Ken Rosenthal Is Just Toying With Cubs Fans Now

The czar of trade rumors says the Cubs have emerged as a front-runner for the services of one Jacob Peavy, possibly ahead of the Atlanta Braves. It's widely believed  the Dodgers are the third team still in play, although Tim Brown as you'll see below mentions the Cardinals. Rosenthal even goes on to suggest that the Cubs may be willing to go 4 years and around $50 million on Dempster to have them both in the rotation for 2009 and beyond.

What's interesting is that the first line of Rosenthal's article seems to neglect someone.

Imagine a Cubs rotation that featured Jake Peavy, Carlos Zambrano, Ryan Dempster and Ted Lilly.

That someone would of course be Rich Harden, and although the article doesn't suggest any names going back to the Padres, the omission of Harden is a curious one. Chances are it was just an oversight on Rosenthal's part, but myself and some readers have suggested that Rich Harden might be an option for the Padres in a Peavy deal. Yes, the Padres are trying to cut payroll and yes, the Padres are trying to get some players that they'll have control over for four, five or six years, Harden though comes at a cheap price for 2008 considering his talent ($7M). And even though he's set to be a free agent after this year, it would give the Padres quite a bit of leverage for 2008. They could either try and resign Harden to an extension which is the unlikeliest of scenarios. Or they could trade him half way through the season, get out of half his contract and collect even more prospects to reload. They could also just let him pitch all of 2008 and then let him walk and pick up the two draft picks he's likely to fetch for being a type "A" free agent if he doesn't break down.

Rosenthal does say that if the Cubs acquire Peavy and resign Dempster, that pretty much means the end of the Kerry Wood Cubs era.

Tim Brown at Yahoo still says the Braves are the best bet to land Peavy and says that they're already working out contingency plans for players they'd trade away in a deal, as our the Cubs and Cardinals. The Cardinals supposedly said a week or two ago that they weren't willing to give up the types of prospects the Padres were seeking, but things can change quickly.

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btw, there was an ESPN snippet that the Cubs and Marlins were talking about Hermida and Scott Olsen. Someone at NSBB suggested that a possible 3-way deal might make some sense with Olsen getting flipped to San Diego

That would be awesome, but who would the Marlins get? Lord knows they'll want a fat haul.

That would be sweet, and I'd be willing to kiss Ceda, Colvin, Marshall, Pie, Cedeno, Hill, Tony Thomas, and just about whoever else goodbye to see that happen.

I'd say Soto can't go in that deal, and Marmol is probably so integral to the bullpen that the Cubs can't let him go without getting a quality reliever or two somehow. How much is Samninja, making again? Would his salary negate the Marlin's or Padres interest? Plus, I've gotten attached to Samninja--I was present at his debut; saw him airmail Soto on the pitchout and everything.

[Edit] Just remembered our right-side payroll, and it looks like Sam is making a little over $1 million (with raises in coming years?), which would probably not stop any team interested in him. I could see him wanting to go to San Diego, but I don't know about Florida (NTC).

I think a lot of this stuff is just trying to get negotiating power in the Dempster deal.

Hermida is a Poor Man's Dunn. Bad defense, high strikeouts, with decent power and some patience, He was rushed to the majors, had a very high BABIP in his one good year, and now the Marlins want to dump him because he's Arb eligible.

He's still young though, and he should get better, but he'll probably be a great player by the time he hits FA's. Years four and five he'll probably have more growing pains - and I don't know if that defense is ever going to improve. Typically outfield defense is something you have or you don't.

I've been saying it for a week now, but a perfect storm has developed for the Cubs to acquire Peavy. There may even be no need to include Harden. Dempster's agent is now saying he will not re-sign with the Cubs any time soon, and so the Cubs need to move on Peavy so that they don't lose out on both. If they get Peavy, they can then assess the situation and decide whether Dempster's worth it. Personally, I'd obviously love to see Demp, Harden, and Peavy, with us shipping Marquis out somewhere and eating $2-3m of his contract. There's enough pitching needs in baseball that he'll be welcomed somewhere, especially at a discount.

If you backload Dempster's deal, I think the contract situation is workable. Harden's potentially around for only one more year and Lilly for two, so there's some flexibility in trading either of them if necessary. And hell, who cares anyway? The team will be under new ownership by then and they'll have to figure it out. As much as I'd hate to see Wood go, it was likely that he was going to be overvalued this year anyway, and I'd rather shore up the rotation and offense and let the youngsters define the bullpen.

Another possibility is that they move Harden to the bullpen to replace Wood.

The other problem with trading for Peavy is that we definetly won't be able to trade for Roberts (or Johnson or any other leadoff hitting 2nd basemen), which means that we'll be stuck with Soriano/Theriot top of the lineup, unless we sign Furcal, in which case we'll have that for a month, then be stuck with Soriano/Theriot at the top of the lineup.

Fontenot in a platoon role had a .395 OBP last year, maybe we should just get a 2nd basemen who crushes lefties to platoon with him (assuming you don't like Cedeno for that role), and let them bat leadoff and let DeRosa play right. I think that DeRosa would probably turn into a pretty good right fielder if he plays there full time. I also think we saw the best of what he's cabable of last year, and his numbers are likely to be down across the board in 2009, though.

"Another possibility is that they move Harden to the bullpen to replace Wood."

I can't say that I think this is a bad idea, since fewer innings would likely help Harden stay healthy and he's got the two dominating pitches he would need to be a lights-out closer.

But Harden has the right to demand a trade, since the Cubs picked up his option, and most of these young starters really want to stay starters. I only see this happening if Harden has a health issue he's willing to admit to.

Yeah, Harden's a year away from FA. If the Cubs look like they'll be moving him to the pen, there's no way he won't demand a trade.

This guy (courtesy of says that the Phillies make check the market for Jimmy Rollins:

That would certainly fix the Cubs defensive shortstop and Soriano at the leadoff spot problems, though Rollins ISO OBP isn't anything to be proud of, he is a good base stealer, and he switch hits.

Problem is I guess they would want a young groundball starter, a power hitting left fielder and a shorstop for him, and we only have one of those things.

Maybe Rosenthal reads TCR, his lede has Harden in it now.

Funny, I just came over to post the same thing. Guess it was an omission.

We had a 'Super Rotation' in 2004 too though, and the 2004 team only had one guy with a history of arm troubles.

It's one of those things that looks good on paper - but I don't want to go into 2009 with those five guys and no Marshall or Marquis or Wood. Smardipants can't be the 8th inning guy and the 6th and 7th starters.

We still have Gaudin, right? If he's healthy, he's a serviceable 6th starter.

Yeah, I forgot about him. Maybe Atkins will be the real deal too.

I just don't want a repeat of 2005.

Peavy hasn't been very good in the playoffs, 0-2 his team losing all three times and 18 earned runs in 16 innings. Some of that is surely sample size, but some of it is playing on the road against good scoring ball clubs.

There's the 3.80 road ERA, the injury problems, the playoff struggles, and the fact that we'll have no depth if we trade our 6th starter, our 5th outfielder, our backup MI and our best power arm in the minors to get him, plus his salary after 2009 isn't much of a premium.

I think he's a great player, but I'll have nightmares us fighting for a playoff spot, starting a game with Atkins, Kroeger and Andres Blanco in the lineup.

Hilarious Neal.

I don't think Peavy's worth gutting the system for, but I do think he's a darn good (almost)26 y/o starter.

And I thought Andres Blanco was going to be the new hope in CF after we trade Pie this year... ;-)

I think you're thinking of Andres Torres.

*almost 28 y/o*

Another Rosenthal article reads 'The A's finished last in the American League in on-base percentage last season and last in the leadoff spot'.

Who would ever have thought that would happen? Maybe the book Beane wrote wasn't such a good idea.

And which book did Beane write? Could you enlighten us please?

Real Neal wins a one-year subscription to the "Joe Morgan Monthly Book Review and Cliche Collection".



10 Man's Head

; )

I don't want to break anyone's heart here, but my two cents.

I like the whole "Dempster's a joker and great clubhouse guy" thing, but methinks he's rapidly pricing himself right out of that. If he wanted to stay, it'd be done or a lot closer by now. I personally think if he wants to go see what he's worth, let him, but we won't be waiting around when he gets done. I'd also like to go on record saying that he'll definitely be overpriced, and I CAN NOT FATHOM him repeating his amazing year this year, much less being worth what he will certainly get for the next 4 years.

I'm also not sure I see Jimbo pulling Peavy out of his hat, but I'd sure as hell love to.

As for Kerry, I don't ever want to see that young man in anything except a Cubs uniform; I think he's earned his paycheck, and we should be willing to give it to him. HOWEVER, if he wants to go somewhere else instead, again, let him. He's earned it.

Back to Peavy. Man that'd be awesome.

While I'm rambling, I also want to offer that I believe personally Sean Marshall may be one of the most valuable pieces on this team. Yes, he's middle of the road, but he's middle of the road everything. Hell, if Lou needed an "emergency third catcher" I think Marshall would be middle of the road at that, too, and do it with a smile on his face and come out two days later to start because Harden wasn't feeling well.

Ok, sorry bout that, I'm done now...

Okay, I really get more and more pissed every time I read another quote or thing about Dempster wanting to make sure he's not giving too much of a hometown discount to the Cubs.

You mean the Cubs and Jim Hendry, who gave you a shot? Rescued you from the scrap heap? Kept you employed on your road to recovery? Helped get you back in the starting rotation?


The same Ryan Dumpster who, okay it's been long enough for me, ABSOLUTELY F___ING CHOKED in game 1 of the NLDS??


I said this the last time he was available, give me D Lowe's groundballing @$$ and forget Dempster.

How funny is the Harry impression gonna be in someone else's clubhouse, there Demp??

Peavy has a 10.13 playoff ERA, and it's OK to say 'fucking'.

I'd take Lowe over Dempster as well, about 3/44 for him? He's got some pretty bad home/away splits too, though.

And how about 6 HR in 62 AB with a .500 OBP in the esteemed Winter Liga Venezuela Beisbol Profesional for Mr. Kroeger!?!?

Torres, Blanco, too many Andreseses...

Hell, Ronny Cedeno was our next great starting CF for a second there.

And I know it's okay to say 'fucking', but I guess I'm always a touch afraid of some impressionable youngster ending up stumbling onto this

I'm sure the youngsters will get over it. Hell, they probably say the word 4 times more than you do.

From mlbtraderumors:

11:27am: Chris De Luca says the Cubs are in heavy pursuit of Peavy, partially because of steep contract demands from Ryan Dempster. He's heard Dempster wants five years, $75MM.

No deal is imminent, but De Luca wonders if pitchers Sean Marshall, Rich Harden, or Jeff Samardzija could be involved. Samardzija has a no-trade clause.

my thoughts are if Cubs think they can get Peavy and Dempster, Harden is certainly expendable, either for Peavy or to another team to fill in the holes from whatever they give up for Peavy. You've got 4/5 of your rotation set up for 2 years if both are Cubs in 2008 and 3/5 through 2012.

Not that they should or would trade Harden if they could get Peavy without him, he's just not a guy in the team's long term plans if somehow both Dempster and Peavy are Cubs in 2009.

I have real doubts that Samardzija is involved at all, they wouldn't give him that NTC and consider trading him at this point. That was a gesture to say we're not moving you, forget about football.

So who am I missing in the lower rungs of the minor league system that they may like?

Ceda, maybe James Russell? Cashner can't be traded...

DeLuca seems to be backtracking on the Cubs interest in Peavy, now calling it 'stepped up'. He gives some interesting, if irrelevant details. Then goes on to mention Sabathia and Burnett again... still no love for Lowe.

I wonder if Jim was able to ascertain the plausibility of dumping Marquis with little to no cash at the GM Meetings. I would guess that he has and it's plausible if he's toying with the idea of Peavy and Dempster.

I like this line...

A Padres insider indicated Peavy will be dealt this offseason and said
the club isn’t looking ‘‘for a home run, but at least a double’’ in
terms of the talent it would receive in return for the former Cy Young
Award winner.

fantastic GM'ing there Towers....

The Rosenthal article went black on me so I re-read it to see if there's an update, and there is this (which may not be an update)

'The Cubs' young pitching is not as close to the majors as the Braves' but still is attractive to the Padres, sources say.'

So if we can do some trade without Smardipants, Marmol or Marshall going - I am all for it. Not sure who the Padres like, but I'm all for the TINSTAAPP and 'win now' mentality.

If you manage to net Peavy without trading Marmol, Samardzija, or Marshall, you let Dempster walk and take your two draft picks to help replenish the system, since just traded off pitchers who are not that close to the majors. And I like Dempster, but that's the smart move.

Interesting, Marquis is definitely baseball's best 5th starter, and now would be the time to move him if it's at all plausible, as people will start to get nervy about who's gonna still be available in a month

Exactly, and now is also the time to move on Peavy. Apparently the Cardinals are getting more interested, and we can't compete with a package they could put together.

why not? Cards have a pretty poor farm system and doubtful they'd trade Rasmus, Perez or Garcia...

but you never know...

I was assuming they would be trading one of those three. If not, then yeah, we could probably beat their offer.

I don't doubt that Marquis is one of the best 5th starters around. The problem is he is being paid like a 3rd or 4th starter, which he is NOT good enough to be.

I'll probably get kicked for this but I live a sheltered life...


There Is No Such Thing As A Pitching Prospect.

You can probably do a google on it, but as I recall there's two factors - young pitchers tend to get hurt a lot more than 24+ year olds and the second factor says if you can throw strikes and miss bats in the minors you can do the same thing in the majors.

Dwight Gooden is probably the best example of TINSTAAPP's second point. Most Cubs draftees are example of the first.

Edit: Here you go

Thanks man, I'll look at that. I Love it.

That's funny. Before looking up what it actually meant, I tried to think of what it could be.

I came up with "This is not something to argue about, people, please!" which, in my mind, applies to this situation just as well.


double post - stupid internets

if you never take a chance on a pitching prospect you're left to a lesser chance of developing a top arm of trading away 2-3 bats for that arm.

there's pros and cons to both.

there's a lot of 1st/2nd round pitchers out doesn't help that those numbers are diluted by the hispanic out-of-country community where we can "train kids right" from age 12-14-16+. we don't get this luxury, on whole, from our development leagues here in the US.

not many people draft expecting injury...unless you're the yanks taking a guy like they did a few years ago...i'm still trying to figure that one out.

also... "Although there are a few categories of pitching prospects — particularly guys with good stuff, high strikeout rates and highish walk rates (think Homer Bailey) — that tend to improve more often than not, in general there is no systematic pattern of improvement after the age of 21 or so."

that's a load of crap unless you want to pool players together and treat them as if they're in some vacuum with the same brain and arm quality. i know everyone here has seen plenty to debunk that...and debunk it based on projected ceiling/talent, not age. i guess we should have gotten rid of marmol long ago and ceda is a lost cause.

drafting for a better chance isn't automatic and looking at the flipside of drafting bats, they've sure as hell haven't been safer bets for the cubs the past 15+ years.

It's not a load of crap, it's what these guys see when they look at trends for thousands of players.

The reason that they're drafted so high is that there's nothing more valuable than a healthy front of the rotation starter, with the possible exception of the Griffey/A-Rods. It takes four first round pitchers to turn into that, and only two first round hitters to turn into a guy with a significant ML career.

yeah, i noted that...maybe not clearly...but i think the method on whole is faulty for that very reason.

and yes, a 1st/2nd/3rd round pitcher being an effective 1st/2nd/3rd-round-type realized pitcher is rarer than the bat, but if take it at face value you're either going to be spending a LOT of money or trading a lot of prospect value to make up for not drafting them.

there's a lot of give/take on both sides i feel are too important to treat a guy like homer bailey like andrew brackman.

this was a comment on deluca's article I found both sad and humorous:

chynaman66 wrote:
the cubs are going get jake peavy,c.c. sabathia,mark teixiara,a.j. burnett,brian roberts,resign ryan dempster and turn kosuke fukudome into ichiro.have a record of 161 and 1[they'll lose 1-0 in 20 innings to the white sox the lucky s.o.b.'s]they'll win the division by 74 games they'll have home field for the playoffs because they'll win the allstar game cubs 24 american league 2 they'll do all this only to be swept by the mets in the first round.ok i admit it this season has me still a little bitter.

At first I thought this was criticism of cubs' fans optimism concerning the off-season, until it hit me this poor bastard was just venting much as all of us have to some extent...

Nice journalism by ESPN:

FYI, Jim Thome was on the 2005 White Sox and Orlando Cabrera is under contact for 2009.

On the other hand, the writer did seem to be aware that there's an American League team that plays in Chicago, so that was a nice start.

Rob Neyer of ESPN on the NL 3rd Base Gold Glove:

David Wright is a good third baseman, but I think he's getting those bonus points for being a great hitter. That said, most of the best third basemen were in the American League, and I did have Wright as the second-best third baseman in the National League, behind only Scott Rolen. And considering that Rolen played only 104 games on the field this season, Wright's selection is highly defensible.

wtf? I assumed it was just a bad link to last year's article or a bad cut and paste job by Neyer, but Rolen played 112 games at 3b last year and 115 for Toronto this year.

So I'm wondering if Scott Rolen is suppose to be replaced by another player...

further investigation shows that Ryan Zimmerman played 104 games at 3b in 2008, I'm sure that's what he meant to type.

Bad Neyer, bad editor....

Thome was not on 2005 White Sox(champs).

Sox traded sweaty Freddie Garcia to Phils for him (me thinks) after 2005.

I thought they traded Rowand for Thome and money, then traded Garcia for Floyd and Gonzalez.

That's right Rowand for Thome!

Either way Thome was not on 2005 team.

Thanks, Ronny.

Is that my pen, Patrick?

I gotta go to work. Have fun and keep the faith

no link to the actual story
San Diego GM Kevin Towers spoke to a small group of writers on his way out of the St. Regis.
He said that the Jake Peavy trade talks have progressed to a point where the pitcher has been told he’s going to be traded, it’s just a matter of when a deal is struck.
“That train has left the station,” Tower said.
Towers also revealed that he is dealing with three teams, all in the National League. He mentioned the possibility of Peavy moving as part of a multi-team trade.
The Padres are known to be dealing with the Braves and Cubs. The third team could be the Cardinals or Astros. The Yankees are not in the mix.
“It’s been narrowed down for quite a while and there have been no additions,” Towers said.

so Peavy should be a Brave by Monday?


I really think the Braves would be foolish to not get him. Besides Heyward and Hansen (sp?), all of their guys should be available. I read an article in an Atlanta newspaper when the Peavy storey first broke that marked like 7 guys off-limits. And I think they were serious. Braves, if your system is that good, why are you looking up at the Marlins in the standings?

I think Wren's point of view is they wont be this year and likely 2010 also, so why deal your best farm pieces for a pitcher with injury issues.

How's the Braves cash flow?

I mean maybe the covet those guys because they will be cheap.

going into the off-season the Braves were said to have appx $30 million available to spend after losing Teixeira, Glavine, Hampton, Smoltz(though he'll probably be back mid-season) so they have the $ it's just a matter of them wanting to keep their core of young cheap players. I guess the main question for them is if they do acquire Peavy whether they can realistically contend. Without a full season of Smoltz, Hudson is gone with TJ, an injury prone Chipper along with an offense that looks pretty mediocre on paper, and the Mets and Phils in their division, I don't see how they can contend even with Peavy unless 2 or 3 of their young guys all take major steps forward. Unless of course they sign a D.Lowe type SP too and trade for 1 or 2 more OFers.

well that was exactly they're offseason plan

2 pitchers and an OF...

and I read that it was more like $40M


that can be their "plan" but they're not going to outbid the Yankees or possibly the Mets for Lowe, certainly not Sabathia or Burnett, so their options are going to be limited in the SP dept. They may have to resort to overpaying for Dempster in which case I couldn't care less (that is if the Cubs land Peavy). I could see them signing Pat Burrell or Ibanez for LF though.

supposedly they don't care to give up Hansen which is what the Padres really want, suggest though that if they give up Yunel Escobar and some lesser prospects, that might be enough.

And anyway, if Yunel Escobar gets moved – the rumor we heard this morning was Jake Peavy for Escobar, Gorkys Hernandez and a young pitcher not named Tommy Hanson – then that means Johnson’s off the market.

Hendry can't top that. It's hard to believe the Braves were ever really out of it, but one wonders if he could have moved a little faster.

Escobar, Gorkys (who is at least 2 years away from the majors, and say Locke isn't that great a package. That's only one major league ready player. A package of Marshall, Pie, Ceda, and Cedeno is better than that imo. Marshall can be a #2-3 type SP in Petco, and Pie has a little more upside than Gorkys Hernandez no matter what most people here think of him, and at least he's ready to contribute .250 BA, 175 Ks, 22/35 SBs, and gold glove calibur D now. I'd hate to lose Marshall though. If the Cubs were to acquire Peavy, and lose Dempster/trade Marquis, that would leave the Cubs with a rotation full of 6 inning SPs. Peavy has recorded exactly 15 outs past the 7th inning in the last 2 years, exactly 1 last year, so you add that to Lilly, Harden, Z there is going to be an even greater need to keep Wood in order for Marmol to remain in that 7th-8th inning stopper role, not to mention it would still behoove Hendry to acquire a solid 7th/8th inning type lefty out of the pen as well. I'd be content with even A.Rhodes on a 1 year deal.

Here's the link I was referring to on the original article by this O'Brien guy:

Off Limits:

Jason Heyward
Julio Teheran
Tommy Hanson
Freddie Freeman
Jordan Schafer
Gorkys Hernandez

I read that article and was like 'Yeah sure'.

Let me ask this...

If the Braves can't compete, (and I think we all agree they are not ready to yet) why would Peavy waive his no trade clause to play for a team that can't contend and move his family (since he loves San Diego so much) for basically a lateral move? What does moving from one shitty team to another solve if he supposedly only cares about competing?

And I know he supposedly named the Braves as one of his 5 teams of choice, but i am just asking to see if anyone has thoughts on this.

The Braves can compete with healthy pitching.

They play in a pitcher's park and scored more runs than the Brewers.

Add Peavy, Dempster and Burrell to that team, and they'll be in the thick of it in the NL East. You only need 90 wins to win that division.

mainly because he grew up a Braves fan in AL. The Braves likely won't contend in '09 but they can by '10.

braves were -25 in run differential, just 3 games under .500 and a ridiculous 11-30 in one-run games. They're not that far behind anyone in that division.

a LOT of injuries and a lot of bad luck last year....


first i've heard of this...

"Singh and Dinesh Patel, both 19, pitched in front of some 30 major league scouts on Thursday at a Tempe sports clinic. The tryout was among their rewards for winning an Indian reality TV show called "The Million Dollar Arm," which drew more than 30,000 contestants."


they even got to work with tom house which is either good or desperately tragic depending on how much you follow mr. arm mechanics blog dude who's name i forget.

I'll tell you right now, the team that has the brain to throw one of them a $100,000 contract will make back that money 10 fold in merchandising.

Surprising that they have access to hear about the TV show but didn't speak English. It's pretty widely spoken and if you have TV and/or the internet, you'd expect to have had four or five years of English in school

they may have come from the undeveloped areas based on advertising/stories in the media.

you know this already, but india is f'n vast in social-economic spread and it doesn't take a 100+ mile trip to see it in action.

hell, a 19 year old who throws high-80s...if he can replicate it without bad initial mechanics he's worth a shot.

I'll have to check with some friends and see how popular the show was - typically though with these reality TV shows the first iteration is going to have a low budget, then if it's successful you use that popularity to attract more talent - like American Idol.

It could be that someone was just stapleing paper signs up at the Cricket fields. Kids in India aren't quite as crickett crazy as Latin Americans are about football and baseball, though. It's still sort of an 'uppper class' sport, as I understand.

But I've always thought that the Indian body type lends itself a little more to baseball than say the Chinese. A little broader of shoulder, and probably more 6 foot+ tall people there. I stayed at the hotel where the Pakistani national team was once, and physically, they looked a lot like baseball players.

it was promoted in part with US money by a cali. sports management team.

..and much like american idol, i imagine they get 1st right to represent them in the US market (or any market, maybe) with their 1st professional contract.

You know, I hadn't really thought about that - But American Idol is a freaking scam. They get huge money from FOX to make their show, and they treat the singers like indentured servants. Needless to say, Simon Cowell is a capitalist.

Simon Cowell, the judge is also just another of the shows' indentured servants. The producer is Simon Fuller.

The surprising thing is that they have the name Patel!

anyone who tries to correct me will get killed.

I guess that means their family is in the Hotel owning business.

Cardinals trying to get in on the Holliday sweepstakes.

and the Mets clipped Crumbs Krause from the scouting dept today according to Davidoff.

That article begs two questions:

Why,when they have Ludwick?

Does Holliday shave his arms?

there's been a lot of early rumors reguarding ludwick in trade talks.

not seen/heard anything from the media, but it seems he might not be as valued by the organization as his numbers (and consistency) show...or expendable based on their future plans...

yeah, he Ks a lot and isn't the slickest OF'r, but wow...i'd want a LOT for a guy who showed what he did last year. it's not like he crutched on 1-2 months or something.

clearly STL is trying to sell high on Ludwick. Obviously they believe his '08 was a fluke..or they're fine with using Schumaker off the bench. He has CF production from a corner OF spot after all. From everything that has been posted, it appears the Cards will attempt to trade either Ludwick or Ankiel for MI help. What I find hard to believe is that guys like Holliday and Atkins aren't doing everything they can to stay in COL. Holliday would go from a top 5 overall ML hitter to something like a Jason Bay circa 2005 when he leaves Coors, and Atkins will be lucky to compete with Kouzmanoff's numbers. He's woeful away from Coors.

Sort of like Cincy did with Hamilton last year.

Part of me thinks i'd rather trade for Holliday, move Sori to right, and resign Demp and Wood...

I realize thats another right handed bat, but we're priced out of Tex and nobody else really fits the bill. The Rockies are losing Willy Taveras and could use Pie, they want a ML ready starter and we have Marshall/Marquis... Then we can go Soriano, Theriot, Holliday, ARam, Lee, Soto, DeRosa, Fuku, P...

Again, no lefty in there... but lets hope whats holding up the Peavy deal is DPLee waiving his NTC so we get Gonzo in the deal...!

Not sure what you mean by 'the bill' but Bradley, Abreu and Giles are some names that have been thrown around here recently.

Rosenthal has re-hashed his post:,-B...'-Peavy

Making it into a Braves vs Cubs thing.

He keeps saying 'If the Cubs acquired Peavy, their rotation immediately would be considered one of the game's best, particularly if they also re-signed free-agent right-hander Ryan Dempster to go with righties Carlos Zambrano and Rich Harden and left-hander Ted Lilly.'

Someone should tell him that he writes like he speaks, which is odd, and that the Cubs already have one of the games best rotations.

slightly different package than what was reported earlier

The Braves' package includes shortstop Yunel Escobar, either
left-hander Jo-Jo Reyes or right-hander Charlie Morton and a third
player, believed to be a top prospect, sources said.

no word on the Cubs offer, although mentions it might be a 3-team deal with the Cubs (possibly Marlins?)

AL Gold Gloves are out, and they look suspiciously similiar to the Silver Slugger awards


I think they should apply the same rules to infielders that they do to out fielders - since thirdbasemen are just shortstops with no range and secondbasemen are shorstops with no gloves they should give the award to three shorstops every year.

Bradley can't stay healthy and we have no DH, Abreu is getting too old and i doubt we could get M Alou 2002-04 type years from him, and unless the Padres include Giles in the Peavy deal he going nowhere...

And Holliday doesn't make our lineup more balanced while hurting our defense.

Well he's just as good defensivly as any of the players mentioned... just saying he'd probably cost alot less in prospects...

If Hendry does land Peavy it will be with someone else whethers its giles/green/gonzales...

"just saying he'd probably cost alot less in prospects"

Less than whom? Giles?

Bradley and Abreu are free agents, no? Not to mention that if Holliday is traded it will probably be among the seasons biggest deals.

I'd say Swisher and Hermida are probably available for less and meet the teams needs more closely, and Bradley and Abreu can be had without giving up any current prospects (though they will cost draft picks), and also meet the teams needs more closely than Holliday.

Defensively, the question isn't whether Holliday plays better LF than these other guys play RF, it's whether Holliday in LF and Soriano in RF is as good as Soriano in LF and Abreu/Bradley in RF. Soriano is not so good at reading fly balls and what not, so playing the sun field would likely create more problems for him.

Bradley won't cost any draft picks.

Soriano's arm is a little short for playing right field.

“We’re not to the point where we’ve agreed on who the players are coming back. We just have an idea of who’s available to us and who’s not,” Towers said. “Now it’s just a matter of looking at three priority teams that are involved and trying to figure out what our optimum deal is. Some of them involve third teams and potentially fourth teams, so it becomes a little more complicated.”

I think the offer has to be something like

Olsen and Hermida to San Diego
Peavy and Greene to Chicago
Ronnie, Pie, Marshall and maybe more to Florida

Um. Screw that. I want Hermida, not Greene.

Oh, it doesn't matter what I wish for? Fuck baseball. Just like real life.

I'd be tempted to deal those guys directly to Florida for Olsen and Hermida, but that sure ain't gonna happen.

yeah...maybe more to both clubs...

Cubs probably have more interest in Hermida than the Padres, Greene hasn't been mentioned at all with the Cubs. If the Cubs get a middle infielder, he'll be left-handed.

I don't mind Hendry sending Hermida to SD instead of to CHC, if he has a plan for another guy like Swisher. He better not settle for Giles.

Other teams have shown interest in Greene, including Baltimore. Hendry could always take him and then swing another deal for a left-handed bat, possibly Roberts (not that it would be Greene for Roberts straight up).

Less than for Peavy... and use the cash to resign Demp and Wood...

Use the reply link so we can know who you're responding to.

Sounds like Dempster will cost about as much as Peavy now.

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