Angel Guzman Rehab Continues at Fitch Park

The EXST Cubs had a road game this morning, but Angel Guzman (September 2007 Tommy John surgery) and ex-catcher Jake Muyco (recently converted to pitcher) remained at Fitch Park, throwing "live" BP on Field #2 to three of the position players who did not make the trip (Bryan Jost, George Matheus, and Josh Vitters).  

Guzman threw a two-inning "simulated" game last Friday (30 pitches, 15 each inning), so today was his next scheduled day to throw. 

He was supposed to throw a pre-planned 15 pitches today, but he actually threw 16 (nine for balls and seven for strikes). Once again he had good velocity on his fastball, but had some trouble throwing it for strikes (which is fairly typical for pitchers coming back from TJS). Guzman's curve and change-up were sharp, however, and he threw all of his pitches with an effortless free & easy motion.  

So having thrown a two-inning "simulated" game last Friday and a "live" BP session today, it's likely that (barring a medical setback) Guzman will probably get into his first EXST game on Wednesday or Thursday.

Ex-catcher Muyco threw 20 pitches today (12 fastballs, five sliders, and three change-ups), and basically had the exact opposite result as Guzman. While he could throw his fastball for strikes, Muyco had trouble controlling his breaking ball and change-up. And that's fairly typical for a position player converting to pitcher.

In addition to Guzman and Muyco throwing "live" BP, injured 2007 1st round draft pick 3B Josh Vitters (sent back to EXST from Peoria last week after suffering with tendinitis in his hand) took an extensive BP session this morning, hitting against coaches both before and after he hit against the "live" BP offerngs of Guzman and Muyco. Vitters didn't appear to be having any physical problem swinging the bat, although the results today weren't particularly good.  

Vitters also took about 30 infield grounders at 3rd base, so if his hand is not too sore, he should be ready for EXST game action very soon, perhaps as early as tomorrow. 


This Mess

Peoria 13-23
Daytona 17-19
Tennessee 15-22
Iowa 18-18

Has our minor league system ever been worse?

I don't think won-loss is a very good measure of the success or health of a farm system. After all, only one or two players from each level will ever make a major-league contribution.

I coach little league, and I've had teams with 2 or 3 extremely good players and 9 analogous to minor-league filler, and the teams generally lose. And I've had teams with 11 decent but not special players, and we win, but nobody from the team went on to play travel, for example.

The real test of the strength of a system is the players it sends to the major-league club, and the last couple of years have given me some hope that things are getting better on the farm.

I'll drink to that.   There are also organizations - I believe the Pirates are one - that systematically hold their players back so that they are competing at levels where they are old for their age.  A few years ago the Pirates wracked up the best overall minor league W-L record doing this. There's an obvious little league analogy there, as well.  Fat lot of good it did them.

their players back so that they are competing at levels where they are old for their age.

I can think of a team loaded with old players, the 18-18 Iowa Cubs.
Their starting lineup includes

Torres age 30
Scales age 30
Figueroa age 34
Hill age 29
Murton age 27
most of the rest are 25.

Contrast them with the perennial AAA powerhouse Salt Lake Bees, 29-7, whose starting lineup, except for 30 year old Dee Brown, averages 25 years old.

AAA is a learning/placement clearinghouse, not a prospect hotbed...if you're a hot prospect in AAA you either play for the Durham Bulls (ha) or you're damn close to coming up and not spending a lot of time there.

its not in the same league as A/AA for a variety of reasons totally independent of talent.

in AAA you have role players who are only there for injury reserve who dont mind spending all year riding a bus if needed.

you got elders who are there to help kids transition from minors to majors and keep their head in check (and to help manage the up/down aspect of AAA-majors baseball).

you got guys who are there as organizational filler because the guys who should be there either arent ready yet or they're all in the majors.

of success

Ri-i-ight, when I see a team like the Peoria Chiefs, dead last in the 14 team Midwest League, I think "TALENT!"

Give Wilken a raise. He's responsible for everybody on the roster.

How about giving credit for Soto, Marmol (extra credit!), and Theriot, who are all key players on a contendng team. Wuertz and Gallagher could also contribute quite a bit this year.

My concern is that nobdoy (with Gallagher now up) seems to be performing very well --we need a CF, but Colvin is really struggling at AA ball.

Why should Wilken get credit for anyone you mentioned?

Why is he being chastised for Iowa's record?

You have yet to explain why you're giving credit to Wilken for Soto, Marmol and Theriot when he had nothing to do with drafting them.

Ah -- my bad. I was talking about the farm system/player development in general, rather than Wilken in particular.

best farm systems in Baseball and outside of LAAA AAA team none of their teams are 5 games above .500.

none of our teams are any games above .500

You cannot just judge a farm on its W-L record.

Of course you can't, just like you can't judge the Cubs on their W-L either. :)

However, if you read my original post, my question was, has our minor league system ever been worse? There just isn't much there, there this year.

Why that should inspire a series of personal attacks, is one for the shrinks.

after reading through all this...

1- you break out the phrase "only a cubs fan would/could" again

2- is there anything cubs-related you like? the blue uniforms, maybe? the little bear on the logo? chicago has good hotdogs?

No doubt you think Tim Wilken deserves credit for that.

no doubt what i typed had to do with you, not tim wilkin.

hotdogs, yo...hotdogs. i am for real!

Crunch: 1- you break out the phrase "only a cubs fan would/could" again

I'm pretty amazed crunch. How do you even keep track of these plebes? The guys with personality (like you or Chad or Carlos, for example) are relatively easy for me to keep track of what they've said previously (as much as my sieve-like brain can in general keep track of things). Someone like that guy you quote (navigator?) I just kind of bunch together in my mind as "one of those nondescript posters who usually say ignorant or angry things." I primarily skim these guys if I read them at all. Really. Who has time?

It certainly is goofy, I'll give you that. It's either two tons of self loathing or the guy is trolling and doesn't actually like the Cubs (or its fans).

fwiw, navigator=cubswinthepennant from the MVN site, before we moved here and brought on all these crappy, new writers.

I will certainly skim your comments from now on.


Oh! It's Cubswinthepennant/Bluewaterboats! Oh, how I could wax reminiscant of the days where you and Bleeding Blue would scrap like young toughs out behind the message board.

Since it's you, I'm sure it's two tons of self loathing. Maybe three.

Last thought, how could you take seriously anyone that uses the word "plebe"? Only an asshat talks like that.

Feel free to skim this last line.

And now to put the final nail in my own doofus coffin, I'll respond to my own comment.

Why do people change their handles after long periods of time? Don't they know that their meta-identity is precious? Don't the recognize that their self defined self is ontologically demolished by this alteration of name? For shame! For shame!

Shut up, dork.

Only an asshat talks like that

You mean like this, Whipple?---> "I'm pretty amazed crunch. How do you even keep track of these **plebes**?"

But I agree, you're talking like an asshat this afternoon.

Thanks for pointing that out to me! How could I ever have said such a thing?!

Can I join your self loathing club?

well, he's easy for me once i got insulted by him 2-3 times earlier. it all kinds of jumps out at me.

i try to just be humorous or ignore it, but this thread is full of similar cubs-hating/anger/whatever stuff.

also i read TCR way too much, i think. heh...

If you ask me (which no one is), Tim Wilken should get credit for all of the crappy posts on this thread.

AZP: was it just you watching Guzman throw at Fitch? Were other team's scouts around? Other media?
Do you have a press pass or can a guy like me just walk in and watch a rehab session?

As always, thanks for the insider (or at least what feels like insider) info.

Submitted by Stevens on Mon, 05/12/2008 - 1:40pm.

AZP: was it just you watching Guzman throw at Fitch?

Were other team's scouts around?

Other media?


STEVENS: Just me.

Huh, I must have missed that part where the MiLB seasons started ending in early May.

What has he had, 2 drafts so far? the first one without a 2nd, 3rd or 4th round pick?


What was I thinking? How dare me suggest that Wilken may not be responsible for Theriot and Soto and Marmol.

Troll. Almost definitely.

Well, we're always on the look out for another Silent Dishrag-type. Looks like we've got an applicant.

A club's minor - league W/L record is not indicative of the potential major league talent on board. The Cub's farm teams from the 70's were usually at the top of their respective divisions each year, and yet the club produced few players that reached their major league rosters. You could look it up - but why bother? You're just braying for the genuflection in your bathroom mirror.

Simply put, you're a troll, son.

Nicely done, Dmac.

Forgive me for actually believing that the record of the Peoria Chiefs accurately reflects the lack of talent on the team. I could list their batting averages, most of which are below .253 but no doubt you'd snear at my stupidity.

Mmmm.....that's good sauce!

"braying for the genuflection in your bathroom mirror."

Well played.

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