Who was the Cubs 2008 MVP?

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I went with Dempster, but it's very close. In my book, Soto or DeRosa you could make almost an equally strong argument for.

Dempster was the staff ace, so I gave it to him. Our rotation looks MUCH worse without him.

Soto and DeRosa were very very good. I would give the edge to Soto over them, because he plays a tougher position.

All 3 vastly exceeded our pre-season expectations.

Since when is exceeding expectations the same as the MVP?

It is amazing how few votes ARam is getting.

Where is this pitching staff without Geo? Blanco is great don't get me wrong, but he's a PT player at this point.

Aram is probably the best producer this season, but I just can't get past how valuable Soto's handling of the pitching staff is and how inspiring his breakout on offense is at one of the most difficult positions to find offense.

According to BP - with the one caveat that I threw out Dempster's batting numbers because BP does that wrong for pitchers (I guess another email is coming) here's the Batting/Pitching, baserunning and fielding Runs Above Replacement (as in a AAAA guy) for the candidates:

Dempster 82
DeRosa 76
Soto 60
Ramirez 57
Theriot 45
Marmol 36

Marmol obviously would look better in an evaluation that takes in leverage like BP's silly named stat or Win Probability Added. Oh, what the hell I am bored, lets look at WPA:

Marmol 3.77
Ramirez 3.31
Dempster 2.37 (-1.17 due to batting)
Lee 1.81
DeRosa 1.80
Harden 1.65
Edmonds 1.63
Soriano 1.41
Soto .95
Theriot -.22

Perhaps my expectations were too high, but I feel the Cubs got what they expected from Soto this year - average in the 280s, 20ish HR power, good game-calling. I know he's a rook but it's not like he came out of nowhere in Spring Training.

The only Cubs (IMO) that performed beyond anyone's wildest expectations this year were Dempster and some of the role players (Fontenot, the scrap-heap CF platoon).

I voted for Aramis because, considering his offense and defense, he was the most irreplaceable guy on the team, therefore the most valuable. IMO.

No they weren't. I really don't understand someone saying Geo Soto VASTLY exceeded expectations. ON the contrary, he just about perfectly met them-- batting average, power, defense and handling pitchers. Expectations were high. And he came through.

PECOTA's 50% forecast for Soto was .275 .353 .477. He actually hit .285 .364 .504, so in that sense he exceeded expectations. Was anyone surprised that he had a .868 OPS? Probably not, except maybe Manny because he came up as a Cubs farmhand.

There are no MVPs this year. This year was a year of failure. They all lose in my book. I call no MVPs until we at least make it to the NLCS.

Also Hendry deal is official (sorry if 3/44). 4 more years. I don't mind that Hendry will be with us another 4 years--he seems to be learning from his mistakes--but I'm not looking forward to seeing Manny's sig and hearing his endless griping over the next 4 years.

I went with Soto. Our offenses improvement from last year to this year because we went from the worst production in the NL at C to top 3 if not the best in the NL. Also he handled the pitching staff well for a rookie.

I think this is a race between Aram and Marmol. If you took Aram off the team, how many less wins would we have? His walkoff HRs (two?) are obvious, but Marmol had several holds that, in my opinion, if you look at the rest of the bullpen, would have been losses. If you take Marmol off this team, you could easily turn 1/3 of his holds into losses the way the rest of the bullpen threw.

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  • I figured this was going to be the most meaningless regular season in Cubs history...and it is pretty much on point, although I certainly didn't think we'd have close to a 14 game lead.

    But, one bad hop in game 1 in October could change absolutely everything we will remember about this year.

    blockhead25 19 min 32 sec ago view
  • This is awesome.

    https://twitter.com/JeffNuich/status/769227069788131329

    (CSN Chicago will air Vin Scully's call of the Sunday Cubs vs. Dodgers game)

     

    Rob G. 31 min 27 sec ago view
  • oh he's great, there's like 10 great pitchers in the NL right now that can flat out dominate though. Picking #2 (behind Kershaw) doesn't matter much to me right now. Much like whom the Cubs will play in the playoffs won't matter much, they're gonna be good teams.

    Rob G. 32 min 34 sec ago view
  • The Cubs great pitching has a lot more to do with their great defense this year and plenty of good luck  (#1 in ERA, #4 in FIP behind Nats, Mets and Dodgers with a rather ridiculous .258 BABIP against Cubs' pitchers).

    Cubs pitchers do strike out more hitters than Giants pitchers and do walk more hitters than Giants pitchers so that's a few more balls in play. Cubs' pitchers actually have a higher groundball rate though. Crawford is just really good and baseball happens.

    Rob G. 35 min 1 sec ago view
  • i do what i want.

    i run with 12 gangs and we only commit hate crimes.

    i do what i want.

    crunch 1 hour 39 min ago view
  • I was asking how well Scherzer holds on runners.

    #baseballtalk

    BTW, your used underwear remark sounds rather specific. Please don't project. Thanks.

    Tito 2 hours 8 min ago view
  • nothing gets you going like someone talking about lester, eh?

    i hope you're on his payroll or he sends you used underwear or whatever you're into.

    btw, he holds runners like shit. he does things with runners i've never seen another pitcher do in my life...even going back before i was born as far as i can tell. would you like to discuss it? that sounds like it could be educational and fun. hit me up, bruh.

    crunch 2 hours 10 min ago view
  • last year they won 97...and came in 3rd in the division. crazy game on a year-to-year basis.

    this year it's likely no one else in the division will win 90, though it's technically possible at this point.

    no matter what, this is a special team, though...very well rounded...and should be mostly intact next year with a bonus schwarber. chapman may not be around, but whatever...rondon and crew are capable even if not on chapman's level.

    crunch 2 hours 12 min ago view
  • How well does he hold on runners?

    #baseballtalk

    Tito 4 hours 6 min ago view
  • It's August 26. Cubs with 14 game lead. And not for #1 draft pick.

    Words I never thought I would type together.

    Jackstraw 4 hours 22 min ago view
  • One more victory to ensure a winning season!

    billybucks 6 hours 38 min ago view
  • If I were a betting man

    Give me the Dodgers tonite, not just because of
    Monty on mound.

    Two nights in LA for the kids? Woooo

    /Prove me wrong

    jacos 6 hours 38 min ago view
  • When Scherzer is on his game, he might the the most dominant and intimidating pitcher. A couple of games he has pitched against the Cubs when he had his stuff, and his mound presence was just powerful.

    billybucks 6 hours 40 min ago view
  • So are lack of chances due to the great pitching?

    jacos 6 hours 42 min ago view
  • TLS watch: 0-4 with Iowa last night. Saving his pinch hits for September.

    Cubster 7 hours 32 min ago view
  • Objectively true. Scherzer's FIP is almost a half point higher than his ERA, mostly I deduce because his BABIP is .249 so something ridiculous like that. It's not like the guy can't be scored on, but when I watch him, I sometimes feel that he's the most in control of the game moving around him.

    John Beasley 8 hours 16 min ago view