Theriot Called Up

Submitted by Rob G. on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 2:45pm
West Tennessee's MVP shortstop Ryan Theriot has been called up for today's game, a move necessitated by Ronny Cedeno breaking his left hand on Saturday, being most probably out for what's left of the season, and therefore leaving the Cubs light up the middle. Due to expanded rosters, Cedeno avoids the disabled list, but Kerry Wood has been shifted to the 60-day DL to make room for Theriot on the 40-man roster. Daytona infielder Carlos Rojas will replace Theriot in the Jaxx's championship series versus the Jacksonville Suns, which now begins on Tuesday rather than Wednesday after a scheduling change. Congratulations to Theriot, but wouldn't you hate to leave your team when they're on the brink of a championsip, even if it's just the Southern League? And why do we need him with the big club? Neifi will play shortstop, Walker plays second and the combination of Hairston, Macias and Nomar can back all those positions up. It seems pointless, especially when you have Mike Fontentot already on the 40 man roster. I suppose there's a reason behind this and it might actually be good, but quite a blow to the Jaxx and their championship aspirations. As for Theriot's skills, he's been considered an absolute defenseive wizard through his years with the farm system and a lightweight with the bat. That is until this year, when he scrapped switch-hitting and went to hitting exclusively from the right side. He's way old to be considered a prospect (he'll turn 26 in December), but he did hit a robust .304/.365/.391, stealing 24 bases in 34 attempts with 45 walks to 38 strikeouts.
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Submitted by Bleeding Blue  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:00pm  
So, The Cubs are calling up the best player on a team in a championship series so he can ride the pine on a team that's struggling to get above .500? Glad to see the Cubs future stars are learning what its like to play for a winner. This might be the dumbest move yet from one of the dumbest franchises in baseball. Seriously WTF is Jim Hendry thinking?

Submitted by crunch  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:04pm  
minor league games mean nothing and championships only matter to their subsidary team owners. sad but true thing every minor league fan has to keep in mind. theyre there to work on things, not to win. if they were there to win, we'd see a lot of AAAA players and guys like rickey henderson eatting up time all through the system for the sake of local commercial sponsorships, not to mention their base pay.

Submitted by crunch  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:06pm  
Jerry Hairston Jr., CF Neifi Perez, SS Derrek Lee, 1B Nomar Garciaparra, 3B Todd Walker, 2B Jose Macias, RF Matt Murton, LF Henry Blanco, C

Submitted by dave  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:08pm  
Crunch...please tell me you are joking about that lineup. Is Macias really out best option in RF after Burnitz? Wow. And I thought we wanted to get Maddux to 15 wins!

Submitted by dave (big lowitzki)  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:10pm  
That above Dave was me. And one piece of good news - Harang is coming off of a 131 pitch outing - that can only help the cubs.

Submitted by crunch  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:12pm  
you got a choice...macias or patterson...and sticking murton in RF...it really dont matter anyway...its just 1 day... is there any time anyone is happy to see macias get a single at bat in any situation? macias is 3 for 6 off him for what's its worth...but who isnt hitting .500 off harang?

Submitted by dave (big lowitzki)  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:14pm  
Question about the 40 man roster - can they just move Wood or Cedeno to the 60 day DL and free up a place on the 40 man roster? Are there restrictions with this at the end of the season?

Submitted by dave (big lowitzki)  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:15pm  
you got a choice...macias or patterson...and sticking murton in RF...it really dont matter anyway...its just 1 day... I am not blaming Dusty for this one - though I would rather have Murton in RF over Macias, and I am pretty sure that I would rather have Patterson also - at least Patterson brings a very good glove and very good speed. But this poor roster construction - especially being that it is September and we still don't have a backup rightfielder. That is sad.

Submitted by cubswinthepennant  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:22pm  
"This might be the dumbest move yet from one of the dumbest franchises in baseball. Seriously WTF is Jim Hendry thinking?" Well, maybe he's thinking that bringing up Louisiana native and LSU alumnus Ryan Theriot is both a way to reward Theriot for a great year in the minors and a way, if ever so humble, to raise the spirits of the victims of Hurricane Katrina. IOWs, it was a pretty classy move. Geaux Theriot!

Submitted by Rob G.  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:24pm  
why not bring up adam greenberg instead of theriot then, stands he'll get a lot more playing time? Maybe he's still wobbly....

Submitted by BJ  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:28pm  
is there any time anyone is happy to see macias get a single at bat in any situation? Um, no. He shouldn't be on a major league roster. You could find a bunch of guys at the league minimum who could do the same thing.

Submitted by Barry  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:35pm  
Ahhh this line-up reminds me of a quote from a great movie. "This quitting thing, it's a hard habit to break once you start."

Submitted by Newman  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:47pm  
Wood to 60 day DL is the corresponding roster move.

Submitted by Bleeding Blue  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:50pm  
Bluewater Pennant, do you seriously think Katrina had ANYTHING to do with Theriot getting called up?

Submitted by dave (big lowitzki)  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:51pm  
why not bring up adam greenberg instead of theriot then, stands he'll get a lot more playing time? I have no problem bringing Theriot up - especially for his glove. With the loss of Cedeno - Macias becomes the primary backup at every position. At least Theriot knows how to handle a baseball glove - and has a little speed on top of it to come in and pinch run. I don't think it ever hurts to give a guy a little experience at the major league level. But lets be honest...what they really need is a backup right fielder! Any down there in the minors? I am sure they can outhit Macias.

Submitted by dave (big lowitzki)  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:52pm  
Wood to 60 day DL is the corresponding roster move. Damn I'm smart! :)

Submitted by crunch  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:57pm  
"But lets be honest...what they really need is a backup right fielder! Any down there in the minors? I am sure they can outhit Macias." scarey thing is this team's legit RF prospects or even backups are at A-ball...theyve had eternal bust l.montanez eith 1st baseman b.sing playing RF in AA...grieve and kelton in AAA...grieve can barely play LF, much less RF effectively. murton's probally the best RF backup the team has and that's not even a good pick, either. 06 cubs RF and his backup are both gonna be issues...

Submitted by Bleeding Blue  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 3:58pm  
Crunch, while winning Minor League Championships might not matter to the Cubs (hell, winning Major League doesn't appear to be much of a priority either), but what is to be gained by having Theriot sit on Dusty Baker's bench? Yes, minor league players are there to learn things, but which do you think Theriot could learn more from: spending the next week trying to win a Southern League championship, or spending the next week on the bench watching Neifi Perez and Jose Macias try to bring an underperforming team up to 500?

Submitted by crunch  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:05pm  
i bet if you'd ask theroit if he'd rather be down in AA or if he'd rather come up it'd be an easy one for him. he's old for AA and 1 single a/b here will guarentee his pension. this is probally his best time to get a callup anytime soon seeing as he'll probally rot around in the minors another years or so and maybe never come up if he doesnt replicate what he's done this season. he's not junk, but he's far from a guy you want starting at 3rd on a mlb club if his power dont hold up. of course he'd probally love to finish what he started, but his goal is get here, not to help win a AA championship...if he could have both he'd probally choose both... "spending the next week on the bench watching Neifi Perez and Jose Macias try to bring an underperforming team up to 500?" about that...umm okay whatever...

Submitted by dave (big lowitzki)  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:06pm  
what is to be gained by having Theriot sit on Dusty Baker's bench? I don't think there is much to lose either. It never hurts to give a guy a little hint of playing in the big leagues. It often motivates players, and it can also get rid of the "first time jitters" that a player may have in their first big league game. I don't know - I don't see Theriot learning much from three or four more games in AA playoffs or in the big leagues.

Submitted by Bleeding Blue  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:12pm  
of course he'd probally love to finish what he started, but his goal is get here, not to help win a AA championship...if he could have both he'd probally choose both... Exactly, he'd probably choose both, so why not wait a week before calling him up? Let him try to get a championship, then reward him for his MVP season. I'm sure David Kelton, or Ben Grieve, or some other 4A sack-o-crap from Iowa wouldn't mind getting 50k for spending a week in Chicago, and I'm sure Theriot wouldn't mind waiting a week if you told him he'd be coming up to the big leagues once the AA playoffs are done.

Submitted by crunch  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:13pm  
honestly on the whole issue...i'd have brought up fontenot, but i have no idea what/why/etc. the decision was made mid-playoffs for theroit. maybe someone will find out, maybe not...

Submitted by Evan  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:14pm  
I wouldn't call that line "robust" but if he's improved with the stick to that and he's known as a defensive wizard, you may have a nice middle infielder (strictly defense/25th man of course) on your hands.

Submitted by crunch  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:15pm  
"Exactly, he'd probably choose both, so why not wait a week before calling him up?" cuz it just dont work like that...why play musical prospects with a guy for the hell of it...these are non-impact callups. file under soto. they're learning callups. he'll be lucky to get 10ab's if that much unless injury happens. cedeno's done for the season, btw...broken finger, will play winter ball in venezuela.

Submitted by Bleeding Blue  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:24pm  
cuz it just dont work like that...why play musical prospects with a guy for the hell of it...these are non-impact callups. What do you mean it doesn't work like that. You call up someone who's on the 40 man to take Cedeno's space (fontenot seems like a perfect choice), then when the AA season's done you call up Theriot. Like you say, its a "non-impact callup" and they're not going to see any real playing time anyway and with expanded rosters its not like they'd have to send someone back down. There's simply no reason why the cubs couldn't wait a couple days to make this move.

Submitted by crunch  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:31pm  
it dont work like that cuz there's no reason to take a guy who's gone home for the season and with his agent thinking about his next move or with his family chilling and say "we need you for a week then we're gonna send you back home and call up some AA kid." it CAN work like that, but its just not likely from an administrative standpoint and a human standpoint.

Submitted by dave (big lowitzki)  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:35pm  
Jose Macias...you are not fast. You should not attempt to steal a base when one of the best hitters on the team is at the plate.

Submitted by Eephus  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:43pm  
MURTON!

Submitted by Scott  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 4:44pm  
Gotta love Murton hitting a home run tonight (of course he hit one yesterday too)...Dusty would be CRAZY if he didn't play Murton in every game through the end of the season.

Submitted by Rob G.  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 5:29pm  
Mr. Theriot's take on the callup: "It's a great group of guys, and we had a wonderful year," he said. "I wish them the best of luck, and wish I could be there. It makes it pretty sweet when you [can come up to the bigs]."

Submitted by Bleeding Blue  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 5:43pm  
"we need you for a week then we're gonna send you back home and call up some AA kid." So you don't send him back home when you call the AA kid back up. Its not like we're still dealing with a 25 man roster at this point. And I doubt many AAA players would say no to 50k for coming up to the majors, be it for 1 week or 3 weeks.

Submitted by Arizona Phil  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 5:48pm  
I would imagine the reason Ryan Theriot was added to the roster instead of calling up Mike Fontenot is because at present only Neifi and Nomar are legitimate shortstops, and with Nomar's injury history and three weeks left in the season, having a 3rd bonafide SS around (even if he never plays) makes more sense than recalling a guy (Fontenot) who can't play the position. Also, Theriot can be used as a pinch-runner and for late-inning defense (if necessary). I guess the alternatives were Nate Frese or Cody Ransom, and they're both probably packed and long gone, what with Iowa's season having ended a week ago.

Submitted by Scott  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 6:01pm  
Van Buren is aweful tonight -- he can't get his fast ball over the plate...2 back to back walks just when we can't afford them...Why does Dusty leave him in the game...?

Submitted by nate  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 6:07pm  
I would just like to point out that the only run scored by the Braves in their 4-1 loss to the Phillies was an 8th inning pinch hit HR by Todd Hollandsworth.

Submitted by Scott  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 6:18pm  
We've had BIG TROUBLE with the Bullpen tonight and now Dusty is about to bring in Mitre (who can be quite eratic)...Lets hope we contain the Reds and see our offense wake up in the bottom of the 9th.

Submitted by Scott  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 6:23pm  
The Bullpen lost the game for Maddux tonight...anyone know why Maddux came out of the game so early...? Maddux was pitching better than any reliever we have seen so far.

Submitted by Yomax  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 6:38pm  
Besides Dempster, do we have the WORST BP in the league? Sure seems so.

Submitted by crunch  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 6:44pm  
arizona's is frightning...SF's isnt too pretty

Submitted by chifan3887  on Mon, 09/12/2005 - 8:51pm  
Why call up Theriot or anybody else? The season is over and they should have saved the 50k. Hairston could play SS in an emergency sitution. Why didn't they just walk WMP in the 8th and bring up Harang. It forces Narron to either waste a chance to score runs by keeping Harang in there or pinch hit and lose Harang who had been lights out.

Submitted by John Hill  on Tue, 09/13/2005 - 12:06am  
Crunch--"macias is 3 for 6 off him for what's its worth...but who isnt hitting .500 off harang?"
It's worth absolutely nothing whatsoever. Regarding the dig, I hope you learn a) to avoid insulting the opposition starting pitcher and b) to avoid insulting members of my fantasy team, especially when I have benched them. Harang has thrown 193.1 innings this year now, and he's struck out 151, walked 50 and allowed 16 home runs and 185 hits, all good for a 3.54 ERA. He's also managed all that despite pitching in the Great American Ballpark. He doesn't throw mid-nineties and he doesn't have the nastiest breaking ball known to man, but he's a good pitcher. The only good pitcher, in fact, that the Cincinnati Reds have right now.
Evan--"I wouldn't call that line "robust" [regarding Theriot's .304/.365/.391]"
If you ignore the age thing, which obviously discredits just about everything Theriot does or might ever do, hitting .300 in the Southern League while playing at Pringles Park as a shortstop is actually quite an accomplishment, so much so that Theriot became just the third Jaxx ever to hit .300 over a full-season. The Southern League is pitcher friendly as it is, Pringles Park all the more so, and the average NL shortstop has hit just .261/.310/.373 in 2005.

Submitted by John Hill  on Tue, 09/13/2005 - 12:54am  
Yomax--"Besides Dempster, do we have the WORST BP in the league? Sure seems so."
Not even close. I actually really like the way that Hendry is going about constructing this bullpen long-term, cutting ties with the outs by accident veterans (Remlinger, Borowski, Mercker, Guthrie, Alfonseca, Veres etc.) and concentrating on pure stuff, particularly cheap pure stuff. Youngsters then, and players like Ryan Dempster, Chad Fox and Scott Williamson. Certainly, there are drawbacks in that a lot of these types don't have great control, that there's often a learning or recovery curve that means pain before the gain, the kind of pain we've experienced this year, and that the pitchers we're dealing with are more injury-prone, but I think in the long-term it bodes well for the bullpen. I like Wuertz, Novoa, Van Buren and Ohman, and the Cubs have assembled a list as long as my arm of arms in the minor leagues with two-pitch combinations good enough to relieve, not to mention some of the pitchers good enough to start (three-pitch plus guys) that could be moved to the 'pen due to a lack of space in the Chicago rotation, injury or stamina problems etc.

Submitted by John Hill  on Tue, 09/13/2005 - 1:05am  
I also like a healthy Williamson, I should add. Fox is obviously done. Dempster, hmm, I'm not so sure about him. It depends what he's asking for as a free agent I guess.

Submitted by nate  on Tue, 09/13/2005 - 7:02am  
John, I remember you being a huge supporter of Jon Leicester before this season... what are your feeling on him now?

Submitted by Newman  on Tue, 09/13/2005 - 7:14am  
IMO, if 3 of the 6 (or 7) bullpen guys next year are Wuertz, Novoa, & Van Buren, this team will continue to struggle. Even with a healthy and effective Williamson, a repeat performance from Dempster (if signed) and a solid LOOGY in Ohman, the bullpen is still short three good arms (preferably one that is left-handed). My hope is that Rich Hill can fill one of the spots. Maybe one of those three young guys can fill one spot. Hopefully the other is a proven veteran pitcher.

Submitted by John Hill  on Tue, 09/13/2005 - 8:12am  
Nate, you remember correctly. I'd love to pretend that I was just a fan of him because of his name being English, and just because Americans could neither spell nor pronounce it correctly, and just because he as a result had the pretty cool nickname like "Ice", and just because he seemed like a bit a pretty goofy bloke just from the way he looked with the goatee and all, but, while all of those were definately reasons, I did also like his pitching, which kind of leaves me looking somewhat stupid. Throughout the 2004 season, whenever I saw him, I thought he looked pretty good, he had a nice fastball and slider combination and got some big outs, a lot of the hits that he gave up that I saw were pretty cheap, and, to top it all, Baseball America really liked him, a lot more than I ever did. So I thought I'd adopt him as a favourite player, someone to root for. Ultimately, though, his numbers suggest to me that he's in the same boat as Todd Wellemeyer in that he simply doesn't control his stuff well enough, and that while his stuff is good, it's not good enough that it can weather all his mistakes within the zone, and it doesn't look to me that he has the ability/stamina to go through an order three times or so as a starter.

Submitted by Dan from Springfield  on Tue, 09/13/2005 - 11:05am  
Well, at least his name rocks. The Riot.

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  • Charlie 2 hours 50 min ago (view)

    Yeah, it seems like I lean more toward overvaluing Bryant than most commenters here. Also, I completely stopped following prospect lists once the Cubs were good again, so I'm out of the loop on Pache especially. I had imagined that the Cubs would be looking more for immediate major league value rather than a projectable prospect, but I guess if you really like Pache you don't mind waiting a couple years.

     
  • K Dub 9 hours 35 min ago (view)

    PHIL: Excellent breakdown, Phil. Thanks. 

    I'm sure you heard. QO value was set at $17.8 million the day after you made your post.

     
  • K Dub 9 hours 42 min ago (view)

    Pache, Wright, Muller and Riley feels light to you, Charlie? I respect your opinion, but I would jump at it. I highly doubt the Braves would do it, though. Were talking 2 years of Bryant at what could be 18 million and 28-30 million in his last year of arbitration. 

    The Cubs would be hurting their chances next year and building for 2021 in a deal like that, but that's rebuilding/retooling in one fell swoop. 

     
  • Arizona Phil 2 days 13 hours ago (view)

    CHARLIE: Austin Riley is actually a third-baseman but he had to play LF for the Braves in 2019 because he was blocked by Josh Donaldson, and Cristian Pache is considered to be the best defensive centerfielder in the minors and his bat has improved enough over the past year or two to where he is now rated in or just outside the top ten overall prospects in MLB.

    So a package that includes Riley and Pache and one of the Braves young MLB or MLB-ready SP would probably be more than enough to get the Cubs to bite.

     
  • Dolorous Jon Lester 2 days 16 hours ago (view)

    Max Fried or Bryse Wilson

     
  • crunch 2 days 17 hours ago (view)

    https://www.espn.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/27828247/...

    t.skaggs story keeps getting deeper.

    allegations the team knew about skagg's drug abuse (also his family).  teams are required to report this to MLB.

     
  • Charlie 2 days 19 hours ago (view)

    Except for the headline, the linked post reads more like a trade hypothetical than a trade rumor. I like the idea of looking at this package as a discussion point for expected return for Bryant. I would say it feels a little light to me. It's deep, with two decent outfield prospects with upside and two OK pitching prospects. But Riley doesn't help the team solve the CF problem right now, so he's either redundant to Bote or sort of a Schwarber replacement. Muller's inflated BB% at AA this year worries me a bit too.

     
  • Cubster 3 days 2 hours ago (view)

    I might have missed something and it's been talked about regarding a KB trade rumor from about 10-9-19. 

    https://apple.news/AJUMyEWodQ2GX1cj1gE4ENQ 

    Braves receive: 3B Kris Bryant 

     
  • crunch 4 days 16 hours ago (view)

    they get 3 guys and the cubs get 1 guy.  sounds like a slam dunk for the angels.  pencil trout in the cubs lineup.  he's got upside.

     
  • Jackstraw 4 days 18 hours ago (view)

    I'd hate to part with both Kemp and Chatwood, but if it will bring that Trout guy back, we could even throw in Almora.

     
  • crunch 4 days 21 hours ago (view)

    the ricketts got a brazillian dollar tax break...they need to trickle that down and flex on the entire league.

    we gonna get grandal, rendon, castellanos, g.cole, strasburg, ryu, a.chapman...maybe sign bumgarner and odorizzi to work the pen.

     
  • Arizona Phil 4 days 21 hours ago (view)

    CHARLIE: If the Cubs trade Quintana and his new club pays 100% of his 2020 salary his new club assumes 100% of his salary AAV liability, but if the Cubs agree to pay a portion of Quintana's 2020 salary as part of the trade, whatever portion of Quintana's 2020 salary that is paid by the Cubs would count against the Cubs 2020 AAV. 

     
  • Charlie 4 days 22 hours ago (view)

    PHIL: Thanks for that Boston context--I hadn't realized the trend there. If the Cubs did decide to pick up Quintana's option and then trade him (assuming the Cubs would not agree to pay part of the contract as part of the trade), do they have to do that by a certain date in order for Quintana's contract not to count against them for the CBT? I haven't been able to find any dates attached to the CBT in a quick internet search.

     
  • Arizona Phil 4 days 23 hours ago (view)

    My presumption in the Cubs declining Jose Quintana's 2020 club option as well as declining the club options on the veteran relievers who have one and non-tendering Addison Russell (and this also applies to Joe Maddon not returning as manager in 2020) is that after the monumental late-September collapse of 2019 on the heels of the 2018 Game #163 and Wild Card game defeats Ricketts will no longer accept the Cubs payroll going over the CBT threshold ($208M AAV in 2020) or extending a manager making $5M a year.   

     
  • crunch 5 days 4 hours ago (view)

    i actually like ATL the team...the fans and the 3+ hours of tommy hawk chawpin' non-stop is beyond annoying before even getting into how messed up it is they're still doing that in 2019.  it's all they do, just that 1 single thing...for hours...

    fans were so upset about not getting foam hatchets pre-game yesterday (that was the club's way to "dial it back") they were busy letting the "PC police" know they're here to chant and chop as loud as they could before the first pitch was even thrown.

    it took about 10 runs to shut them up.

     
  • Dolorous Jon Lester 5 days 18 hours ago (view)

    Damn. Atlanta was the only team in the NL I was hoping would advance. I don’t know what I was hoping in LA vs WAS series. Cataclysmic event? (Side note, I live in the DC area, what a dreadful group of fans. They deserve nothing good ever.)

     
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