Game 119 Thread / Cubs @ Braves (1 of 3)

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SP Jason Marquis SP Charlie Morton

7-7, 4.73, 67 K, 47 BB, 123.2 IP
3-5, 5.70, 32 K, 22 BB, 53.2 IP
       
LF Alfonso Soriano RF *Gregor Blanco
RF *Kosuke Fukudome SS Yunel Escobar
1B Derrek Lee 3B #Chipper Jones
3B Aramis Ramirez C #Brian McCann
CF *Jim Edmonds 1B *Casey Kotchmann
2B Mark DeRosa LF Omar Infante
C Geovany Soto CF *Mark Kotsay
SS  Ryan Theriot 2B *Kelly Johnson
P *Jason Marquis P Charlie Morton

 

UPDATED UPDATE: Marquis will start the first game in today's day/night doubleheader with our man Harden going in the nightcap. Otherwise the lineup remains unchanged from last evening.

UPDATE: Nevermind, the game has been called.

The Cubs try to stay North of the standings as they head South to play the Braves and Marlins on a six game road trip. Fresh off a 6-3 homestand, where they managed to lose a game and a half in the standings, the Cubs will look for their sixth straight road win tonight. 

The start goes to Rich Harden, who will look to rebound from his first non-amazing Cub start against the Astros last week. This will be his second start at Atlanta this season, whom he beat with seven innings of eight strikeout ball back in May. Do it again! Do it again!

And no, I have no idea why Kosuke Fukudome is batting second tonight. It's certainly not because of the .227/.306/.360 line he's put up since the All-Star break.

Comments

This game probably doesn't happen due to the rain.

double header tomorrow? yikes.

they might wait until Thursday, looks like it'll still be raining through tomorrow morning at least.

blah.

gameday says the game is postponed.
cubs.com doesn't say anything yet.

Cubs can afford a DH this week....better now then September like the last few years.

first game at noon second one at the time it was suppose to start tomorrow.

wonder what that'll do to the rotation, they do have an off-day on Monday, but they'll need somebody for Sunday's game. I suppose Sean Marshall.

With Marquis being a "sinker-ball" (too bad his pitches dont) pitcher starting on 3-days rest should be a good thing as sinker-ballers tend to pitch best on 3-days rest. If they do go outside the rotation for a starter do wonder if they'll go with Marshall since if they do they would be 1 man down in the pen for 3 days until Marshall recouped from the spot start, of course, they could always DL Ward before the game on Sunday and recall a RP and go with 13 pitchers until Marshall is ready to pitch in relief again. I think they will play it by ear with Marshall being penciled in unless they need a long guy between Thursday and Saturday then you likely see Marquis on 3-days rest or a minor leaguer like Atkins, Rusell, or Veal if it happens to be close to their turns on the farm.

(EDIT): After looking at the I-Cubs and Smokies wesites only 2 starters are posting sub 4 ERA's at those levels and they are Mitch Atkins and Randy Wells. Atkins next start is on Thursday V. NO and Wells threw tonight so his next start would be Sunday aganist the Zephyers. I am sure AZ Phil would know for sure, but I dont think Atkins is eligable for either Free agency or the Rule V draft while Wells is, so it would be more likely Wells will get the call-up, if they decide to go that route for the start, since he will be put on the 40-man by the November deadline anyway and that his turn falls in line with the opening we have for a spot start.

I don't know how Lieber's progressing these days, but it's more likely that Marshall, Lieber or Samardzija get that start before Atkins or Randy Wells does.

If the bullpen needs reinforcements you start Marshall and send him down and call up Wuertz or Ascanio or whichever reliever isn't sucking in Iowa right now.

Wells should absolutely be added to the 40 man at season's end. We can call him up to pitch. Send him back down the next day. Recall him before September 3rd. And he will still have 3 options as of spring training next year.

Did Pitchers warm up at all?

"pregame show" came on the air with the tarp already on the field and len/bob giving a real quick...hi, bye, 12pm central doubleheader tomorrow...blah blah blah

looks like any work they did was earlier in the day. the tarp on the field didn't have any grounds crew around it...it had been there a while.

Marquis starts game one, Harden game two tomorrow.

Bummer. Was looking forward to the WGN telecast. Hope tomorrow's is on WGN ... probably not.

Game one will be on the Superstation.

Disappointing for me out in LA since I could have seen today's game after work. No way I can watch a 10 am PT game.

or they just set up a pitching machine?

Rsox score 10 in the first, 2 hr's by Ortiz and 6 RBI's.

Looks like a crucial error as Feldman got charged with only 4 earned.

10-12 tex/bos, top 5th...

uuuugly.

middle 6...tex takes the lead

15-14

rsox up 19-16 going into the 9th...

-edit-

rsox win...19-17

37 hits, 13bb, 4 errors...

truely a game to forget.

I still hate that scoring standard. If a pitcher gets shelled and gives up 6 runs after an error, that means the pitcher sucked. If he didn't face those guys after the error, he would have faced them the next inning.

I've always felt that an error should wipe out the batter and all runners on base...but anyone following the error who gets on base, and comes around to score, should count as earned runs.

I used to think the same thing, but the longer a pitcher is out there, the more tired he gets. There's no way to really predict what would happen had the error not occured, but often times the pitcher may have been able to get out of those situations with less damage.

Kosuke: "Let's play 2!"

3 out of 6 days with no game sucks donkey balls. I'm watching fucking gymnastics for Christ's sake.

No. You wanna know what sucks donkey balls? Try driving from Birmingham, AL to Atlanta and finding out that the game was called after being in Atlanta for an hour.

That sucks donkey balls. Eddie Murphy's balls are very happy right now.

bleh.

almost every player on the 40-man is usually put on waivers after August 1st...

Would we want him anyway? Having a horrible year.

I could see the dellusion-wrapped Astros getting him to replace Lee, but Detroit would have to cough up some cash for that '09 salary.

eeks, sorry hawkeye.

Brewers win 7th straight. Another dominating pitching performance by their back line starters...with CC and Sheets on the mound the next two nights. Cubs need to keep on winning, or this will turn around in a hurry.

I'm just glad they're our bitches.

St. Louis Cardinals, 3rd place, 7.0 games back... with their current record they would easily lead any of the other NL divisions.

How do you like them apples?

n/t

Question from AZ Phil or anyone else who may know...

An Arizona newspaper is reporting that Micah Owings is one of the PTBNL in the Dunn deal.

Isn't this impossible?

I thought that a PTBNL must change leagues (or not be on the 40-man roster).

Any ideas on how this works if it is a waiver issue? From what I have heard, Owings was claimed on waivers, though by a team worse than the Reds.

UDPATE: Oh wait... he is in the minors, but he is also still on the 40 man roster.

Interesting trade:

- Owings can hit better than Dunn (.288 BA vs. .234 BA)

- Dunn can probably pitch better than Owings (5.93 ERA)

- Owings can hit better than Dunn (.288 BA vs. .234 BA)

Owings: .288/.351/.385 OPS+: 90
Dunn: .234/.375/.529 OPS+:132

But yea... Dunn may pitch better. And maybe Cinci is thinking about turning him into an OF, not that they don't have any.

I think that was a tongue-in-cheek comment, but okay.

Yup -- just having a laugh.

Owings had been sent to AAA. So he did change leagues. A PTBNL can be on the 40 man. He just has to change leagues.

AL - NL
AAA - NL or AL

Jimmy Edmonds hits another one. Hopefully the runs keep coming so Lou can rest some of the starters for game 2.

I like Jim Edmonds

Who doesn't. * I always did kind of liked him.

Ryno

* By "always" I mean I never liked him at all. In fact I thought he was kind of a douche, but if he wants to hit home runs for the Cubs and be awesome this year, I can be a Jim Edmonds fan.

Why didn't Soto's fly-out to right field score DeRosa? Was it a shallow fly?

Michael Barrett's best year

55R 16HR 65RBI

Geovany Soto's rookie year
so far...

47R 18HR 67RBI

I heard once there's a difference playing for a team that leagues the league in OBP or a team that is 2nd to last. Can anyone confirm?

home runs are not team dependent. And you can say all you want about team OBP, but really it times at bat with runners on that is more important. Just because Barrett played on a low obp team doesn't mean, necessarily, that he had less chances.

uh what?

anyway, you can look it up on BR.com if you wish.

Soto has come to bat with 328 men on base this season (at the 120 game mark). The ML average at this point is 275 for a hitter.

Barrett came up in 2004 with 314 men on base for the whole season. The ML average for the season was 318 for a hitter.

Soto had 56 of his RBI's in the first half where he spent the bulk of it hitting behind Lee, Ramirez and Fukudome. Their first-half OBP: .372, .386 and .383 respecitvely.

 

Well... it isn't too hard to figure out, is it? Lets take a look.

Barrett, 2004, RISP: 128 PAs
Soto, 2008, RISP: 141 PAs

So yea... it looks like Neal's point is right on in terms of RBI. Runs would also be very team dependent.

Cubs, 2004: .268/.328/.458 OPS+: 105
Cubs, 2008: .281/.357/.447 OPS+: 112

I was actually thinking of 2006 when Barrett drove in 37 of a possible 261 runners, for 14.2% He drove in 15.6% in 2004.
Soto this year has driven in 49 of 333 runners, for 14.7%

Where's Ron Santo today?

He's taking a rest. So he didn't go on the road trip.

What did Bobby do to get ejected this time?

he hit the ump's wife?

/I'll show myself out 

She just wouldn't listen.

What? Rob started it...

According to Yahoo, Cox was ejected for "arguing a delay in the game involving the lights".

Bobby: "I said BUD light, dammit!"

for "arguing a delay in the game involving the lights"

...sigh

Remember back when Jim Edmonds joined the Cubs? We were all so happy and welcomed him with open arms. And then we all went out for ice cream...

I know I really showed great judgment when I said of the move, and I quote, "UUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH."

That was an uuuuuuuuuugggghhhh of excitement and anticipation.

i remember quite clearly welcoming him the entire time.

That's because you wanted to frost his tips.

For the record I had a 'nothing to lose' attitude about Edmonds. Its probably been Hendry's 2nd biggest move after the Ramirez trade. Jury still out on the Harden trade, but that could definitely be right up there.

Karros and Grudzillanek trade
Lee trade
Dempster Signing
DeRosa Signing
Lilly Signing
Garciparra trade

Submitted by Chifan on Tue, 08/12/2008 - 11:13pm.

I am sure AZ Phil would know for sure, but I dont think Atkins is eligable for either Free agency or the Rule V draft while Wells is, so it would be more likely Wells will get the call-up, if they decide to go that route for the start, since he will be put on the 40-man by the November deadline anyway and that his turn falls in line with the opening we have for a spot start.

===================================

CHIFAN: Mitch Atkins is (first time) eligible for selection in the December 2008 Rule 5 Draft, and while he is a lock to get added to the 40-man roster, I suspect he won't be added until sometime around the November 20th deadline, when more roster slots are available after guys like Howry, Ward, Lieber, et al have filed for free-agency.

Submitted by Dr. aaron b on Wed, 08/13/2008 - 10:27am.

Wells should absolutely be added to the 40 man at season's end. We can call him up to pitch. Send him back down the next day. Recall him before September 3rd. And he will still have 3 options as of spring training next year.

========================================

DR AARON B: Randy Wells is a lock to be added to the 40-man roster post-2008, so it certainly would not be a problem to bring him up immediately if there is a need for his services.

As you said, even if he was recalled today and optioned back to Iowa tomorrow, he would not use up an option if he is recalled before he spends 20 days back at AAA.

It's probably 50-50 right now whether Wells will be added to the Cubs MLB active roster in September, but he will need to be added to the 40 no later than the day after the World Series because he is eligible to be a minor league FA post-2008.  

Submitted by big_lowitzki on Wed, 08/13/2008 - 8:24am.

Question from AZ Phil or anyone else who may know... An Arizona newspaper is reporting that Micah Owings is one of the PTBNL in the Dunn deal. Isn't this impossible? I thought that a PTBNL must change leagues (or not be on the 40-man roster).

Any ideas on how this works if it is a waiver issue? From what I have heard, Owings was claimed on waivers, though by a team worse than the Reds.

======================================

BIG LO: Any player on a minor league roster at the time a trade is made (including any player on a 40-man roster who is on optional assignment to the minors) is eligible to be a PTBNL. And any player who is on an MLB or minor league DL at the time a deal is announced has to be a PTBNL until he is eligible to be reactivated from the DL.

Any player on a minor league roster who is not on optional assignment off the 40-man roster (as was the case with Dallas Buck) does NOT have to clear waivers before he can change organizations, but because Micah Owings is on the Diamondbacks 40-man roster, he would have to clear waivers before he can be sent to the Reds.

So if Owings is indeed one of the players the D'backs are supposed to send to Cincinnati for Adam Dunn (and it appears that he is), and if Owings was in fact claimed by an N. L. club with a lower winning percentage than CIN, that just means the Reds will have to wait until the day after the conclusion of the regular season before they can acquire him from AZ. BTW, the other PTBNL in the Dunn deal could very well be another player on the D'backs 40-man roster on optional assignment to the minors who can't clear waivers (possibly catcher Wilkin Castillo).

In the meantime, it's kind of awkward because Owings remains at Tucson under control of the Diamondbacks. Of course it will REALLY be awkward if Owings suffers a significant elbow or shoulder injury between now and the end of the regular season. If that were to happen, it's possible that the Reds would ask for a replacement PTBNL, and that could get a bit complicated. .

AZ Phil,

Since Justin Upton is currently on the DL right now. He is a possibility as a PTBNL going to Cincy?

Submitted by Dr. aaron b on Thu, 08/14/2008 - 11:56am.

AZ Phil, Since Justin Upton is currently on the DL right now. He is a possibility as a PTBNL going to Cincy?

=========================

DR AARON B: Yes. 

A PTBNL cannot be on an MLB 25-man roster when a trade is made, and he cannot play for his "old" team again at the major league level after the deal is made, either.

So if Micah Owings is (as expected) a PTBNL in the Adam Dunn deal, he has to stay in the minors (on optional assignment) until he gets moved. He can't play for the Diamondbacks in September while the D'backs and Reds are waiting for the end of the regular season.  

And if Justin Upton is a PTBNL in the Dunn deal, he has to either remain on the AZ DL until he can clear waivers, or remain on the AZ DL through to the end of the season. I guess the D'backs could send him to the minors on optional assignment until he is officially transferred to CIN, but he can't play in the big leagues with his old team after he is reactivated from the DL and then still be eligible to be a PTBNL in a deal that was made while he was on the DL.  .

Interesting, but I would be totally shocked if Upton was a PTBNL.

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  • They've mentioned Henry Rodriguez (2013), Chris Carpenter, and Andrew Cashner as Cubs who have gone 100+. They said Rodriguez was tops at 100.8. Who knows before 2008?

    QuietMan 53 min 44 sec ago view
  • Regarding Heyward--

    He'll play regardless of what he does, just like Soriano played for seven years before they finally ditched him.

    What can they do? All I can think of is they can keep hiring and firing hitting coaches until they find one who can get him to stop hitting balls with the handle of the bat.

    (All those broken bats added to his paycheck is just a bit much.)

    VirginiaPhil 54 min 22 sec ago view
  • Lester will probably be all right.

    I think Arrieta might have added too much muscle preparing for that butt-naked ESPN photo shoot. Pitchers are supposed to be loose, not muscled up.

    Seriously.

    VirginiaPhil 1 hour 49 sec ago view
  • I have basically written off Heyward for this year -- if you are working on major swing changes in late July, you are going to struggle. Hopefully, he can be more productive at the plate next year. It will be interesting to see what they do with him if the Cardinals keep winning and close the gap. Heyward is dead last in the NL in slugging and in the bottom 5 in OPS -- yet still has a positive WAR. Hunh.

    billybucks 1 hour 4 min ago view
  • Has anybody in a Cub uniform ever thrown a ball 103 before?

    VirginiaPhil 1 hour 7 min ago view
  • He certainly looks better, no doubt, and is a different player than what we saw when he first came up. Full credit to him for changing his approach and saving his career.

    But he has zero walks in 35AB since the break, and 10 in 251 AB all year. He does seem to be able to hit some pitches out of the zone, but, a guy with his pop should be drawing more walks. However, it's easy to forget he is still only 23, and probably trying to make an impact to prove he should be an everyday player.

    billybucks 1 hour 16 min ago view
  • The usual suspects, Molina and Wong. Gyorko drew a walk with two outs, none on. I recall us (particularly Szczur and Bryant) swinging at everything Familia threw.

    VirginiaPhil 1 hour 18 min ago view
  • Yup. Thanks Q

    The E-Man 1 hour 24 min ago view
  • QuietMan 1 hour 32 min ago view
  • I for one hope that Sosa comes back soon.

    Rob Richardson 1 hour 51 min ago view
  • O/B interesting you should mention that. Google ESPN Science Aroldis Chapman and you'll be treated to how his mechanics and delivery are possibly historic. It's the 120% of his body stretch plus the torque. They compare him to the Unit and NRyan.

    The E-Man 2 hours 29 min ago view
  • Amazing how much lower the production gets when Bryant runs into a mini-cold streak. He doesn't stay cold for long. If just one of Zobrist or, gulp, Heyward, gets hot, they oughta have one more really nice winning streak in them. Having a closer that you have absolute confidence in can't hurt.

    Old and Blue 3 hours 14 min ago view
  • I hope they hold onto Jimenez. Outfield depth is questionable, especially with McKinney, who struggled this year but still, gone.

    Old and Blue 3 hours 25 min ago view
  • You don't think he's improved? He looks completely different out there than he did when he first came up. The last I checked his K rate was in the low 20% range - 22-23 or so. When he came up it was 40%+.

    To me, what is scary about him if I'm the other guy is that he IS learning the strike zone. This guy could easily be the MVP someday.

    Old and Blue 3 hours 26 min ago view
  • So, playing .500 for the rest of the year puts them at 91 wins. You would think there is enough talent to do a little better than that, right?

    The E-Man 3 hours 45 min ago view
  • First team to 60 wins! Onward to 70, 80, 90 and 100!

    billybucks 12 hours 15 min ago view