Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
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| SP | *Ted Lilly | SP | Bronson Arroyo |
| 13-8, 4.23, 160 K, 57 BB, 174.2 IP | 13-10, 4.97, 137 K, 57 BB, 166.2 IP | ||
| LF | Alfonso Soriano | CF | *Chris Dickerson |
| SS | Ryan Theriot | SS | Jeff Keppinger |
| 1B | Derrek Lee | 2B | Brandon Phillips |
| 3B | Aramis Ramirez | 1B | *Joey Votto |
| 2B | Mark DeRosa | 3B | Edwin Encarnacion |
| CF | *Jim Edmonds | RF | *Jay Bruce |
| C | Geovany Soto | LF | Jolbert Cabrera |
| RF | *Kosuke Fukudome | C | Ryan Hanigan |
| P | *Ted Lilly | P | Bronson Arroyo |
That well-known rabble-rouser, Mark Sheldon of mlb.com, is billing this series as a showdown between NL Rookie of the Year candidates Geovany Soto and Joey Votto.
Actually, I don't know anything about Mark Sheldon's rabble-rousing, but the comparison is not entirely off-base:
| AVG | OBP | SLG | OPS | HR | RBI | |
| Geovany Soto | .294 | .371 | .514 | 885 | 21 | 80 |
| Joey Votto | .294 | .360 | .472 | 832 | 17 | 67 |
As you can see, except for AVG, Soto's numbers are all better, plus one can't discount Soto's invaluable contribution behind the plate. Regarding Votto, who hit .382 last month and had a team-high 18 RBI, he has played well while most everything and everyone around him has gone to hell.
Also, don't forget Votto has had to overcome the handicap of playing for an imbecile.
Reds starter Bronson Arroyo has been outstanding lately, winning 9 of his last 12 starts and posting a 2.62 ERA in five outings last month. He has already beaten the Cubs and Ted Lilly twice this year, including a 2-1 decision a couple weeks ago.
The Cubs are embarking on their longest road trip this year as they endure their longest losing skid of the season. As for Lilly, he was a loser last time out against the Phillies (6.2 IP, 3 ER), but he has given the Cubs six or more innings in each of his last nine starts and in 16 of his last 17 assignments.
Let's win one for ol' Doc Gryzlo.
Non-Cub Sports Headline of the Week, from The Onion:
Pavano to Yanks: 'I'm Back And Ready To—Ow, My Hip!'
#1 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Probaly not completely fair, but getting 20+ HR and 80+ RBI out of a catcher (rookie or not)is more impressive than getting it out of a 1st baseman, where it should be almost automatic.
Oh man....another series in Houston next weekend. Check to see the bar is fully stocked.
#2 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Fun fact: Joe Votto ain't shit.
__________________________"Gasp... You used Ghostbusters for evil!" ~ Liz Lemon
#3 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
standing here under an overhang wondering if they'll get this game in. Looks like might have wasted some serious coin.
The last game I came to here in cincy was that gem that Lieber started. You know, his one and only start. Gave up four HR's. Gallager came in and poured gas on the siyuation.
#4 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
rain...
RAIN?
whatever...
#5 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
5 out first inning...awful start.
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#6 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Looks like Votto is off to the races in this weekends Rookie competition. Hopefully Soto can respond in kind.
#7 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Also, don't forget Votto has had to overcome the handicap of playing for an imbecile.
Seriously?
__________________________Antagonizing TCR posters with my my "assinine" "socialist drivel" and my signatures since 2003.
#8 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Is it okay to PANIC yet?
#9 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
One week until the Winter Meetings...Woo!
#10 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
This team just looks bad. Lets hope they are having a 2005 White Sox meltdown before the heat up lol
I've been posting my doubts about the offense for some time now, but now with Zambrano, Dempster, and Lilly all looking like mortals there are definite chinks in the armor.
We're just lucky the Brewers haven't taken advantage yet.
#20 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
What did Dempster do wrong? His last outing was 7 ip, 3 er.
And Lilly has looked mortal all year.
__________________________Antagonizing TCR posters with my my "assinine" "socialist drivel" and my signatures since 2003.
#11 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
something. anything to turn the momentum.
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#12 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
I look at it this way...
Z, Harden and Lilly are all getting to skip a start
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#13 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Is this the game where we hit rock bottom, so we can recover?
#16 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Arroyo equals Drysdal
Leiber equals sausage grease sweating Glendon Rusch
#14 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
w00t Pads tie it up 1-1 top 4. C'mon Pads, start the downfall of Chuck Saturday.
__________________________"Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is: never try." -- Homer
#15 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Throwing error Bill Hall
...on a throw to the plate for a potential fielder's choice.
1-1
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#17 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Koyie Hill adding 5 mph to Angel Guzman's fastball
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#18 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
doh, spoke too soon. SuperChuck RBI single, Brewers up 2-1.
I'll show myself out.
__________________________"Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is: never try." -- Homer
#19 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
the "B" Cubs break thru with a run, Koyie Hill double...he hit it 5 mph faster than the CF.
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#21 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Be sure to order Ted Lilly's exciting new video "Veteran Leadership: How to step up when the chips are down". Highlights include the glove slam from last year's playoffs, and getting knocked out by the Reds minor league lineup when your team's epic death spiral is just gaining steam. On sale now!
Six straight, with Marquis and Marshall pitching the next 2.
Who's a headless chicken now, hmmmm?
#22 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
So...you're gloating because you see DOOOOOOM ahead? This is a good thing how exactly?
As for Lilly, yes, he stunk tonight, and I liked the quick hook by Lou (until Lieber put the game out of reach). But even if I had a problem with Lilly's 2007 glove slam, it would seem pointless to pick on him for it now. Meanwhile, I can deal with any "epic death spiral" that results in virtually no loss of ground to the competition and the continual reduction in magic numbers.
__________________________"Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is: never try." -- Homer
#25 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Not gloating at all...just always find it bizarre when everyone uses the 2005 White Sox as an example rather than the 2004 Cubs or the 2007 Mets. Cubs have Marquis and Marshall the next 2, then play nothing but winning teams, mostly on the road.
Playoffs a lock? Not yet.
#39 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Who exactly is this "everyone" and "always" that you are calling out? surely you don't mean every single person who posts on this board. I don't recall reading hundreds of posts everyday mentioning the 2005 White Sox. I do recall seeing one or two in the past week. This team still has the best record in the NL and therefore is still the team that has the best chance of any NL team to make the playoffs. Go look for your head, chicken.
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#48 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
I made a comment about the 2005 White Sox because I was trying to put a positive spin on a shitty situation. They almost blew their division lead in September, and then rebounded to win the World Series. Just trying to look on the bright side.
#23 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
I agree, but tonight was quite painful to watch - and last week wasn't exactly wonderful either. Yeah, they were probably due for something like this, but they sure look a little lifeless out there.
#24 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Finally, the perfect situational use of Howry.
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#26 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
GOD I LOVE ERIC GAGNE
quickly, 2-2 and CC gets a no decision (and an RBI)
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#27 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
The only Rosenbloom quip I've liked all season is that Gagne is the Cubs' MVP. Keep it up Wreck-ful Eric!
__________________________"Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is: never try." -- Homer
#28 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Just like 2007..The Brewers bullpen is the key for the Cubs.
#29 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Mitch Atkins tonight, 4 hits, 7 strikeouts in 7 shutout innings. Somewhere the Cubs are winning!
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#30 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Good news on Atkins, now that our starters are either dealing with nagging injuries or just sucking it looks like we might need him for some starts this month.
#31 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
best signing for the cubs this year... eric gagne
#32 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Pods blow golden opportunites in both the 9th and 10th.
Not looking good.
#33 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Of course now the Padres turn to Bryan Falkenburg in the bottom of the 10th to face Braun :( this doesn't look good.
#34 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Ok out of the 10th after Walking Braun and Fielder. On to the 11th still 2-2. Both the Brewers and Cubs were hot all yaer now both are cold...funny how things work.
#35 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Hart fails to bunt after Braun/Fielder both walk...
then he hits into a 5U-3 DP, Kapler 6-3, on to the 11th.
guess we're not the only team that doesn't execute fundamental stuff.
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#36 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Pads blow another great chance in the 11th -- 1st and 3rd one out, then DP. No word if they had DLEE in to pinch hit.
Feels like the 2nd gane of the Cubs-Astros series....
#37 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Damn...what a crap night.
#38 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
wgn radio reported that Rich Harden had a pain free bullpen session today and will pitch Wednesday (as planned) in StL.
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#40 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Frustrating as hell. But the sun still rises tomorrow. Ain't life grand that you can go to sleep at night and start over again the next day.
__________________________That's Manila with an "L"
#41 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Wildcard probability is more realistic at this juncture.Even if pitching improves the players have to step up.Unfortunately Lou has a standard of complacency involving his everyday lineup.People that slump simply drag the team down,including double play Lee,Fukadome,and Ramirez.Lou needs to go to his bench no matter what. I would rather see the fans waving the W FLAG.If the starters aren't doing the job let them sit.even if it pisses them off. Whatever it takes to win. Also many thanks to Hendry for not having enough sense to pick up another power hitting outfielder. Kinda late now is it?
#42 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
40yrcubsandcounting:
Wildcard probability is more realistic at this juncture.
The Cubs are currently 4.0 games ahead of the Brewers. They continue to have the best record in the NL despite the 6 game losing streak. They'll win the division, not the wild card. Stop panicking. Blech.
__________________________"Gasp... You used Ghostbusters for evil!" ~ Liz Lemon
#43 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Gawd, I knew it wouldn't take long for the jump off the bridge crowd to show up. Its pretty damn amazing that the Cubs have been able to go this long without having an extended losing streak, but its baseball, it happens. Hell, look at the Brewers, who haven't made any significant ground during the Cubs losing streak.
Yes it would be nice if Hendry could have waved his magic wand and picked up Jason Bay for a bag of balls, but lets look at reality. The Cubs are still the best offense in the NL by a long shot, scoring 50 more runs than the next closest team, and leading the league in Batting Average, Slugging, and OBP. The offense is in a slump, its not a long term issue.
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#44 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
I probably shouldn't do all this, but I had my coffee today.
Wildcard probability is more realistic at this juncture.
How can you possibly say that? Look, I don't like watching bad baseball either, but let's pause a second before we reach for the defibrillator, okay? The Brewers are 4 games back and they've been playing badly too, if you haven't noticed.
Unfortunately Lou has a standard of complacency involving his everyday lineup.
Continuing to hit Lee 3rd despite his slump is somewhat questionable, but otherwise Piniella has shuffled the lineup noticeably. Soto, Fukudome, Theriot, and DeRosa have all moved around to varying degrees of success.
People that slump simply drag the team down
People that slump. Children that don't always do what you tell them to. Lottery tickets that don't win. Sunny days that turn rainy. All of you are draggin' me down!!!
including double play Lee,Fukadome [sic],and Ramirez.
OK, as for Lee and Fukudome, everyone would like to see better offensive production. But they're not "dragging the team down." At the very least, their defense helps the team immensely.
As for Ramirez: how anyone can blame him for any of this team's perceived woes is beyond me. He's the team's very best position player (maybe tied with Soto), a legitimate NL MVP candidate, and complete and total money with the game on the line. I cannot believe that anyone calling himself a Cubs fan has to be schooled on this, after all the clueless maroons we've seen at 3rd base over the years. Even if you're so unrealistic as to demand slump-free perfection from every player, Ramirez comes as close to your crummy ideal as anyone you will ever see in a Cubs uniform. And you break bad on him!!
Also many thanks to Hendry for not having enough sense to pick up another power hitting outfielder.
You know, you're right. Hendry probably didn't even offer Rich Hill to Cincinnati for Adam Dunn! Or Pie for Griffey, or Ceda to the Pirates for Nady! How could he be so dumb?!?
__________________________"Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is: never try." -- Homer
#45 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
I was at the "game" last night. Wow, that was unwatchable. As a result, most of the section we were sitting in resorted to heckling. I don't think Soriano was even looking at the pitches; he just fanned through most. Yes, he drew two walks, but my God, did he chase crap. None of the players looked like they wanted to be there except maybe Koyie Hill. (Remember the Hill/Hill battery early last year?).
If these guys don't hit soon, I'm expecting a Mt. Pinella eruption.We got drummed by the Riverbats.
Why Ted, why?
#46 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Mike Vail:
I was at the "game" last night...
I'm sorry.
Hey by the way... it looks like crunch took a direct hit from Hannah. He's pretty far inland, but still, I wonder if he has power.
__________________________"Gasp... You used Ghostbusters for evil!" ~ Liz Lemon
#47 Re: Game 141 Thread / Cubs @ Reds (1 of 3)
Maybe if we just let all the headless chickens jump off the bridge, there won't be any left to bother us here.
__________________________That's Manila with an "L"