Game 79 Thread / Brewers @ Cubs (2 of 3)

Return to Homepage

Comments

Crap. My local Fox station is carrying the Mets game. Looks like I'm listening to Pat & Ron... just in time to hear MIL score the first run.

Booooo.

Again?

Hell, we spotted them 5 yesterday. 4 should be nothing.

FONTENOT

The Fontenot as SS expirement needs to end. Put him at 2b and put DeRosa in CF.

I mean DeRosa at SS. He has a career 974 FP, a 4.87 RF, 837 ZR. Lou is apparently following my advice.

Here should be the Marshall plan:

Send him to Iowa, 60 day DL Blaco and bring up Holliman. 2 of his last 3 starts have been a joke.

Oh, joy. Scott Eyre and Jacque Jones come in to save the day. And the starter again goes two innings.

Pardon me, Hill went three yesterday.

Ok...2of the last 3 of Marhsall's starts have been a joke.
Before that, he threw 5 straight quality starts.
Ok..here's the DLee plan. His last week has been a joke, so send him to Iowa, and bring up Hoffpauir.

The Brewers eat LHP alive, so let's grin and bear it, and try to dig out of this hole.
Sending Marshall to Iowa is a silly, knee jerk reaction.

Hell...the Brewers eat RHP too.

It's going to be a loooong day today.

i hope the cubs just found their SS for the next 2 seasons...

we're gonna win 10-9, y'all will see...

...nevermind.

I can't follow the game, can someone explain to me why DeRosa/Fontenot switched 2b/ss?

Eyre DFA'd, they just didn't have the heart tell him so he's still on the mound. Piniella called LaRussa asking how he used Marquis last season in these situations.

(I can hope can't I?)

Bill Hall stole a base with a 7-run lead. Interesting.

Mike Vail, in what the 4th inning? Facing a team that just came back for being 5 down the day before? It's only bad form to steal with a big lead late in a game.

So your #1 guy can beat our #5 guy. Good for you.

Froemming had to kick the ivy to fetch the ground rule double but made Pie bend over to pick the ball up...he musta lost 5 lbs just walking to the outfield and back to third. Delay of game-Froemming?

what a difference a day makes...

Well, that was... meh.

On the bright side, Cherry pitched two scoreless innings. Yay.

hopefully aram's available tommorow...he's still not looking close to 100%.

...well he's not looking 100% according the game called on the radio in the eyes of pat/ron today and what's been shown the days before by aram.

Well if Aram is not 100% I can't wait til he gets there.

Yesterday

3 - 5 hr, dbl, 2 runs, 2 ribs

hell, that's why i hope he's back to 100% soon. nothing wrong with his upper body no matter how the groin/legs feel.

Crunch,

Ram didnt look any worse than he has since coming back from the injury.

cool. pat/ron made a comment about how he was obviously still hobbled going from 2nd to 3rd on his "triple"...ron commented that he was really showing it there, especially.

I just thought he wasn't hustling, truthfully. He wasn't in a hurry, but I didn't notice a limp.

He thought it was going to be caught, and when Hart dropped it, he didn't really go any faster.

Gotta say, I'm convinced this is part of the reason that Rammy wasn't moving so well around the bases today:

http://deadspin.com/sports/aggressiveness-tow...

Can't say I ever saw that in a clubhouse.

We call that "a little bit of how's your father"

-- Austin Powers

Rob G. — June 30, 2007 @ 3:08 pm
I can’t follow the game, can someone explain to me why DeRosa/Fontenot switched 2b/ss?

==========================

ROB G: After Fontenot made an error on the one ball hit to him at SS yesterday and an error on the first ball hit to him at SS today, it apparently suddenly became obvious to Uncle Lou that Mike Fontenot can't play SS.

I hate to think this is possible, but perhaps Piniella wasn't aware that DeRosa played SS in college at Penn, 500+ games at SS in the minors, and 100+ games at SS in MLB?

Well, at least he recognized the mistake and corrected it.

Hopefully Piniella will leave Fontenot at 2B (at least until when and if he stops hitting), and use DeRosa at SS (when he isn't needed elsewhere), and then play either Theriot or Izturis at SS when DeRosa is used at another position.

DeRosa certainly won't win a Gold-Glove at short, but he should be passably-adequate there for a while... as long as he keeps hitting. A shortstop with some "pop" is always nice, as long as he can at least make the routine plays.

Wes — June 30, 2007 @ 6:01 pm
I just thought he wasn’t hustling, truthfully. He wasn’t in a hurry, but I didn’t notice a limp.

He thought it was going to be caught, and when Hart dropped it, he didn’t really go any faster.

==============================

WES: To me, it appeared that Ramirez was running OK (not fast, but OK) up until he rounded second, and then he started to slow down and jog until he realized there might be a play, and then he tried to speed up again, and his knee brace seemed to lock up on him briefly when he did that.

Even though the Cubs have apparently indicated that they might go with 11 pitchers until the All-Star Break, after Saturday's fiasco the Cubs well might decide to go ahead and add a 12th pitcher sooner rather than later. And if it's before tomorrow's game, I would think it will likely be side-slingin' southpaw Clay Rapada.

Cotts is on the DL with a hamstring injury, Mateo is still rehabbing at Peoria, and Petrick will have to spend at least ten days on optional assignment before he can be recalled (unless he replaces somebody who is placed on the DL).

Sean Gallagher has now spent ten days on optional assignment to Iowa since the Cubs sent him down (so he could be recalled) , but he threw 67 pitches in his start yesterday (Friday) and probably couldn't give the Cubs much out of the bullpen until at least Monday or possibly even Tuesday.

Of course the Cubs could bring up a pitcher who is not presently on the 40-man roster (like Iowa LHP Carmen Pignatiello, RHP Ben Howard or Cory Bailey, or recently signed FA RHP Bret Prinz), but that would require dropping somebody from the 40. I doubt that the Cubs will DFA anybody who is now on the 25, and even Brian Dopirak is unlikely to get outrighted until maybe after the season.

If they decide to bring up Piggy (or one of the others) instead of Rapada, the Cubs could transfer Angel Guzman to the 60-day DL (he's already been on the 15-day DL for about 30 days, and doesn't appear to be anywhere close to being ready to start throwing again anytime soon), but I think they might hold off on doing that for a while longer.

Henry Blanco would be another candidate to get moved to the 60, but I doubt that the Cubs will do that until they are sure he will have surgery, and since Blanco is taking BP, any decision on surgery will be made later.

So I think the 12th pitcher added will be Rapada, and it could well be tomorrow.

Keep an eye on tonight's I-Cubs at.Albuquerque box score and see if Rapada gets in the game. If it's a situation where Rapada would normally be used (late innings of a close game) and he doesn't come into the game, it probably means he's en route to Chicago.

And speaking of the Iowa Cubs, Ronny Cedeno just hit a HR, and so that's a HR in four consecutive games for Ronny.

another pitcher makes sense look who is
starting sunday another quick hook and
there would be trouble probally no ohman,
wuertz,or eyre on sunday.

i think the first inning error set the wrong tone
at least lou saw that if fontenot is gonna play
it has to be 2nd.

On ARam's running -- His knee will be a problem for much if not the remainder of the season. His DL diagnosis was “Severe” Patellar tendonitis, possible small meniscal tear. If there is a meniscal tear, it will not 'heal' -- it will make the knee 'catch' or 'lock up' from time to time and will require surgery (arthoscopic), hopefully not until after the season. Don't expect the severe patellar tendonitis to suddenly clear up, either. I have a lot of experience with patellar tendon problems and you can expect it to make him hobble in certain situations. It won't keep him from making certain quick moves or jumps but that doesn't he's 'fine' and therefore "dogging it" if you see him running slow or laboring. (Cubster -- any input from you would be welcome -- your knowledge here clearly outranks mine.)

How ironic that this injury has made it tougher to tell whether he has slipped back into his old bad habits.

AZ Phil,

Hasn't Blanco been on the DL for 60 days now? When he comes back wont they DFA K. Hill anyway since I cant see them carrying 3 catchers? Also why would they add Rapada he seems to be a LOOGY and they need an innings eater?

Chifan,

They will call up Rapada so they don't have to make room for someone else on the 40 man.

I actually think they will DFA Jones and call up Howard. Well, I actually think that's what they should do, but it may be Pie or Theriot to Iowa and Rapada up.

DFA'ing jones would be harsh...even if they gotta eat a lotta money they could save a million or two, get a mid-level prospect...something.

its that 3rd contract year that makes it hard to DFA him...the prospect of having a CF/RF around who's shown he's had power in his past (a left handed one, too) available to a team for next to something still caries a little weight in an era where guys with less expected output are getting a million+.

DFA gives you 10 days to trade him. And apparently we are only talking about it costing the Cubs an extra $1 million or so, going on the rumors about the Florida deal.

What's the general consensus about Ronny Cedeno? There's no point in having him bludgeon the PCL anymore, but we'd have to bench the Fontenaught, DeRosa or Floyd to make room for him. Trade bait? I still think he's out best shorstop on the 40 man, and our best hittin option there, unless you count DeRosa.

I wonder if Jones would accept an assignment to the minors. He knows he isn't hitting righ now and the Cubs ML team can't afford that if they're going to contend this year. Maybe a 80 at bat tune-up can get him going.

Real Neal,

They can put Blanco or Guzman on the 60-day and put someone else on the 40-man. I dont want Rapada facing any Righties as was shown in Mesa it is not a good combination. As for Cedeno I think he will get traded before Mesa next year. Barney is the future at short. I saw him play in the CWS and is very good. He has Omar Vizquel's glove, Derek Jeter's leadership ablities, and Jose Reyes type speed (he runs a 6.7 60 yard dash, which would equate to a 4.46 40 time). He also passed Jacoby Ellsbury as the all time hits leader at Oregon State.

Well, the Brewers did what they had to do, not get swept. Worst case scenerio for them, they leave Chicago with a 6.5 game lead with 4 @ PITT and 3 @ WASH to end the first half.

It is amazing how the Cubs could come out and play like they did in that 1st innings after yesterday's heroics. It is like it never happened.

Cubs really need today's game. Just to send a little message that they are here, even if they are 6.5 games back and for MIL not to forget about them. If they lose, they are not out of it or anything, but they need to take this series at home. Also, they only have 3 games left with MIL after this series.

Chifan,

That's a pretty ringing endorsement. I wonder why a sure fire Hall of Fame player like that is going to start in Short Season A ball.

On both him and Rapada's play in Mesa. Sample size, sample size, sample size, sample size, sample size, sample size. Learn it, love it, live it.

So... two more errors from Fontenot.

Are we finally starting to see why it took so long to get Fontenot up the bigs? If he can't field regular ground balls, he is going to have a hard time sticking up here.

chifan3887 — June 30, 2007 @ 9:58 pm
AZ Phil,

Hasn’t Blanco been on the DL for 60 days now? When he comes back wont they DFA K. Hill anyway since I cant see them carrying 3 catchers? Also why would they add Rapada he seems to be a LOOGY and they need an innings eater?

========================

CHIFAN3887: Blanco has been on the DL for 31 days, so if he is transferred to the 60, he could not be activated before July 30th. Since he is reportedly taking BP, he should probably be able to start a minor league rehab this week and activated perhaps maybe as soon as next weekend, or at least immediately after the ASB. So unless he has a set-back, I doubt that he will get moved to the 60. Angel Guzman is a candidate, though.

You are correct about Koyie Hill. He will likely be DFA'd once Blanco is ready to be activated from the DL, but that won't open up a spot today or tomorrow when the Cubs will probably need a 12th pitcher. And even though he;s not an "innings-eater," Clay Rapada would be the easy choice, just because he's already on the 40.

Whenever Blanco is activated, K. Hill will very likely be Odd Man Out and will be removed from the 40-man roster at that time, and unless he is traded or released, he will be placed on Outright Waivers (both Bowen and K. Hill are out of minor league options), and even if he doesn't get claimed by one of the other MLB clubs, he still will have the right to refuse the outright assignmemt to the minors since he has been previously outrighted in his career.

However, players previously outrighted in their career who are outrighted to the minors during the season rarely exercise their right to be a FA immediately, because if they do, they give up their major league contract and guaranteed $60K (minimum) minor league split. So when this type of player is outrighted during the season, he will almost always defer his right to be a FA until after the season.

The Real Neal — July 1, 2007 @ 12:36 am

What’s the general consensus about Ronny Cedeno? There’s no point in having him bludgeon the PCL anymore, but we’d have to bench the Fontenaught, DeRosa or Floyd to make room for him. Trade bait? I still think he’s out best shorstop on the 40 man, and our best hittin option there, unless you count DeRosa.

===============================

REAL NEAL: Since Ronny Cedeno will be out of minor league options next season, I would expect the Cubs to cut Cesar Izturis after this season ($300K buy-out), and have Cedeno and Theriot battle for the starting SS job in ST (2008), with the loser kept as the primary back-up middle-infielder.

The "Wild Card" is if DeRosa plays well at SS the rest of '07 and/or if Fontenot keeps hitting to the extent where he absolutely must be the starting 2B in '08. And then there's Eric Patterson waiting in the wings at 2B, too (if he can improve his defense enough to remain at 2B).

Geovany Soto is the other Cubs player who will be out of minor league options next season, so with Blanco signed through 2009 ($2.8M salary in 2008 and $3M in 2009, or $300K buy-out for 2009), there will likely be another big ST '08 battle between Soto and Rob Bowen for the second (other) catcher job.

Ronny Cedeno had a fairly good month of June at Iowa:

25 games
45-101
446/509/782 - 1.291 OPS
8 HR
20 RBI
20 RUNS
8 2B
1 3B
12/10 BB/K
4/0 SB/CS

Buck Coats had a pretty good month of June at Iowa, coinciding with a move to CF

23 games
36-83
434/461/711 - 1.172 OPS
6 HR
21 RBI
17 RUNS
5 2B
5/13 BB/ K
3 SB/0 CS

You know who else had a big June at Iowa?

Scott Moore...

27 games
27-90
300/398/600 (998 OPS)
7 HR
19 RBI
15 RUNS
4 2B
1 3B
13/25 BB/K
1/1 SB/CS

Forgot about Geovany Soto's June at Iowa....

27 games
30-91
330/410/648 (1.058 OPS)
7 HR
22 RBI
16 RUNS
8 2B
13/22 BB/K

Hendry should be trying to trade some of these guys ina package if they all are miraculously having good months. Maybe he can fool someone into actually thinking they are MLers

Eric Patterson had a poor April, but here is his combined May-June at Iowa:

56 games
73-231
316/382/532 (914 OPS)
9 HR
33 RBI
50 RUNS
12 2B
5 3B
25/33 BB/K
7/2 SB/CS

Wes, that was a very disturbing video.

What the hell was that? Why is no one else aghast? Cubster, can you shed some light on whether that was a medical procedure?

Micah Hoffpauir at Iowa in June:

28 games
39-117
333/386/556 (941 OPS)
5 HR
24 RBI
22 RUNS
11 2B
9/15 BB/K

Mr. Whipple:
Wes, that was a very disturbing video.

What the hell was that? Why is no one else aghast? Cubster, can you shed some light on whether that was a medical procedure?

If that's what they call team chemistry, I think we need less of it.

CF Sam Fuld at AA Tennessee in June:

23 games
31-85
365/432/518 (949 OPS)
5 2B
1 3B
2 HR
13 RBI
13 RUNS
7/7 BB/K
2/0 SB/CS

Cedeno hit two yesterday, six in the past week.

Other minor notes: Samardzija won his first game at Daytona. One run, three hits in five, with two walks and two Ks.

Kroeger is under .200 at Iowa so far. Geoff Jones giving up runs since he moved to Iowa (8.53 ERA).

Colvin up around .280 at Tennessee, seems to hit the same everywhere.

Kyler Burke, who along with Bowen is what's left of Michael Barrett, knows his average won't go down later today. He's hitting .000 in fifteen at bats in six games.

Burke is at Boise, by the way.

Speaking of Sam Fuld, Angel Pagan showed again yesterday that he can play all three OF positions (badly) when he missed a catchable ball by Fielder at the wall in center.

VaPhil, that's a bit harsh to say Pagan played that Fielder hit badly. I was at the game yesterday and had a good look. I've seen that ball caught before by other CF's, but it was by no means easy or routine. Now, Hart blew Ramirez's flyball because he refused to wear sunglasses. He also looked bad on a 2nd ball later in the game.

Vacubs, he mistimed his jump. He just missed the ball. It wasn't a Matt Murton miss, but it was a miss.

Jones would have caught it, which might be why Jones replaced Pagan right after the play. I hope the switch was punitive and that Piniella has seen enough of Pagan.

Needless to say, Pie would have caught the ball. I like AZ Phil's idea of trying Sam Fuld in center, a "natural" outfielder and pesky righty hitter. If Pie is playing and they bring in a lefty to pitch to him in the eighth or ninth, put up Fuld so you still have someone playing centerfield.

Pagan is an exception to the minor-league merit system that seems to be working pretty well for the Cubs: promote the guys who are doing the job in AA and AAA. Pagan was hitting .267 when they promoted him from Iowa. He was a .280 hitter with no power in AA and AAA. The Mets released him. Hendry signed him, and Dusty latched onto him, and so here we are.

Pagan's best attributes are his speed and how he looks in a uniform. He looks great. He's in the Calvin Klein collection of rising ballplayers. But he's not as good as he looks.

I was at the game too. The CF'er has GOT to make that play.

Hit ten times to the same spot, how many times do Edmonds, Hunter, Granderson, A.Jones, et. al., make that play? 8?

Juan Pierre made a similar play in nearly the same spot last year.

Hey, that play that Pagan missed was a tough play but as a major leaguer, you have to make tough plays. That's why your a major leaguer.

Edmonds, Hunter, Granderson, A.Jones, Juan Pierre

Right... since the best center fielders in the game can make that catch, pagan should have made that catch? And yes, I intentionally included Pierre, as he IS one of the best CF in terms of range.

That was an extremely difficult catch to make. That is not exactly the play you want to attack Pagan for.

Don't get me wrong - Pagan is not a great outfielder, or even a good one. But he isn't terrible either. He isn't Adam Dunn out there.

And he has been hitting decently, though not great. Pagan is a very good 4th or 5th OF in my opinion, but he is not a starter. The problem is that the Cubs don't have any good options in CF right now. They have a guy who plays great defense, but can't hit anything right now (Pie). They have a guy who plays mediocre defense and average offense (Pagan). And they have a guy with good range, a terrible arm, and can't hit anything right now (Jones). Is there really a good option of this bunch right now?

Cubs put Rocky Cherry on the 15 day so they can bring Petrick back up.

Cubs put Rocky Cherry on the 15 day so they can bring Petrick back up.

Ha... seriously? What's his injury?

And wtf? Rocky Cherry pitches two shut out innings and gets placed on the DL. Scott Eyre just plain sucks, and he is still active.

Can't Eyre find an injury?

p.s. hollinger - got a source for that?

Its on Rotoworld and Cherry's "injury" is a strained Laterial muscle. BTW, I have 3rd hand info (friend of a friend who know works for type stuff so dont go to the bank on this) that Rammy is the only Cub all-star.

The Petrick / Cherry reversal move is on the Cubs website. Strange. Cherry actually looked decent yesterday.

Dave, your point on Pagan was exactly the one I was trying to make. We've all seen players make spectacular catches like that before, but criticizing him for not making it is a bit harsh. There were far more egregious gaffes made yesterday for us to gripe about...

Dave,

Eyre has an apperances incentive in his contract (100k for 70 Games and 200k for 80 games). So if the Cubs put him on the DL with a phantom injury he would most likely launch a complaint with the union. (BTW, the Cubs union rep is Will Ohman) As with Cherry, DL time counts for service time so it works double well for him finacially. Short term he gets the MLB split of his salary and long term he gets to become arbirtion eligible sooner.

BTW, I have 3rd hand info (friend of a friend who know works for type stuff so dont go to the bank on this) that Rammy is the only Cub all-star.

An unrelated question: which Cub do you guys think would be most likely to aggravate an injury during the All-Star Game?

I have 3rd hand info (friend of a friend who know works for type stuff so dont go to the bank on this) that Rammy is the only Cub all-star.

My guess would be that Derrek Lee would at least be part of the vote for the final spot if this is the case.

we so win if Pagan makes that play yesterday :)

new game thread up...

Rammy is the only All Star? Kinda hard to do when Soriano was third in the voting for the outfield. So unless the MLB pulls a Chicago-style vote, Soriano is going to San Fran. Rammy deserves to go. My question is SHOULD Zambrano?

DLee will not get chosen cause LaRussa is going to put his guy on the squad and frankly, who else deserves to go from that team?

oh yeah forgot about Soriano leading the vote...

Managers don't have much say in the All-Star teams anymore, the players vote for the reserves and it's just the managers job to make sure all the teams are represented (along with MLB offices). If I heard the radio correctly the other day, they basically have the duty of picking 4 pitchers and one to two of the final spots.

I still think Lee gets to be part of the final All-Star vote.

My question is SHOULD Zambrano?

Hell no. What makes you think that the 5th best pitcher on the Cubs (based on this year's performance, not actual ability) should go to the ASG?

DLee will not get chosen cause LaRussa is going to put his guy on the squad and frankly, who else deserves to go from that team?

I agree with Chad... Pujols has to be the only rep from the Cards, even though he probably doesn't deserve it this year.

But yea... Lee should be among that the five to get voted in for the last spot. I would hope.

dave, have you seen Zambrano's last four games?

OPP W L SV IP H ER BB SO
06/11 HOU 1 0 0 8.0 3 0 1 8
06/16 SD 0 1 0 9.0 2 1 5 6
06/22 @CHW 1 0 0 8.0 3 1 1 12
06/27 COL 1 0 0 6.0 5 2 3 8

3 - 1 7.75 ip/g 4.3/1 k/bb

That's the real Carlos Zambrano.

dave, have you seen Zambrano’s last four games?

Yes Chad, but last I checked the ASG wasn't based on four games. Carlos Zambrano's first half clearly does not deserve an ASG selection.

last i checked dave, the ASG isn't bases on anything.

Hello

G'night

X
  • Sign in with Twitter