great defense) in today's game for a corner outfielder, they are still tools. Please, at least get it correct.

That, is, of course, if you even know what the 5 tools are.

Let me chime in on Jim Hendry and then shut up (imagine that) for awhile. If handing out grades, then I'd give Hendry a D minus over his tenure as GM.

1. He has operated under an ill-conceived strategy for winning, and he has changed that strategy at the drop of a hat. Example is the shift from long ball to focus on small ball in 2006 (e.g., Juan Pierre).
2. Beyond the salary dump move to acquire Derrek Lee and Aramis Ramirez and the salary swap move to shed Todd Hundley, he hasn't been able to pull off "accretive" trades when the table stakes are roughly equal.
3. His farm system has been, for the most part, a disappointment. Keep in mind he has had a hand in that cookie jar for nearly a decade.
4. He suffers from an acute case of denial and short-sightedness (e.g., Kerry Wood, Mark Prior, Michael Barrett, Neifi Perez)
5. He has had a dubious track record in free agency, despite having envious financial resources at his disposal. Sadly, Hendry has used free agency as a tool of desperation in the midst of all else failing.

Bottom line. Jim Hendry is terrible. He's done some good things, but his mistakes and misguided actions far outweigh any positive. He is an anchor.

In defense of my defense of Jim Hendry, dave provided a list of free-agent acquisitions that have panned out this year.

I would add the following promoted players in their first full season:

Pie
Theriot
Fontenot
(Rich) Hill
Marshall
Marmol

Pie and Theriot have been scuffling lately but they're both dynamic players that the fans love.

I would also cite the free-agent signings of three players--Koyie Hill, Geoff Jones, Josh Kroeger--who have had career years in the minors and who seem to have a future. Nice work by JH's scouts.

I'm very impressed by what Iowa has done and continues to do at the plate this year. They went into a little tailspin when they lost Pie, Hill and Fontenot but now they seem to have righted themselves and are back scoring double-digit runs a couple of times a week. With Sean Gallagher in the rotation, they look like a good bet to have the best record in the PCL this year. The PCL is the AAA home of half the teams in the ML, so it's a real accomplishment by the Cubs organization.

I would also cite Hendry's signing of Piniella.

Also of Tim Wilken the year before. Wilken has been criticized in TCR recently because of the poor start of the Boise team, but that team is still without Vitters, Donaldson and Barney. And it's just the first week.

Last year the Cubs didn't have many early-round picks and the only one I recall Wilken bragging on was Tyler Colvin, who has been golden.

Murton is indeed a no-tool player. No power, no speed, no defense, no arm. Before NL pitchers established a book on him, he was able to hit for a nice average while contributing little else. Whoopie. A player whose sole skill set is an ability (we think) to "work the count" doesn't have a major league future. Matt Murton is Dustan Mohr, only without the glove and an ability to play across the outfield. And Mohr is already out of baseball after a piecemeal major league existence with a handful of teams for a couple of years.

Thank you Arizona Phil for answering my Micah Hoffpauir question yesterday.

Dustan Mohr is with the D-Rays.

Viva Dustan Mohr!!! He still has gainful major league employment and has delayed starting a career selling Lady Kenmores at the local Sears. Matt Murton will be lucky to emulate the career path of Mohr. He might want to cut to the chase and grab an application form next time he goes to Sears for new underwear.

Comming into this year Murton had a .303 career average .370 obp and 20 Homers in 595 career at bats. Name me 15 left fielders that put up better numbers than that last season? He has limitations in his game just as 95% of the rest of the players do. The thing that is irritating to me is that you want to bang a drum and scream about his limitations. Yet you convieniently gloss over the obvious limitations that Cesar Izturis and Felix Pie display, and act like they do not exist.

There's also the minor detail that Murton's numbers for his first ~600 or so MLB at bats are remarkably close to his ~1000 MiLB at bats, which is usually a good indicator of talent.

Silent Towel is right!

WSCR is saying the Buehrle has resigned with the Sox for 4 years/50 mil.

With Matt Murton it is forever a history lesson on what he did. It's never about his power (has none), run production ability (has none), speed (has none), defense (has none), throwing ability (has none). Nor is it about his wretched performance in the batter's box in 2007. Nope. I am incapable of arguing with anybody who believes in their heart of hearts that Matt Murton and Felix Pie share the same caliber of talent and have equally attractive major league futures. It's like comparing bull-dyke Rosie O'Donnell to Heather Locklear in a beauty contest.

All I know is this. Sweet Lou agrees with me.

That's smart of the Sox... whatever's wrong with the Sox, it isn't Buehrle.

Fine by me. At least he's not going to the Cardinals or the Brewers. Although, do the Sox have to hold on to him? Can they just trade him to a team that wants him for more years at a discounted rate? Phil?

Let me chime in on Jim Hendry and then shut up (imagine that) for awhile

Then makes 2 of the next 5 posts.

Pretty much sums up ST's integrity.

Manny,

Hendry has had 2 winning seasons in a row, and a shot at 3 in 5 years. He's also put together one team that was good enough to at least get to, and probably win the WS. How many GM's in the last 40 years have the Cubs had who can say the same? How many GM's around the league can say the same?

You also said DeRosa was a terrible signing - but you were dead wrong on that. So grab your slice of humble pie.

The reasons that the Cubs are underperforming this year:

Zambrano
Jones
Murton
Barrett
Injuries to Lee and Ramirez and Soriano
Inconsistency from the bullpen.
Piniella not understanding NL in game management

Going into the season, how many of those things did you expect to happen? For me it was only Ramirez and problems with closing. If that were the only two problems they had, they'd be fighting with the Brewers for first place.

Yeah, and it also keeps him away from the Cards.

I am incapable of arguing with anybody who believes in their heart of hearts that Matt Murton and Felix Pie share the same caliber of talent and have equally attractive major league futures.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Btw... nothing like a series with the DRays, then the Royals to fix whatever's wrong with your team.

Cub fans should breathe a huge sigh of relief that Mark Buerhle no longer is on the table to be signed by the Cardinals next offseason. In my estimation, Buerhle is a 5 carat stud.

Another view on the Barrett trade

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?pa...

It now takes 600 AB's to establish a book on a player?

Pitchers were just befuddled for the last 3 seasons on how to pitch to Matt Murton, but thank the good Lord, finally in the winter of 2006, the scouts figured it out.

Praise your diety of choice. Now he will magically hit 60 points lower than his career because we solved it. After almost 2 full seasons in the majors. We have been waiting for this day for so long. Pitchers must be overjoyed.

someone posted that Jonah Keri article before, but how do the Padres get 2 draft picks for Barrett if he walks?

Isn't it just one?

The Real Neal:
"Hendry has had 2 winning seasons in a row, and a shot at 3 in 5 years. He’s also put together one team that was good enough to at least get to, and probably win the WS. How many GM’s in the last 40 years have the Cubs had who can say the same? How many GM’s around the league can say the same?"

TEFLON JIM!!!!!!! Since Hendry became GM on July 5, 2002, the Cubs have a record of 392-411, with 1 playoff appearance. He has had basically 5 full years now as GM and tons of money to spend. Enough excuses for him. Make the playoffs or be GONE!!

"You also said DeRosa was a terrible signing - but you were dead wrong on that. So grab your slice of humble pie."

I swtill think it was a horrible signing for what amounts to a utility player.

Manny: what will you talk about if/when Hendry is gone?

Robr:
"Another view on the Barrett trade"

Thanks for the link...Very well written and very much on par with my thoughts on the dump of Barrett.

Wild Thing:
"Manny: what will you talk about if/when Hendry is gone?"

Hopefully the Cubs winning.

Rob G. — June 27, 2007 @ 11:11 am
someone posted that Jonah Keri article before, but how do the Padres get 2 draft picks for Barrett if he walks?

Isn’t it just one?
.......................................................................

I posted the Keri article yesterday. Barrett will be a Type A free agent after the season ( like Soriano was this offseason) Washington got a 1st round sandwich pick #31 overall AND got the cubs 2nd round pick as compensation. If the cubs had finished with a record good enough to move them out of the lower 15 sports of the draft. Washington would have gotten the cubs 1st and 2nd rounders. Since the cubs 1st rounder was lower than 15. Washington got the sandwich pick instead.

Nice job at not answering the question Manny.

How many GM's have winning seasons every year? I count 4. That's 13% of the active GM's or probably about 5% of the GM's over the last 5 years.

Yes it would be great if the Cubs GM gets to the playoffs every year, but since there is only 1 GM in all of baseball who does that, and he has a $200 million payroll, maybe you should temper your fananticism with a little reality.

I don't think it's a forgone conclusion that Barrett or Dye will be Type A free agents.

It is kind of Bunk, IMHO to rate Hendry against all the former GM's. Cubs futility is legendary. Sure Jim is better than Larry Himes,Jim Frey or most of that lot. However if you are comparing Hendry to his current peers like Billy Beane,Terry Ryan,John Scheirholz, Theo Epstein and that lot. Hendry is undoubtedly a lower 1/3 GM. Obviously just my opinion.

Scheurholz had a losing record with a what $85 million payroll? Obviously injured players have nothing to do with that.

Nah, Real Neal, let's just continue to give the guy a free pass after he has had more than enough money to get in the playoffs or be a legit contender every year, but comes up short and made the playoffs only once. And has had the farm system go completely backwards. I like that kind of thinking...ugh

well Elias uses the last 2 years of stats and pretty much uses Triple Crown numbers and it's relative to position. I think it's top 20% at your position to be a Type A and I'd be surprised if Barrett doesn't sneak in there.

But didn't they change the compensation picks for free agency. I thought you only get one pick now. I must be wrong.

game thread up, Fontenot pitching today

so is Hendry still gonna spew the "we've gotten no mandates from upper management on how to do business" after this Jones debacle?

Mike Murphy just had a great take on the Jones deal being nixed by baseball (and possibly future Trib owner Zell) because of the money. If any Jones deal involves us having to pay less than $1M, then it seems the guy is pretty much untradable, unreleaseable, etc. As I see it, the only way to get rid of him is to package with a prospect in a swap where the Cubs are clearly receiving inferior talent.

Face it: Jones is probably a Cub until July 2008 at the very earliest.

The Cubs are cursed, so you need to adjust Hendry's record to reflect that. Kinda like when a player is "hot" or "cold." :)

Its the intangables!

Seriously, the Cubs are cursed...that's the only explanation.

Good point Rob (also can be made with the Z contract). He has stuck by that for years. I wonder if this is the first public sign of him slowly loosing power as GM.

whatever, I think Hendry plays the good company soldier and always has in front of the media. There's no reason for him not to.
He's never one to badmouth anyone in the press.

But it's obvious his hands are being tied by this Zell character.

WSCR is saying the Buehrle has resigned with the Sox for 4 years/50 mil.

Wow... that is a phenomenal deal for the Sox if that is true.

The trade was pending the approval of the Commissioner's Office -- as is the case in any trade involving $1 million or more in cash -- and it is believed that the deal unraveled at that juncture, possibly for reasons having to do with the pending sale of the Cubs.

http://cbs.sportsline.com/mlb/story/10237921/rss

not sure how to interpret that one, other than maybe Bud is wielding the hand of doom once again, like with all that draft bonus money nonsense.

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