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TCR: No Good Will Come of This


One and Done

So how do you revenge fuck a baseball team?

You follow a baseball team for six months, 161 games, and just about every play of every inning and then they go and just tear your heart out. The one time you really needed them, the one thing you ever wanted out of this relationship and they can't even be bothered to show up. For six months they were the best girlfriend a guy could imagine - not only did you have that special spark with them, but they had all the fundamentals as well. They were the kind of girl that you needed more than she needed you, but still would bring you lasagna at work...just because it was a Wednesday.

And then it's the big weekend corporate retreat with your promotion on the line and she ends up forgetting to take her anti-depressants, sleeps with your boss, then the guy you were vying for the promotion with and you find this all out when you walk in on her taking on 3 guys from the sales team. On top of that, the only reason she brought you lasagna on Wednesdays was she was meeting up with your boss at a hotel room around the corner once a week.

Fuck the Cubs!

I feel like I should go root for the White Sox or Brewers now, just to show them. Or try and bang some of the player's wives, but I don't think the Angel Fan wife will approve of that one.

Observations from the ballpark after the jump...

- The Angel Fan Wife and I headed to the game and she broke out the T-shirt she made in June for the last Cubs/Dodgers game we went to,  since it ended in victory. The shirt has a Cubbie Bear logo on it and the words, "Let's face it, he's married to the Cubs and I'm just his mistress". They'll soon be widely available at TCR store. She also brought out the Angels cap to make sure we caught hell from everyone we passed.

- I mapped out a pretty solid route to the park to avoid the major conjested areas since not only was there the Dodger game, but also a USC home game and a concert downtown. I made it from Long Beach to parked in 40 minutes, 15 of them waiting in line for parking. I was surprised to see the lot full with about 25 minutes still to game time. I guess Dodger fans were taking this one seriously.

- We actually did end up around about half a dozen Cubs fans surrounded by a sea of Dodger fans of course. To say the least, they took every opportunity to heckle the Cubs fans, although they really hated the one guy wearing Yankees gear whenever he stood up to take a whiz. But the Dodgers fans right in front of us, who were the most vocal, were a pretty good-natured group and the heckling is a lot easier to handle when the jokes are pretty good. There was one unfortunate asshole who literally talked through the entire game while looking back at the group of Cubs fans looking for someone to engage him. I'm not sure he saw more than 10 pitches. He was equaled out by the obnoxious Cub fan filled up with liquid courage that decided to stand up and scream at the slightest Cub positive moment. I think he got hit by about 100 ice cubes and two cups of beer plus other assorted ballpark snacks throughout the night. And no, I was not that fan. This was me throughout the night.

- First pitch - Soriano swings. I'm ready to jump off the upper deck.

- Kuroda was popping 95-96 mph to start on the Dodgers stadium gun and I wondered where the hell that came from. Harden was hitting 88-91 and whenever he tried to put a little extra on it was nowhere near the strike zone. That's when I wrote "Game Over" in my notebook. Just kidding, I didn't have a notebook, nor do I hate Jews.

- I couldn't tell from my vantage point if Martin was safe on that play from third, but the Cub fan next to me got a text message on his cell that said the replays showed he was out. When things go bad, they go real bad for the Cubs, as we all have painfully learned.

- The Dodgers crowds usually get a bad rap and for the most part it is deserved. But last night's crowd was quite electric, and they even managed to get through a game without doing the wave. Heck, they even stayed for the 9th inning.

Not much else to say, I think I'm  probably gonna take a few days, maybe weeks off from this baseball thing. This one's a little too painful...

 

 

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#1 Re: One and Done

Thanks for the recap -- you'll have something in your e-mail by Monday.

There's always a bright side: we're not Dawson Leery.

__________________________

The Mexican homeboy.

#2 Re: One and Done

Fuck the Cubs!

Fucking A.

That quote fucking made my morning. Forever fucking grateful the fucking MVN move was made.

#3 Re: One and Done

Sigh. Just when I had gotten over the last time and was ready to open up my heart and love again. What's the baseball equivalent of a hooker?

__________________________

That's Manila with an "L"

#4 Re: One and Done

Fucking Cubs. Verily, fuck them.

#5 Re: One and Done

Seriously debating giving up on the Cubs.

I mean best record in the league and lie there like lambs waiting for the kill.

They gave away two games and didn't perform in the other.

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I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me- hst

#10 Re: One and Done

Nah, Jacos, we need you. See you around March?

#6 Re: One and Done

First, where was Reed Johnson? Veteran presence, competitor, hits for average, does very well with RISP. If there was anyone I would not see choking it would have been him. And there is no loss in defense with him instead of Fukudome.

Second, the ONE game it made sense to start Fukudome was game 3 against Kuroda. He knows him better than anyone, and clearly looked more comfortable facing him. Why start games 1 and 2 and not 3? I don't get that one.

I think the Cubs are where the Red Sox were at a few years ago. They have a solid nucleus, were always in contention, but couldn't break though. Then, down 3-0 to the Yankees, the come back, win the World Series, have won another since, and are always in contention. The Cubs need their breakthrough to prove to themselves that they can win in the playoffs. I was holding out hope that last night would be the start of it, but it didn't happen.

And of course we all say that we are going to back off and take a season off, etc. but after 4 months of no baseball and - for those of us in the midwest - a balls-cold winter, I imagine we'll be back at it come late February like every other year.

At least when I turned on a game this year I had almost a 2 in 3 chance of seeing them win. That is something that has happened in very few seasons in my lifetime.

At this point though, I am fucking pissed, but not really surprised. This is afterall what they do best. I'll check out from baseball until free agency heats up, I can't even really get into the rest of the playoffs at this point.

Also, in a sign of Cubs-fan solidarity, I'm not going to report the results of my and Real Neal's bet re: Fukudome/Theriot in September. Both sucked so miserably in the playoffs that I think at this point their September performance is a moot point.

#7 Re: One and Done

Great post, Rob G. Painful and hilarious. Sorry you had to be there in person.

I don't feel devastated, just tired and frustrated. '03 was a sucker punch in the chest. Compared to that year, this is just a boulder on the heart.

I don't want to give a shit about baseball for a while either, and I want to say "Fuck you, Cubs," but the bitch of it is I know that when the spring is on the horizon, I'll get worked up again.

I think it must be what a menstrual cycle is like, but 12 times longer.

Go Rays, I guess.

#21 Re: One and Done

lol Brick!

At least I can still laugh, it turns out.

And thanks for the post, Rob. It probably wasn't easy to force yourself to write something (and something worth reading, at that).

#8 Re: One and Done

You follow a baseball team for six months, 161 games, and just about every play of every inning and then they go and just tear your heart out.

All the effort and time one expends in following the club sure seems futile and foolish when this kind of thing happens, although at least I can say that I enjoyed myself thoroughly at the time.

But what really hurts now is thinking about all the great and small things that have to go right in order to have a great regular season, and wondering if all of those planets could ever align like that again. We all know what those things were this season; do you see them all happening again, or anything like them? It's hard to imagine right now.

__________________________

"Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is: never try." -- Homer

#9 Re: One and Done

As painful as watching the game at Lodger Stadium (where did they find all those fans?) must have been, it couldn't have been worse then listening to the re-animated corpse of Dick Stockton trying to call the game. TBS - Where formerly decent tennis announcers go to die.

...

So, the FA pickings are pretty slim. I would say our areas of need are:

RF
CF
Setup Men
Backup Catcher
Starter - if Dempster doesn't come back

Now that we stunk up the playoffs, it sort of sucks that Pie didn't get more chances in September. I think Hendry and Pinhead know not to try Edmonds again, but they're probably going to hope that Fukudome gets sorted (he looked pretty good last night, at least). The free agent market is pretty barren for anything other than left fielders, and with Fukudome's and Soriano's contracts on the books it's doubtful we'll throw money at one of the big bats (Ramirez, Dunn, Ibanez, Burrel, Abreu). There's no free agent CF's that give me confidence we'd have an improvement over Pie/Johnson.

Offering around a Cedeno/Marshall package for a center fielder seems like a good idea. KC seems to have their middle infield sorted out now, so OfJesus is probably out. There's some other scrap-heap guys that should be avaiable and cost less than those two, Tavares, And Jones, Jeremy Reed etc.

Wheeler is a free agent, and Hendry has a penchant for offering solid setup guys 3 year deals, so I could see him being a target, especially if Wood goes somewhere else. Mota and Juan Cruz could be other targets. From the left side there's not much either, assuming Marte's option gets picked up. Affeldt could be a guy the Cubs figure they could straighten out to replace Eyre's role in the grand bullpen scheme.

All-in-all it looks like Hendry's going to have a tough off-season if he wants to improve the club. Getting Hill going again will be huge.

__________________________

Livin' just a little, laughin' just a little, ain't easy.

#11 Re: One and Done

I think you're right that Hendry will be looking to throw cash at free-agent relievers, but I wish he wouldn't go that route, or that he won't have to. AZ Phil will tell us if any farmhands can become reliable middle relief/setup men; I sure hope so, because it's not like the Remlinger/Veres/Howry/Eyre method has reaped much reward.

I have deep and genuine respect for Marshall, who only did everything the Cubs asked of him with noticeable success and without complaint. I hope he won't be traded, partly because I like what he brings to the Cubs, and partly because I wonder what kind of return he would bring on the trade market. I guess he is one of their more movable players, though.

__________________________

"Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is: never try." -- Homer

#12 Re: One and Done

On that play at third in the first inning, Ramirez doesn't know how to tag a guy sliding head first. The play ends up with Ramirez' glove on the guy's shoulder. What is the ump supposed to make of that snapshot? He knows the runner's hand must have touched the base a while before.

You're supposed to make a swipe tag and pick up your glove, so that the only question in the ump's mind is whether the throw beat him.

If you think you've seen that botched tag before, it was on September 11 in St. Louis, when Brandon Ryan, the tying run, led off the bottom of the 9th with a double. The next guy bunted and Lee threw late to third. Ryan overslid third and the replay showed that in trying to get back, he reached safely past Ramirez' shoulder tag.

The Cubs got the call in St. Louis, but last night they didn't and it cost them two runs.

__________________________

Tired of OBP? Join the club!

#13 Re: One and Done

Epic Fail

__________________________

Equal Opportunity Offender

#14 Smokey...

They asked me how I knew
My true love was true
Oh, I of course replied
Something here inside cannot be denied

They said someday you'll find
All who love are blind
Oh, when your heart's on fire
You must realize
Smoke gets in your eyes

So I chaffed them and I gaily laughed
To think they could doubt my love
Yet today my love has flown away
I am without my love

Now laughing friends deride
Tears I can not hide
Oh, so I smile and say
When a lovely flame dies
Smoke gets in your eyes
Smoke gets in your eyes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMOBdQykKQY

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Chill, it's the offseason. How many days to the Winter Meetings?

#15 Re: One and Done

Vegas, Dec 8-11...

http://lasvegas.51s.milb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=...

and upcoming dates of import...

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/schedule/important_dates.js...

__________________________

Chill, it's the offseason. How many days to the Winter Meetings?

#16 Re: One and Done

It's not that I don't suffer, it's that I know the unimportance of suffering. I know that pain is to be fought and thrown aside, not to be accepted as part of ones soul and as a permanent scar across ones view of existence.
-John Galt "Atlas Shrugged"

I'm as pissed as anyone about this latest playoff disaster, but at least I had something to cheer for this season. I went to my first Cubs playoff game ever (Game 1 - CF bleachers under an unwelcome rain of Dodger homers). This season felt a lot better than giving up on baseball by June. You can't win if if you're not even in it. Hendry needs to pull his shit together and start brainstorming for the offseason. Here's looking forward to a 2009 division title and many more to come. Someday we'll go all the way!

#17 Re: One and Done

cubbie occurrence
another bad century
when's it gonna spill?

__________________________

Equal Opportunity Offender

#18 Re: One and Done

for some reason I forgot about it, but a hardy F U to Soto and/or Mike Quade not scoring from third on that chopper.

#66 Re: One and Done

I thought Theriot's not going to third on the fly ball to right, then almost getting thrown out at third on a ball that bounced 6 feet from the catcher was the highlight stupid running sequence of the evening.

__________________________

Livin' just a little, laughin' just a little, ain't easy.

#19 Re: One and Done

This is all a bad dream, right? I mean it's really only September 30th, I'm sure. The playoffs don't start until tomorrow, right?

Anyhow, since there are probably a few other women that read this blog, I'd like to provide the following comparison for us:
This regular season was like dating Mr. Darcy, only to find out yesterday that it was actually Mr. Collins (the bumbling idiot) or John Willoughby (the philandering liar) all along.

Last night I was at peace with everything ("There's always next year"), but this morning I am pissed again. How the fuck can this team only score 6 fucking runs!?!?!? THey had as many fucking ERRORS as Runs!!! (I am also glad that this blog is no longer at MVN... nothing is as cathartic as saying Fuck repeatedly.)

-Thanks for allowing me to vent.... (off to watch Pride and Prejudice with a bottle of red wine and pint of my other lovers: Ben and Jerry)

#20 Re: One and Done

thanks for the providing perspective for the other half of the world :)

 

#130 Re: One and Done

I always wondered what a woman felt. Chad is going to love this post.

__________________________

The Mexican homeboy.

#22 Re: One and Done

Well the other perspective to all this pain is probably a little more realistic and mature:

Sometimes success is a lot more of a long term process than we might otherwise have it.

In the music business I have learned that talent is actually fairly easy to come by and that what is much more important is resilience and dedication.

In the case of the Cubs it is only recently that they have really entered the field of play as a perennial playoff presence. Hell this is the first back to back appearance since, what, 1945?

Hendry and company have done a good job in my opinion of building a winner, and in a pretty darn tough division (that also has more teams than any other division!!).

Passion and memory and irrational dreaming and history have trained us Cubs' fans to almost hope that we GET LUCKY and sneak a World Series victory on some sort of magical roller coaster ride.

But perhaps the Cubs' process will be more that of the Atlanta Braves . . . slowly learning how to run an organization so that it is in the playoffs on a yearly basis and then slowly learning how to win in the playoffs. It's not how I would have it, but it makes sense if you put aside all the history.

The bottom line as so many have said is that the Cubs were very poorly run for many many years.

Now they are dedicated to winning, akin to an Alcoholic who quits drinking and then expects everyone to react with approval and for things to suddenly go well . . . in that same way because the Cubs have gotten serious we expect immediate rewards. Well maybe it's a little harder than that.

So as completely mystified and heartbroken as I am -- I think if the Cubs keep hammering the strike zone with good teams we will get our WS victory in coming years. Boston went through exactly that process and it took the Braves many appearances but that run only yielded ONE WS victory.

#114 Re: One and Done

Good thoughts here, jimmer. I would rather compare what the Cubs are doing to the Boston organization though: using huge amounts of money and the farm system to build a winning ball club. Not to mention the fact that the RedSox have won a whole lot more playoff games recently than the Braves have. Here's to a perennial playoff team that will eventually get over "The Hump".

__________________________

That's Manila with an "L"

#121 Re: One and Done

I agree. All you can ask for is consistent regular season excellence and pray that postseason excellence will somehow follow. I'd rather be strung along like this and lose in the playoffs than go 66-96 like we did two years ago.

How can the Braves be smart enough to win 14 straight division titles and dumb enough to win the World Series only once? (And the 1995 edition of the Braves probably wasn't the best Braves team during their run.)

#23 Re: One and Done

2014.

Soriano is signed THROUGH 2014 and has a full non-trade clause (not that anyone would take him).

Un-fucking-believable.

#39 Re: One and Done

guys normally don't play out their contract like that. I doubt we see a limping 38 year old Soriano in 2014. 3 or 4 more years for sure but after that they will probably pay his salary to play somewhere else.

#45 Re: One and Done

Good point, but I just have a hard time imagining anyone wanting him. Maybe he'll go in a future expansion draft. . . .

#24 Re: One and Done

Hey, it's alright guys. We'll regroup and go get 'em tonight.

Right, guys? Right? [insert Van Der Beek here]

#25 Re: One and Done

OK, I've now got scars for basically every area of my body from all of this failure - never thought it would last this long from the specter of '69, but there you go. I don't agree completely with the commenters mentioning the long - term building blocks for success, and then eventually you win a championship. Too many other teams of recent vintage (Marlins, Twins, etc.) just got lightning in a bottle and won the whole thing, and damn any blueprint for success. But that never happens for this franchise, just the reverse. We always fall flat on our faces, no matter the opponent or specific circumstances. Yesterday I heard a doofus host on the SCORE here ripping the fans for booing the team during game 2 - fuck you, Arkush, the fans can do and say any fucking thing they please, take your moral outrage and spend it where it might do some actual fucking good for once - ON THE TEAM.

Thank you for allowing me to vent - and you have my deepest sympathies for having to watch that atrocity last night, Rob. Lying down like dogs is the kindest thing one could say for this team.

#115 Re: One and Done

The thing is I don't want lighting in a bottle. I'd rather have what the Red Sox have built: a perennial playoff team that has the capability to win it every year.

__________________________

That's Manila with an "L"

#26 Re: One and Done

fuck

__________________________

The Joe - 2007 TCR Keeper Champion; 2008 Runner-Up

#27 Re: One and Done

Balls!

#67 Re: One and Done

BOBOS!!

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Let's hug it out, bitch.

#28 Re: One and Done

Is it time to remove "All The Way"?

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All right, all right, all right....

#32 Re: One and Done

I'll be moving a bunch of stuff around prepping for the winter cold when I'm up to it.

#29 Re: One and Done

I gave up and didn't even watch the game. Spent the night watching my Buckeyes ACTUALLY RESPOND TO ADVERSITY WITH A GORGEOUS DRIVE. There's room on the bandwagon if you're not already tied to Illinois/Wisconsin. I actually went as far to turn around whenever I saw the "NL" line come up on the ticker at the bottom.

Seriously. I can't believe how bad this team played. I'm 25...what I want to know from all you older guys, is this what it's like to be a Cubs fan? If so I might have to rethink this crap.

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Quit arguing about non-baseball stuff yall.

#31 Re: One and Done

You're going to lose in Champaign. We usually play you very tough and it's the week before scUM.

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#37 Re: One and Done

As much as I don't like to admit it, I qualify as one of the "older guys." And, yes, this is exactly what it's like to be a Cubs fan. To make things worse, for a real Cubs fan there's no "rethinking" it. It's like a genetic imprint. You're stuck with it.

#95 Re: One and Done

Yeah that's what I was worried about. Damn family had to be from Chicago.

Also, completely offtopic, @ Chad - OSU really isn't that good this year. Our defense has been terrible for a few years, and any team with half a brain abuses it. Luckily LLLLLLoyd Carr didn't have one, and Dick-Rod has no players. I'm gonna say we'll lose @ Illinois and win home vs. PSU, split the Big Ten title and maybe get to a BCS game. Which I'll be happy with.

Our only hope is we have two of the absolute best players in the nation in Beanie and Pryor. Anything that happens this year is a direct result of how good they are, and despite the shortcomings throughout the rest of the team.

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Quit arguing about non-baseball stuff yall.

#97 Re: One and Done

if you lose to Illinois but beat PSU, we could be looking at a three way tie for the big ten championship.

Illinois is not the best in the big ten, but i think they are a firm 3rd (i think we're a better team than Wisconsin). So we could win the rest of our games. Illinois could get ultra lucky and PSU could stumble and get upset by another team while OSU could lose to UM too. Illinois with back to back rose bowls!

And before you tell me i'm crazy, getting the rose bowl last year was a situation that was probably 1 in a 1,000,000.

(i know it's not going to happen)

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#30 Re: One and Done

My fun moment from last night. While in the men's room getting heckled as you would expect, one dude yells at me, "Go back to Chicago Cub fan" and I look up (i was just keeping my head down each trip there as i didn't want to get stabbed) and say real loud "Dude, I live in the (san fernando) Valley!"

The whole bathroom broke up laughing.

The he kinda stumbled and muttered something about going back to the valley.

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#41 Re: One and Done

Line to the bathroom was the worst...thank goodness my rebelious 13 year old roots for the Dodgers...my dutiful 10 year old is a Cubs fan. Yeah, we'll all be on the couch for awhile, but older son saved us with a lot of jokes from the Dodgers fans. As Rob mentioned, most were good-natured, all were drunk, and the only decent line (the first time at least) was reference to "101 years", not that clever, but at least they paid attention more than I thought. The guy next to me, actually was nervous through the final six outs and I kind of admired his passion, although clearly he had no reason to be nervous. Playoff atmosphere was fun, I've never seen the on-field celerbration in person before, kind of surreal, especially since it was the wrong team, and I dreamt when I scored G3 tix, that I might get to see the Cubs do it, that was a very long time ago...10 year old was very solemn at the end, and I almost feel bad for raising him that way, but he's playing his playstation now, so it can't be too long-lasting yet, and besides it'll make him tougher.

#33 Re: One and Done

on my venting side (as many of you know I am biased towards management and leadership failures). Here's how my interview with Lou would likely go:

Jimmer: So Lou can you pinpoint what went wrong.

Lou: (arrogant sigh) I don't know . . . you saw the games. What am I, a magician? I'm mystified. Could have been the scouting, Dodger's pitching, a cold stretch, who knows? But I only got 12 runs in 6 playoff games. hard to win with that.

Jimmer: Looking back could you have put the team in a better position to win?

Lou: (brow furling sigh) Look I'm not on the field. Do I have dirt on my pants? I don't feel pressure. There is no pressure . . . Americans have a lot on their plate. This is entertainment . . . it's unimportant. And besides the crowd at Wrigley was a bunch of executives . . .

Jimmer: Well wouldn't the people paying your salary disagree with that? It must be an important and difficult job or you wouldn't be paid millions of dollars.

Lou: One more question like that and I'll absorb you like a failing bank you pipsqueak? What do you make for asking stupid questions?

Jimmer: Ok. Some would argue that you don't respect the importance of winning game one of a short series. I mean last year you pulled your ace who was dominant in a tied game, in order to save him for another game that never happened. And this year you kept a pitcher in who had walked 7 batters in 4 2/3 innings. Would you have done that in a game 7 of the world series?

Lou: (Harrumph) Look, we can't play scared and I can't manage scared. It's too much pressure. And hey life is full of pressure . . . no need for it.

Jimmer: um ok. But two year's in a row you seemed to mis-gauge momentum and mismanage the pitching staff in what is essentially an elimination game: roughly 90% of NL teams who win game one of short series win the series.

Lou: (sigh) Where's the pizza?

Jimmer: What about batting Fukudome in the number two spot. Then playing him again in game two. Then benching him in game three against the one pitcher he knows inside out from years in Japan?

Lou: Look buddy, I'm chewing! (press room erupts in laughter - OH THAT LOU!)

Jimmer: ok last question. After two seasons of humiliating post season sleepfests. What will you do differently if you get in next year? manage game one like it's the last game of your life? line up your rotation better so that big game pitchers pitch in big games? Form a strategy and adjust if players are all swinging at pitches 4 inches outside for three straight games? Make sure the pitchers know that if they don't trust their stuff and pound the strike zone they are gonna CREATE losing situations? Put pressure on other pitchers by preaching patience at the plate? Using scrappy players in tough situations? I mean anything you can think of?

Lou: Glad you got all the answers shitbox. It doesn't work that way. I need three things: good pitching, good defense, and timely hitting. You know how to reach inside of a player and make that happen. Send me a memo. Next question . . .

Jimmer: but Lou that's your job . . .

#36 Re: One and Done

Jimmer, you are putting the blame where much of it belongs. How could Piniella fail to have the team ready after last year's playoff experience? What kind of manager in any enterprise allow employees to go into an important situation with the kind of mindset Dempster had in game 1 or the right side of the infield had in game 2?

#79 Re: One and Done

on a parallel track with you, i believe this series was lost in arizona game 1 a year ago. zambrano gets lifted early in anticipation of needing him for a game (4 or 5, your choice) which never takes place. lou is given unrlenting shit for this. and he files it away.

fast forward to game 1 2008 in wrigley. bottom of the 4th. (not the top of the 5th). cubs already lead 2-0. 2 men on, 2 men out. dempster's turn to bat. and dempster bats, and makes out. and the next inning the whole series goes down the drain.

dempster had already thrown 80'ish pitches in 4 innings. he didn't have "it" that evening. send up a pinch hitter- maybe ward, maybe fontenot, maybe cedeno. take a risk on knocking in another run or 2, and bringing soriano to the plate with more ducks on the pond. why are marshall and marquis on the playoff roster unless it is to pitch under this exact scenario? as well as potentially knocking lowe out, and running through some of the dodger bullpen.

instead lou replays mentally the tape from october 2007 and says "leave him in". and nothing good happened afterwards. for three games. and as every inning went by the collars just kept getting tighter and tighter.

all sorts of players had a hand in this turd-fest: soriano, dempster, ramirez, soto, infield defense. but it started with piniella.

rats. guess i'll get to catch up on my reading earlier than anticipated.

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"knowledge is good"

#34 Re: One and Done

I've reluctantly come to the conclusion that Soriano needs to somehow go. I just can't see how he's anything but a net negative for this team - the leadoff thing, the defense thing, the post-season disappearing thing - I know he's got a no-trade contract, but I just thing he needs to go.

#35 Re: One and Done

yeah, we need more scrappy white guys. That's what this team needs.

Will you shut up with stupid fucking comments like this.

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"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#40 Re: One and Done

Let's be fair.

He doesn't need to go, in large part because he's untradeable and irreplaceable in terms of the value he brings.

But he's also a guy with a 195/233/256 postseason line in 86 plate appearances. The only great postseason series he's ever had was way back in 2001 against Lou Pinella's Mariners.

By last night I had no desire to see him at the plate in any situation.

Edit: How does race have anything to do with this?

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The Todd Zeile of Internet handles.

#42 Re: One and Done

How is this about race?

Do you have a counter argument?

I can see the guy's point: Soriano can be a real drain at times. The failure here is to suggest the preferable alternative to Soriano. Maybe the suggestion is to go back in time and not offer him all the years and all the cash.

I definitely understand the frustration with Soriano, but my biggest problem with the Soriano situation now is that he is still in the leadoff spot. That and after 3 years he is still not even an average left fielder with his speed.

Also, a sidenote: white guys aren't the only players I've heard described as scrappy. Remember Juan Pierre?

#49 Re: One and Done

it's not about color (as stated below). it's about style of play. and juan pierre have never been described as scrappy.

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"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#54 Re: One and Done

Juan Pierre has often been described as both scrappy and a pest.

And when he was struggling in 2006 Len Kasper couldn't shut up about how early he shows up to start stretching.

Only reason anyone here is talking about color is because you made a sarcastic comment about the team needing more scrappy WHITE guys.

#46 Re: One and Done

It's got nothing to do with color. It's got to do with .280, 29HR, 75 RBI, 19 stolen bases. .344 OBP. Yeah, he was hurt some, but the Cubs are paying him team leader-type money, and they're getting a mediocre leadoff hitter with a low OBP, and whose defense makes routine fly balls an adventure.

#48 Re: One and Done

low obp. yup that's it. nevermind game over. you win.

did you know that he's second on the team in ops and ops+?

Did you know taht he lead the team in home runs in far less games?

He doesn't need to go anywhere, he's our best player. I tired of reading bullshit posts like this.

The scrappy white guy thing isn't so much a color thing but a style of play. People like you think that ryan theriots are what wins games. I'll take Sorianos.

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"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#55 Re: One and Done

I don't see anything about Ryan Theriot here except in your comments.

I don't completely disagree with your arguments about Soriano, Chad. His stats this year are actually pretty good given his number of ABs. I'm not sure I'd go as far as to say he's our best player, or even our best position player, but he was a plus on offense on the whole, even if he was frustrating to watch during some games. I'm not sure he's worth the contract he was given, but few Free Agents are really worth the money that they get, and once the contract is signed you can't take back the cash and spend it elsewhere.

#72 Re: One and Done

I think Soriano needs to go somewhere. I think it's somewhere between 4 and 6 in the lineup. His lack of playoff hitting would still hurt there, but hopefully not cripple the entire offense like it did over the last six playoff games.

When he's stealing 40 bases... well then you've got some sort of reason to hit him #1. But he doesn't do that anymore. Maybe Lou has to sell it to him, like it's to keep his legs fresher or something, but he's not a leadoff hitter. Put him behind some high OPS guys where the pitcher has to throw him some strikes.

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Livin' just a little, laughin' just a little, ain't easy.

#87 Re: One and Done

I think Soriano needs to go somewhere. I think it's somewhere between 4 and 6 in the lineup.

This is right on the money. And Lou just needs to tell him that it's in the best interest of the team, end of story.

#105 Re: One and Done

Yep, #6 sounds about right. He put up some of his best numbers batting deeper in the order for Texas and Washington.

#68 Re: One and Done

Chad just used ops+ in a discussion. I think the apocalypse is upon us.

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Let's hug it out, bitch.

#70 Re: One and Done

apparently if a Cub fan says anything negative about Soriano he's automatically racist now. What incredibly well balanced lucid logic. It probably has nothimg to do with his 3-28, 0 HR, 0 RBIs line he's put up in 07 & 08 NLDS as the guy who is supposed to facilitate the offense.

#75 Re: One and Done

I give the best player nod to A-Ram because he's better in the clutch.

Runners in scoring position and 2 out:

Soriano .206
Ramirez .283

Runners on and 2 out

Soriano .208
Ramirez .309

Close and late:

Soriano .260
Ramirez .423

Soriano was better with the bases loaded -- .600 (3-5) to .375 (3-8) -- and with a runner on third and less than 2 out -- .500 (6-12) to .294 (10-34).

#78 Re: One and Done

I'd also give A-Ram the patience and fielding nod. Soriano is the better base stealer, but neither of them seem to be very good base runners in that they both make mistakes.

#38 Re: One and Done

Well said, Rob. I feel like I've wasted the last six months of my life. I didn't have to have the Series, I could've lived with a pennant, I could've even justified 2003 redux. This was more painful than unexpected.

Hockey season mercifully awaits.

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The Todd Zeile of Internet handles.

#43 Re: One and Done

I found this site about mid-season and have been religiously reading ever since. I just want to say thank you to all for the ensight and entertaining comments. I hope the posts continue through the off-season.

#44 Re: One and Done

we're always here...might be a bit slow until the playoffs are over though.

#73 Re: One and Done

I would argue that we're a bit slow all year long.

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Livin' just a little, laughin' just a little, ain't easy.

#116 Re: One and Done

I think that has something to do with the 97 wins the team has this year. I've noticed that Winning is inversely proportional to bitching Cubs fans, hence fewer comments.*

*of course that doesn't hold true for BCB where bitching is always a prerequisite :)

__________________________

That's Manila with an "L"

#50 Re: One and Done

kiss ass. we all know that RobG sucks. He sucks so bad we should call him McG.

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"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#57 Re: One and Done

I found a new website for you to follow Chad

www.mentallyretardedcubsfans.com

#59 Re: One and Done

that is my site.

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#65 Re: One and Done

Might need to check your code, Rob. The link didn't work. Or maybe Chad's server is just down.

#69 Re: One and Done

Chad's server is perpetually down. We befriend him nonetheless.

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Let's hug it out, bitch.

#47 Re: One and Done

The thing that scares me is that we weren't significantly out hit by the Dodgers this series, specifically, the hits per game looked like this:

Game 1
LAD - 8
Cubs - 9

Game 2
LAD - 12
Cubs - 8

Game 3
LAD - 6
Cubs - 8

Its just that they had an uncanny ability to come through with clutch hits in key situations (Loney's GS in game 1 and double in game 3 in a series where he hit .214 is the most glaring evidence) while we had the uncanny ability to provide them gift wrapped opportunities (Dempster's walks in game 1, the 2nd inning errors and general fielding incompetence in game 2).

I mean, D Lee and Manny both had spectacular series and were the only two players to punch above their weight offensively in the middle of either lineup. The complementary players for both teams were bad; the only difference is our players got their hits with the bases empty and produced outs in run scoring situations while the Dodgers' players got their hits in high leverage situations and did very little the rest of the game.

I feel like I just watched a replay of last year, and it makes me sick.

#51 Re: One and Done

0 home runs 0 rbis and a HUGE error.

Lee did not have a spectacular series.

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#53 Re: One and Done

Lee's stats from the series:

AVG - .545
OBP - .583
SLG - .818

But if you'd like to pick some arbitrary statistics like "RBI" to base his performance off of, be my guest, although I'm not going to hold Lee accountable for the inability for Soriano and Theriot/Fukudome to get on base ahead of him.

#56 Re: One and Done

I think that Lee did at some times participate in the team suck, such as during the error and the few times he had someone on base in front of him and failed to drive him in, but unlike most of the rest of the team he at some times abstained from the mighty suckitude of this sweep. For that I give him credit. I hope he hits more like a premiere first baseman and 3-hitter during 2009 than he did in the 2008 regular season, but Lee wasn't the problem this post season.

#58 Re: One and Done

i didn't say he played bad. he stats are inflated by 3 doubles. woo!

home runs are not arbitrary. And i'm not about to get into an sabremetric argument right now.

He played well, but Manny WAY outplayed Lee. That is why you can't say that Lee had a spectacular series. He didn't.

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"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#106 Re: One and Done

If he wouldn't have led off or come to the plate every inning with the bases empty, there would have been a few RBI added to that stat line. He did ground into a big DP in game 1 though.

#52 Re: One and Done

I had intimated in September that I thought the Cubs would be "One and Done", so I was prepared.

My Cubs experience since 2003 is like Missouri - the "show me" State.

At game 1, my kids asked me to by them Division Champ caps and T-Shirts.

I said - "Guys, if they make it to the Championship Series, I'll buy 'em for you when we come to Game 1." I got off cheap, unfortunately.

I just want to ask if any of you would be for just doing a minor "blow up" and try to deal as many of these experienced chokers as possible? Go younger, faster, keep the core pitching intact and look for young arms. Go Beane for a while. The Rays had no problem not "choking" and look like world beaters compared to our "Playoff Tested" veterans.

How about it?

Also - I REALLY feel like the players should make a public apology, to all of us sick, obsessed, sucker fans that we are for fooling us once more with an absolutely pathetic display of baseball.

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Disappointed by "Cubbery" since 1966

#62 Re: One and Done

I pretty much agree with you, BUT I did not see a complete COMPLETE inability to compete coming. That is what surprised me most. Just unbelievable.

That said I was not confidant at all about the playoffs. I felt that if the Cubs got to face the Mets they would advance. Dodgers scared me a lot. Mets are bigger chokers than the Cubs and would have faced the same Big Market Media pressure -- new york style.

But this performance was worse than I thought.

I DID however feel the Cubs would not succeed based on these points:

1.) They peaked too early. Clearly Cubby swagger was gone by mid August.

2.) I had no confidence in Kerry Wood. I felt he would be the weak link, as well as:

3.) The fact that Zambrano and Harden were not themselves at the very least and injured at most.

4.) Finally the Fukudome effect (club wide patience at the plate) had worn off and of course he himself was no longer performing at all.

That said I do not think that the club needs to be blown up. I like Ramirez and Soriano and somehow think they are both capable of producing in future years and they are GREAT for getting us to the playoffs.

I think DLee did great but he is aging and Hoffpauir will be a nice option if Lee has to go.

I would lose DLee and try and upgrade starting pitching and closer and RF and have Fuku/Pie/Johnson battle it out there.

anyway . . . .

#63 Re: One and Done

"The fact that Zambrano and Harden were not themselves at the very least and injured at most."

Zambrano pitched very well.

__________________________

"I will ruin this house with my anger!" - Master Shake

#64 Re: One and Done

I agree Chad . . . these were my worries going into the playoffs. Before Game 1

#76 Re: One and Done

I think we're stuck with Lee for two more years.

Best case is that he lifts weights like just about every other first basemen in the majors, and get's his bat speed up to snuff so he can hit 30+ HR's again. If you're a first basemen at Wrigley, in today's game you need to hit 30 HR's, period.

Second best scenario is that he continues his decline and Hoffpaiur works himself into a straight platoon by the end of 2009, then Lee plays his overpriced caddy in 2010.

Hard to see us being able to get out of that contract before it expires, unless it's a salary dump-swap.

Totally disagree on Wood. Most of his problems this year came from bad luck with BABIP.

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Livin' just a little, laughin' just a little, ain't easy.

#133 Re: One and Done

People thought I was crazy last year when I said trade Derrek Lee.

People still think I'm crazy, but not about this.

I love Derrek Lee. This is not punitive, which is not a good reason to make a trade anyway. Trade Derrek Lee because he has a high trade value and he puts up Andre Ethier numbers. So do a lot of other people who are not considered superstars. What are we talking, .280 with 20 HRs and a bunch of doubles? Soto did it his rookie year, so can Hoffpauir. Trade Lee for bright high-level pitching prospects. The Cubs' good young arms were mostly at Daytona this year.

Until somebody shows me stats to the contrary, I maintain that Lee hits with more power than Soriano but 380 doesn't leave the yard when you always hit to center and to deepest right- and left-center. Everybody observes that Lee doesn't handle pitches well when they're inside or middle-in. That's because you have to swing earlier on those, and Lee is in no hurry to swing. He's pretty old and pretty set in his ways.

Overall, look at the bright side. We don't have to hate Dan Uggla any more.

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#135 Re: One and Done

I like Hoffpauir, but those older guys who have demonstrated no willingness to take a walk in the minors often don't translate their offensive abilities to the majors very well. I think expecting him to duplicate Derek Lee numbers is pretty optimistic. I think if you trade Lee it's at least in part to make room for a bigger bat at first base, someone like Teixera (who isn't even a lock to put up better numbers than Lee, but certainly could). I really do like Hoff, but his future on this team in PH/backup 1B or (if he can really improve his defense) RF.

#139 Re: One and Done

Hoffpauir can lose 80 points of BA transitioning to the majors--which is roughly what Soto did--and still hit .280. We're not talking about Dubois hitting .314 in 2004, where if he loses 65 points he's below .250. Hoffpauir hit .362.

The only PCL hitter (and that's 16 teams) who might have been slightly better than Hoffpauir was Nelson Cruz, who looks like he's taken over right field for Texas. Like Hoffpauir, he was called up in early September. Unlike Hoffpauir, he played, and batted .330 in 115 ABs with 7 HRs and 26 RBI. Cruz was 28 in July.

The Cubs have lost six in a row in spite of Derrek Lee's "leadership," whatever that is, and of course they say that Edmonds gives a pretty good locker-room speech too.

Again, we're not talking about trading Lee for Hoffpauir. We're talking about trading Lee for something significant and still having Hoffpauir to put at first.

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Tired of OBP? Join the club!

#144 Re: One and Done

Hoffpauir also had a .393 OBP, so if he loses .080 off of that he's down to .313. As a first baseman, if you've got a .313 OBP you'd better slug WELL over .550, which I don't think many people expect Hoffpauir to do while batting .280. He's got good power, but he has never hit more than 25 HRs in a season (prior to this year, his high was 22 in 2006).

Note also that Felix Pie hit .362 in AAA in 2007, but hit only .215 in the majors that year and followed that up by hitting .241 this year in the majors.

I for one feel that a huge part of Soto's success in the majors is his plate discipline and patience, neither of which have I heard anyone suggest Hoff has. I'd love for him to prove me wrong, but I don't think Hoff is a good enough prospect to justify trading Derek Lee at a point when his trade value has sunk.

Who do you think the Cubs get for Lee? I would say we need RF, CF, and, as always, you take whatever good pitching you can get. I'm interested to hear what reasonable package + Hoffpauir is more valuable than having Lee and Hoffpauir.

#154 Re: One and Done

Ok reality check fellas:

Derrek Lee has a full NO TRADE CLAUSE and he loves it in Chicago. As far as I have heard, the entire team likes the guy and he is not a problem in the clubhouse. Even if Hendry wanted to, he cannot trade him w/o his consent, and why would DLee want to leave when he is on a strong team in a great city?

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That's Manila with an "L"

#162 Re: One and Done

I'm not a big OBP fan and I hadn't noticed Hoffpauir's 31-point OBP-BA margin, which I guess is interestingly small. I would note that his OBP in 73 at bats with Chicago was .400, and that his career minor-league OBP-BA differential is a more respectable 55.

I never took Felix Pie's .362 number seriously for two reasons. First, it was less than half a season's at bats. Second, he was up and down several times, and I thought he got in a hot-cold cycle w