TCR: Over-analyzing the Cubs since July, 2001.


Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

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SP Greg Maddux
SP
Ryan Dempster
  3-3, 3.60, 26 K, 8 BB, 50 IP
4-1, 2.76, 36 K, 23 BB, 49 IP
       
CF
*Jody Gerut
LF
Alfonso Soriano
2B
Tadahito Iguchi SS
Ryan Theriot
RF
*Brian Giles 1B
Derrek Lee
1B
*Adrian Gonzalez 3B
Aramis Ramirez
3B
Kevin Kouzmanoff RF
*Kosuke Fukudome
SS
Khalil Greene
CF
*Jim Edmonds
LF
*Paul McAnulty 2B
Ronny Cedeño
C
#Luke Carlin C
Henry Blanco
P
Greg Maddux
P
Ryan Dempster

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If the Cubs can overcome old friend Greg Maddux--perhaps making his last start ever at Wrigley Field--and the negative energy surrounding the addition of our new centerfielder, they'll take three of four from the Padres and improve their record on the homestand to a dandy 6-1, with three against the Pirates yet to go.

This, by the way, would be the first Wrigley Field series the Cubs had captured from San DIego since 1999. I'm sure the Mickey Morandini, Quilvio Veras references will be all over the broadcast.

Dempster comes off an ND against the Diamondbacks on Saturday (2 ER in 6 IP, but 118 pitches!!!).

"Game Notes" Note of the Day: Cubs have drawn 180 walks so far this season compared to 124 walks through 40 games last year. At this pace, they'll draw 758 free passes for the year, breaking the team mark, set in 1975, by a whopping 108.

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# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Perhaps there is some revisionist history going on regarding Edmonds. When did Cubs fans hate Edmonds? Around 2004, many Cubs fans said the Cardinals played The Right Way, much different from the Unlikable Cubs.

Plus, fans apply style points on wins all the time, so they can have something to bitch about. So if Edmonds wants to hot dog it during a catch (supposedly), I guess he's entitled. As long as he catches it.

I believe that during the infamous Edmonds-Zambrano Game, that was also the game where Carpenter lectured Sammy behind the mound when Sammy was jogging on the way back to the dugout after making an out. I can't remember a single Cub fan that was outraged by that.

On my list of hated Cardinals, Edmonds is somewhere in between Tom Nieto and Ralph Citarella. In other words, meh.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Wasn't Ralph Citarella the guy on the Sopranos that Tony killed cause he killed Tony's horse, Pie O My?

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Yes, but he also played briefly for the Cardinals. Perhaps you recall the incident where Whitey Herzog pulled him for a pinch-hitter and then showed up the next day at the ballpark missing an ear.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Damn. That must have been before they started airing baseball tonight!

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Turns out that the guy had a hairpiece. Only nobody knew it until they were "parting him out" in his bathtub.

__________________________

Rooting for Laundry since 1987

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

He came from a family of Candlemakers

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Rooting for Laundry since 1987

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Did they specialize in candles that kept mosquitos away?

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

What really got him into trouble was when he made a fat joke about Gussie Busch's wife.

__________________________

"Enjoy every sandwich." -Warren Zevon

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

For the record, I was bothered by whatever Carpenter did (can't recall) because I hate him, too.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Quilvio!

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I thought the whole point of another LH bat was to break up the righties and Lou puts Edmonds back to back w/ Fuku?

__________________________

That's Manila with an "L"

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I was about to type the same thing.

Very odd -- seems to give the advantage to the Padres, who can bring in a LH for 2 batters in a row (unless they don't have a LH available).

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

probably just pinch-hit for Edmonds there....

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

PREDICTION:

(get it - bold prediction?)

Greg Maddux will pitch for the Cubs again this year.

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Gotta love Mad Dog -- 4-pitch first inning.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Augh -- these "runner's fielder choices" at home with less than 2 outs are killing us....

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

What a retarded move. Edmonds even game him the "stop running, jackass" signal.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I agree with Mitterwald. I don't recall the Edmonds hate. Zambrano had that one game where he hit Edmonds twice, but that's the only adversity surrounding Edmonds that I recall. In fact, I always liked Edmonds hard-nosed play in CF and the fact that he was a big part of some very good Cardinal teams. I hope he can provide a spark and help instill a winning attitude on the Cubs.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

"J Edmonds grounded into double play, shortstop to second to first, K Fukudome out at second."

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

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-- old and blue

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Old and Blue -- I agree. The Jim Edmonds experiment has been a complete and utter failure. It's time to send him packing and bring in someone else to play CF. The whole Edmonds experiment was doomed from the beginning. I don't know why I couldn't see that sooner.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Bases loaded, one out, chance to put the game away in the 7th -- and Emdonds K's.

SEVEN left on base for our new best friend.

Douchebag.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Edmonds doesn't hit much anymore, but he definitely can't hit lefties. Should have pinch-hit there..

# It is one game

and if the wind isnt blowing in and Aram didnt run the bases like a fool, his line today would have been 2 for 4 with 4 RBI.

# Re: It is one game

The wind was blowing in at Wrigley in May?

Boy, that's unusual.

# All I was pointing out

is if you change a few variables, he could have had a great game. I get you dont like the guy and I really dont care for him myself, but it was the right baseball move to pick him up. We are paying him 284 K if he sucks and Pie makes his adjustments at AAA, you cut him and bring Pie back. To nitpick his performance after one game that we won pretty easily is kind of petty in my view.

# Re: All I was pointing out

Yup. Guilty as charged. Welcome to Chicago. You want blase, try San diego or Arizona. The Bennigans there are really nice.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I reserve the right to hate any Cardinal or ex-Cardinal I wish, and not have to justify it in any way.

__________________________

-- old and blue

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

can someone tell me what happened when a-ram was out at home? i'm on a mobile phone. from game day it appears a dumb play?

__________________________

Disappointed by "Cubbery" since 1966

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

More bad luck than a bad play. The ball went all the way to the backstop and Ramirez took off running, but it bounced rebounded right to the plate.

# What's up with letting Phil effing Donohue sing

so he could shill for his lame anti-Iraq War something or other??

The Cubs ARE TRULY cursed.

__________________________

.276 .369 .532 .901 8HR 25RBI 156AB Mighty Mike Fontenot
.287 .369 .479 .848 7HR 34RBI 390AB Brian Roberts

# Re: What's up with letting Phil effing Donohue sing

Yeah, what a terrible cause that is. I'd much rather have the Real Men of Genius guys or some state champion softball team than Phil Donahue promoting a movie about this travesty of a war. The nerve.

# Re: What's up with letting Phil effing Donohue sing

I'd rather listen to Ronnie Woo Woo sing the phonebook.

And effing fossil Phil couldn't even remember that his unfinished movie thing you can't see anywhere isn't about a soldier wounded in Vietnam.

__________________________

.276 .369 .532 .901 8HR 25RBI 156AB Mighty Mike Fontenot
.287 .369 .479 .848 7HR 34RBI 390AB Brian Roberts

# Re: What's up with letting Phil effing Donohue sing

I didn't see the interview, but for the record, the movie, Body of War, is finished and in theaters. Not that you would care.

# Re: I didn't see the interview

Nobody's seen Phil's Hate-America "movie" either (even though he released it two months ago, but if you've got a ticket (a plane ticket that is) here's where it's showing today.

Lascaux Micro-Theater
Buckhannon, WV

The Belcourt
Nashville, TN

Here's Yahoo Movie's description: "Follows one wounded soldier’s attempt to readjust to life in the U.S. as a handicapped veteran, while painting an incriminating portrait of Democratic politicians and the war in Iraq."

Sounds like a bash Hillary movie.

__________________________

.276 .369 .532 .901 8HR 25RBI 156AB Mighty Mike Fontenot
.287 .369 .479 .848 7HR 34RBI 390AB Brian Roberts

# Re: I didn't see the interview

Well, this is going nowhere, given the fact that you think it's a hate America movie. But it's listed in the Chicago Reader, so it's obviously playing somewhere in Chicago. It's finished, then, unlike what you said before.

The fact that you think it's a bash Hillary movie (and a hate America movie, good combo) is pretty laughable. Having read an interview with Donahue, the film is incriminating of Congress for going along with Bush's war. (Hence that description.)

And now I'm done.

# Re: I didn't see the interview

er, he released it "unfinished." Cleveland Phil Donahue and his half-assed unfinished transparent propaganda flick don't belong at a Cubs game.

...or anywhere else for that matter.

EOS

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.276 .369 .532 .901 8HR 25RBI 156AB Mighty Mike Fontenot
.287 .369 .479 .848 7HR 34RBI 390AB Brian Roberts

# Re: I didn't see the interview

are we really having a discussion about the merit of who gets to sing the 7th?

...along with a political discussion.

check it out...

its the 7th Inning Whore-Out...big deal...you're gonna get something "sold" to you 1/2 the time. music, film, whatever.

btw...the inspiration for the film you're ranting about...rant rant rant...

...the reason eddie vedder is in the film is...wait for it...WAIT FOR IT...

they met at discussed it at a CUBS FANTASY CAMP.

yeah.

get over it.

some volleyball player, drug addict rock star, and washed up actor will sing to you soon enough.

1/2 the people they have up there singing have no business up there.

# Re: I didn't see the interview

I want to see Ditka back up there ... out of breath

# Re: I didn't see the interview

ditka!!! haha...

i've just learned to live with the "mute inning"...its not the singing in the 7th that bothers me as much as the interview afterwards. some are just painful.

and since most are there for a reason they got to plug their movie/book/etc.

it's been silly for years even with the bright spots (mongo getting thrown out by the ump #1).

# Re: I didn't see the interview

The movie out right now is not unfinished. EOS

# Re:The movie out right now is not unfinished

Oh, it's finished alright.

But go see it,
be the first.

__________________________

.276 .369 .532 .901 8HR 25RBI 156AB Mighty Mike Fontenot
.287 .369 .479 .848 7HR 34RBI 390AB Brian Roberts

# Re:The movie out right now is not unfinished

I will go see it, because I hate America.

# Its bad enough that they use the 7th inning stretch to pimp

movies and music, but pimping political agendas should be off-limits. I hope they do not have McCain or Obama due it over the summer. If they want to keep this hollow tradition alive, the should just auction the right to do it and have the proceeds go to Cubs Care.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

i'll admit to not being a fan of this dempster SP thing. I'm still waiting for him to hit a wall endurance wise.

That said, major props for a really well pitched game. 8 innings 103 pitches. is that the best stat line of the year for a SP for the cubs? Keep up the good work and I'll eat my feelings later in the year.

Very nice to see our bullpen get a break.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

oh i guess he gets the opportunity for a CG.

# Re: he gets the opportunity for a CG.

I'm surprised, cause Brian Giles, who's pretty much been the Pods' offense today, is leading off the inning..

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.276 .369 .532 .901 8HR 25RBI 156AB Mighty Mike Fontenot
.287 .369 .479 .848 7HR 34RBI 390AB Brian Roberts

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

So who told Dempster he had to be good?

__________________________

That's Manila with an "L"

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I did not have "5-1 record with a 2.35" on the Halfway-through-May Dempsterometer.

Similarly, I also did not have 816 OPS on the Halfway-through-May Theriotometer.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

And what did you see through your Cedenoscope? Your Sotomizer?

There have been so many years when all of the "ifs" at the beginning of the year turned out sour. It's fun that so far so much has been sweet.

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Providing bottled hot water to dehydrated babies since 2004.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

My friend, we both know that this is not the appropriate forum for discussing what I see through my Sotomizer.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Where exactly do you think you are?

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Providing bottled hot water to dehydrated babies since 2004.

# Go Home Advantage Go!

Z, Lilly, and Dempster

All pitching like Aces right now

__________________________

.276 .369 .532 .901 8HR 25RBI 156AB Mighty Mike Fontenot
.287 .369 .479 .848 7HR 34RBI 390AB Brian Roberts

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

GO CUBS!!!

WHHHOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!

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I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me- hst

# A Very Good Day!

Cubs win, Cards & Brewers lose, Astros down 6-0. It's all good.

Izzy looks like a basket case -- gave up 4 runs today, including his own throwing error.

Beware the Pirates -- only a game under .500.

Go get 'em, Sean.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Who'd have thought Shawn "Rag-Arm" Estes would have pitched the Pads best game in the series?!

__________________________

Disappointed by "Cubbery" since 1966

# More Izzy

Izzy, who asked out of the closer role because he couldn't handle it (!), came on to start the 8th with the Cards up 5-4.. Four batters later, it was 8-5, Pirates.

If continues to be a disaster, it's a major hit to the Cards. How's that for searing insight?

It may all go horribly wrong from here, but -- well done, Ryan Dempster! A remarkable start to the year.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Edmonds. Clutch. Like a 72 Chevy Vega.

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Go Cubs. Go. No seriously.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

9 games over .500 is once again the high water mark this year, hope it becomes a floor soon and not a ceiling.

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I've got BLISTERS on my FINGERS

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

From the Muskrat:

"A career .286 hitter, he was asked how much he had left in the tank.

'I've got a lot left," he said. 'I feel my body's in as good shape as it's been in six, seven years. I just have to get my swing back and get going.' "

Jim Edmonds

__________________________

Disappointed by "Cubbery" since 1966

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I hope he succeeds. If he succeeds, he helps the Cubs succeed.

There are enough Cardinals left for me to hate. It's cool.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I was at Wrigley today. A couple of observations:

(1) It was cold and windy, which made me sad.

(2) Not sure if this came across on TV/radio, but Edmonds was lightly booed in a sort of joking, good-spirited manner as he was announced for his first at bat. After he grounded into the DP he was booed again, this time not so jokingly. And after he struck out he was booed for real, with lots of shouted jeers and scorn. It was a CoreyPattersonesque boo. This is not going to be pretty if he doesn't produce.

(3) I had never noticed Dempster's bizarre double flip-flutter that he does with his glove during his windup. What is up with that?

(4) It's May 15 and the Cubs have the 2nd best record in MLB.

That is all.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I like the naming of it as the "double flip-flutter". Run with that.

__________________________

"Enjoy every sandwich." -Warren Zevon

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I think Len and Bob mentioned at some point this spring that he's been concerned in the past that his grip is too noticeable to runners that may be behind him. So, to correct that, he uses the same grip, flips his wrist around, changes the grip for the pitch he wants as he winds up, and then throws.

# The double flip-flutter glove windup

(3) I had never noticed Dempster's bizarre double flip-flutter that he does with his glove during his windup. What is up with that?
===========
I noticed it for the first time in his last start over the weekend against the Dbacks. Haven't really looked for it on TV. It's interesting and it must be at least a little distracting to some of the hitters. I'm not sure if he's used it all year but I like it. It's a throwback and seems simple enough that if useful it might catch on although I don't know of any other pitcher who uses it. I'm sure someone will have a historical comp though.

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I've got BLISTERS on my FINGERS

# Re: The double flip-flutter glove windup

He has used it all year. He needs it because he really has to dig into his glove to try to get his splitfinger grip. You really want to push the ball into the webbing of your glove to try to get the ball as deep in between your fingers as you can. The more you're able to choke that ball back towards your palm, the greater the downward movement. If he performs that same motion on every pitch, it's hard to tell when he's doing it in order try to get his splitty grip or when he's just doing it for show and he's going to throw you 96 on the inside corner.

It could certainly work a timing mechanism of some sort, as well. You have to try to keep good tempo and pace yourself when you're starting as opposed to throwing 15-20 max effort pitches out of the pen. Although, I think it's certainly more the former than the latter.

# Re: The double flip-flutter glove windup

Dave Otto (subbing for Santo on the radio over the weekend) commented on it and characterized it as a timing mechanism. He also said he had never seen anything else like it.

# Re: The double flip-flutter glove windup

Wes--

I really appreciate your perspective as someone who pitched in organized ball (it was organized ball, wasn't it?). You articulate a lot of the stuff about pitching in a clear & cogent manner. Kudos.

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JoePepitone

# Re: The double flip-flutter glove windup

pretty much what Wes said...

as Len has described it a few times on air, Dempster actually starts with a split-fingered grip on every pitch and then changes as he's in the windup (if he's not throwing the split-finger). So even if he's starting with the split-finger, he does the glove twitch thing to throw-off the batter.

He doesn't seem to do it out of the stretch from what I've noticed.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

I think the glove action is the secret to Dempster's success. It must distract the hitters/ work as a timing mechanism well enough for him to have been able to step it up a notch. I mean he's always had pretty decent stuff obviously its just the question can he return to the starting rotation for the first time in 6 years. So far he has more than exceeded expectations, I just hope he can keep it up, at least until if/when Rich Hill can get back to his 18 win self.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

"at least until if/when Rich Hill can get back to his 18 win self."

===================

That should be potentially 18 win self. He hasn't actually ever even approached an 18 win season as of yet.

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JoePepitone

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Of course... he pitched well enough last year to get 18 wins, but getting some of the worst run support in the league sure didn't help.

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still searching for the meaning of "assinine"

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Padres catcher Michael Barrett, on the 15-day DL with a sprained ligament in his right elbow, will probably start a rehab assignment at Triple-A Portland next week, manager Bud Black said.

Damn... I might actually have to go downtown and catch a Beavers game just to blame this guy one last time.

# Re:7th inning

I frankly don't give a shit about Phil Donahue, I actually thought he was dead.

But why in the hell are they bringing in Tony Romo and Steve Smith to throw out the first pitches? Unless they are in town to take a physical for the Bears, they have no business being on the field, and I will boo them as such. To bring in a WR who torched the Bears in a playoff game(12-218 2 TD) to throw out the first pitch is an insult to the fan base, and makes NO sense. He is from LA, went to college at Utah, and plays in Carolina...what is the connection?

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

from Friday's sun-times:

Manager Lou Piniella confirmed a Sun-Times report that Daryle Ward will go on the disabled list after the game Sunday because of a bulging disc. The Cubs are expected to promote lefty-swinging Micah Hoffpauir from Class AAA Iowa. Hoffpauir, who plays first base, has been getting extra outfield work.

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/95320...

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I've got BLISTERS on my FINGERS

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

Why are they waiting until after the game Sunday? Why not do it now?

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It's D-Lee's year.

# Re: Game 41 Thread / Padres @ Cubs (4 of 4)

My guess is that they can use him if they need him, or if they don't retro him

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake