Game 72 Thread / Cubs @ White Sox (1 of 3)

Game Chat Carlos Zambrano vs. Mark Buehrle Lineups:
Soriano LF Erstad CF
Fontenot 2B Iguchi 2B
Lee 1B Thome DH
Ramirez DH Konerko 1B
DeRosa 3B Pierzynski C
td>Bowen C Dye RF Pagan RF Mackowiak LF Pie CF Fields 3B Izturis SS Uribe SS


Talk about clash of the titans.

Man besides Soriano, Lee and ARam, that is one pathetic group.

Well, Fontenot and DeRosa are doing well too.

Yeah I agree, besides 3 really good hitters, the 2 guys doing pretty well right now (Pagan and Fontenot), a more than respectable DeRosa and the not too bad Bowen, this lineup is downright awful.

lol Rob.

Um, the beginning of the game is reserved for bitching about the lineup, not matter how transparent or sarcastic the bitching may be. Jeez, our 3-slot sucks!

Cubs 5th best in Runs Allowed, 7th best in Runs Scored. There is a big bunch-up around 4th through 12th though in runs scored.

Cubs 5th best in Runs Allowed

But don't the Cubs have a suspect starting rotation and a bullpen in shambles?

and a horrible defense, don't forget the horrible defense.

it's one time i think i would rather see aram at 3b and derosa at ss and let zambrano hit for himself.

and defense be damned.

damn you, defense!!

probably going to try and protect Ramirez's knee for as long as possible.

and a horrible defense, don’t forget the horrible defense.

Yes Rob. The Cubs are tied for the 5th least number of errors in the NL. That is pretty horrible.

How dare they allow four teams to have fewer errors than they do?!?!

"I'm not 100 percent," said Ramirez, who was batting .299 and tied for the team lead with 39 RBIs entering Friday's game. "I can use the three days of DH."

Tell me that Silent Towel didn't used to call himself Cubfan.

until silent towel can mathematically demonstrate that 10 games over .500 is really 20 games over .500, i for one am giving him the benefit of the doubt.

or was it only 5 games over .500?

sure do miss those archives...

yeah, Wsox crew on


The pitcher is the ONLY spot on the field that the DH can be used for. I wish people would quit suggesting that the DH be used for Izzy or K. Hill or Bowen.

I don't want anyone to strike out today. I don't even want to hear it from Hawk

Soriano = yard

so whats the word on Rammy? He healthy? is he EVER going to be healthy?

ramirez seems fine...

Ramirez = yard

Gotta love those solo home runs.

Gawd, it's great to be a Cubs fan.

What happened to Erstad?

Hey does anyone know why the Sox removed Erstad for Terrero before the bottom of the first, for those of us not watching/listening?

Can the game end now?

Looks like Z's got a wicked sinker today. I just hope the Sox hitters keep swinging at it.

Jeez, our 3-slot sucks! /sarcasm

And I agree Jace.

Average Production from NL #3 this year:

10 Home Runs / 42 RBI's

Cubs Miserable Rock Bottom Low Productivity #3

5 Home Runs/ 33 RBI's

Erstad injured his ankle on a diving catch in the 1st

How does Z look?

How does Z look?

damn SEXY!

Z's got a nasty slider and sinker working for him. Bowen's having some trouble catching him he has had so much movement on the ball. Z's had surprisingly good control given the movement on the pitches.

...K on a nasty slider there.

How does Z look?

Nasty... at least over the radio! :)

7 K's through 3 innings

Z = 7 Ks through 3.

I am getting kind of tired of our power hitters getting hit by pitches.

Of course I am more tried of having to read GDP.

Mr Bowen, you will fit right in on this team.

robr - that was definitely not intentional.

Z is leaving some off-speed pitches up in the zone this inning.

Konerko visibly angered by called 3rd strike on fastball on lower inside corner.

"robr - that was definitely not intentional."

That is good to hear, but I am still tried of our players getting hit.

Robr... it was a pitch that was inside and almost in the dirt - it just grazed a-ram's back leg/foot.

Z pitches out of a jam

Z has given up 3 hits over the last 13 innings and 6 hits over the last 21.

Z is a beast today. Let's get him some more runs.

Z's current trade value: Sky High.

Uh oh...those three dreaded words for the Cubs:

one run game.

Looks like from the reaction in the dugout after the last half inning that they are taking Z out.

Pie now 2 for his last 25, I believe.

Scratch that, Z's still in.

Pie now 2 for his last 25, I believe.
now 3-26 :-)

cubs win cubs win


oh yeah

Would it be too much to ask to win out June?

Go Cubs!!

Zambrano's stats in last three starts (by my calculations):

26 IP, 26 K, 7 BB, 0.101 batting average against, 0.57 WHIP, 0.69 ERA

"Zambrano still sucks" - Silent Towel

Z's ERA down to 4.27, still worst amongst the starters though.

Cubs have 4th best ERA among starters in NL, 6th most innings pitched.

Subtract Wade Miller from the starters and it would be the 2nd best ERA among starters.

Cubs Bullpen Update:

Dempster 1.27 (16th amongst NL relievers)
Marmol 0.47
Wuertz 0.17
Howry 0.08
Ohman -0.85
Eyre -1.33

Eyre 2nd worst in NL with only Jorge Julio trumping him...

Ohman 9th worst....

Rob -- You indicated that you thought Z was as good as gone for next year. Would it make sense to trade him before the end of July? It's hard to get rid of a guy like Z, especially after a performance like today, but his value is probably about as high as it's going to get.

Bowen's pitches per plate appearance:

2003: 3.36
2004: 4.31
2006: 4.15
2007: 3.99

well it's best to ignore me :)

if the Cubs get hot and make it about 3-4 game deficit before the deadline then they'll probably hold onto him for this year.

But I really doubt he'll resign by this point, Trib doesn't want to put any money into the team past this year.

But if they are going to trade Z and give up on this year, the sooner the better. The longer a team gets him for, the more they'll pay for him.

That being said, it'll liely a deadline trade IF he's moved unless we completely tank between now and the All-Star Break.

But I would be shocked if he's a Cub in 2008, that fo' sure.

let's look just at 2007:

Lee: 4.11
Derosa: 4.03
Bowen: 3.99
Ramirez: 3.78
Pie: 3.69
Theriot: 3.68
Soriano: 3.61
Jones: 3.60
Fontenot: 3.53
Floyd: 3.49
Izturis: 3.32

damn you, dempster!

So Rob... What you are saying is that our starting rotation is very questionable and Dempster sucks, right?

file under, "what the hell is the point of this trade?"...

royals acquire milton bradley for reliever leo nunez...

maybe the royals plan to spin bradley to another team?

wow... interesting. bradley will help them do ....?

maybe the royals think they can make a run at the indians/tigers? :)

Blanco about 50/50 on whether he'll have season-ending surgery.

seems Fontenot might play shortstop instead of DeRosa if they go that route. Says DeRosa will see time in RF against lefties once again.

To C.Z.: Sorry -- I take it all back.

To Aramis: Welcome back, big guy. We really, really, really missed you.

6 teams in the NL have a positive run differential....

Cubs with the 4th best at +21, 11th in winning percentage though.

for the record...
Padres +75
Mets +23
Dodgers +23
Cubs +21
Brewers +18
DBacks +6

re: The Royals. I like what they're doing. Take a flyer on a veteran, see if he gets hot, then try to spin him later for better prospects than you currently have. It's a smart way to try and slowly improve your team when you're starting from nothing and have a limited budget.

For example, watch KC get a nice prospect for Octavio Dotel next month. I've seen Dotel pitch twice now, and he looks sharp. A contender can DEFINITELY use him. They are undoubtedly hoping for the same kind of flip with Bradley; the guy they gave up (Nunez) is a zero.

House flippers, veteran flippers, same idea--buy low, sell high, I like it.

wow… interesting. bradley will help them do ….?

Hopefully he'll help KC beat the brew crew this weekend. 6-5 Mil so far tonight.

Rob G.:
Bowen: 3.99

I like to think of Bowen as our little version of Pat Burrell and I've made it known my feelings on Pat Burrell. Basically he makes life difficult for the opposing pitcher. The move is looking more and more to me like a good idea, the problem is, he appears to be a replacement for Blanco, not Barrett. In the grand scheme of things, I think Soto is the guy, in the Cub's opinion.

Shit 7-5 Mil.

i really wish some reporter would ask lou and crew why derosa and SS dont mix, but adding him to the OF mix does.

yeah, derosa/RF pretty much means playing the splits..i get that...what i dont get is what derosa has (or doesnt have) that is keeping him from being a SS option.

soriano RF, derosa can splash on a LF'r...but hey, i dont make the big bucks and i dont got the full info on the issue.

Bradley must have really pissed some one off in Oakland.

How the hell do the Brewers get KC for three games?

milton bradley is awesome...continuously traded away for guys who arent nearly projectable in talent thoughout his career.

bradley without the attitude issues could have fetched the expos, indians, dodgers, and not the a's a lot more.

dukes is gonna own his rep, though. =p

Milton Bradley is a violent, deeply disturbed individual and a toxic personality on a ballclub. Montreal, Cleveland, Los Angeles and now Oakland could not wait to get rid of him. It's really too bad this guy isn't completely drummed out of baseball. I'm convinced Elijah Dukes will either be dead or behind prison bars for the rest of his life within 5 years.

I dont know why any Cubs fans would want Milton Bradely on this team. He has gotten thrown off 4 teams now....what, he is suddenly going to turn over a new leaf when he joins the Cubs? Give me a break.

You don't want him on your team...period. End O' Subject, lol.

they said the same about sheffield.

they said the same about bob gibson.

bradley may be a bit abrasive, but his worst days are behind him. still doesnt make him a model teammate, though...he's just not the drunk that throwing cookies at people in restaurants years ago.

about dukes...he doesnt roll with thugs...he loves strip clubs, he likes women, he's a bit 'hood', but he's not surrounding himself with idiots. he's young, in money, and hardheaded as hell, but he's not in the same league as how 'pac man' rolls as far as what ive personally seen outta dukes. would seem its a good idea to get dukes outta florida, though...when i saw him he was away from his home area where locals/friends hang.

im not trying to say dukes or bradley are guys that i'd want on the cubs...actually, i could live with bradley if the team could...whatever. i just dont think theyre desperate out-of-control thugs.

seems Fontenot might play shortstop instead of DeRosa if they go that route.

seriously? when was the last time fontenot played SS? high school?

How the hell do the Brewers get KC for three games?

I thought the same thing... until I realized the Cubs got Texas (worst record in the AL) and the Sox (only a couple of games better than KC).

Seriously... I don't think Fontenot has played one inning at SS in the minors, has he?

And Theriot played SS when he played 2b at LSU, so I doubt he played much SS there either.

And now the Cubs are going to try him at SS? Seriously?

Of course, all the defensive stats show Theriot has played a more then passable SS. Doesn't mean I'd play Fontenot there, but considering the fairly large drop Izturis has shown, you wouldn't be losing much in the way of defense.


Fontenot has played a number of games at SS with the I-Cubs this year. I have no idea if he played it well, but he's at least done it.

Johann... I agree with you about Theriot. But the Fontenot in SS is a different idea.

Theriot played SS both in college and in the minors. Fontentot has not played SS at all in the minors (that I can find, at least), and I doubt he played much in college.

And like crunch... I am really not sure why Fontenot would make for a better option than DeRosa at SS. At least DeRosa has had major league experience at SS. According to my rough counting, DeRosa has played about 140 games at SS in the bigs. And almost his entire minor league career was at SS (all but 21, of 563, games).

Fontenot has played a number of games at SS with the I-Cubs this year. I have no idea if he played it well, but he’s at least done it.

Yea... forgot about that, and Baseball Cube doesn't have 2007 defensive stats. Still.. I am really not sure why Fontenot is a better option at SS than DeRosa. It doesn't make sense to me.

Not sure Elijah Dukes is the answer, either.

Poor little Mike Fontenot would be scared to death when Dukes left him a voicemail...

Hey, dawg. It's on, dawg. You dead, dawg. I ain't even bullshittin. You dead.

Then what the heck is the little guy supposed to do?

Also, when the heck did the Brewers suddenly become the best team in the National League?

I mean, I thought I was paying attention, but I guess not. They're tied with the Dodgers at 41-32.

I’m convinced Elijah Dukes will either be dead or behind prison bars for the rest of his life within 5 years.

or, playing defensive tackle for the chicago bears.

KANSAS CITY nixed the trade for MILTON BRADLEY. He's injured, bad oblique.

but then MB has been off and on the DL all year. Only has 65 AB's.

Thinking outside the box, one reason for putting Fontenot at short is to free up second base for . . . Eric Patterson, who has ten home runs at Iowa in half a season. That's interesting power for a middle infielder.

You're going to have to get Fontenot out of Patterson's way at some point, either by trading him or moving him to short.

They were playing a replay of Hawk Harrelson's call from the first inning where he was talking about "turning this thing around" and the Soriano hits the HR and his reaction after his little diatribe was priceless! It was on SportsCenter.


You really are not going to compare Bradley and Gibson are you?

Gibson was ultra competitive and threw inside a bit, Bradley had run ins with his manager, players, fans and police.

Big difference.

In today's bright one-
Hendry is trying his darndest to get rid of JJ-teams of interest Padres, Rangers, and WSox.
Also Hendry is believed to be shopping "several players", one is thought to be Neifizzy.

Hendry is trying his darndest to get rid of JJ-teams of interest Padres, Rangers, and WSox.

Hmmm... lets dream?

Jock for Linebrink?

Jock for Gagne?

Jock for Danks?

Jock for a bucket of balls?

"You really are not going to compare Bradley and Gibson are you?"

im just saying he was labeled a troublemaker...maybe a symptom of the times, but he wasnt known for being the most warm guy on the planet even discounting the era.

guys like him paved the way for guys like doc ellis (who's famous for more than his drug incident in baseball as far as his actions go) and kurt flood (who wasnt much of a thug at all) to be themselves and raise their voices.

am i lumping dukes/gibson in a similar boat...yeah, but only via perception, not actions.

Recent comments

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  • in case it hasn't been mentioned yet, Twins are hiring Indians 32-year old Derick Falvey from the Cleveland Native Americans organization.

    Suppose McLeod could still be asked by another organization but likely staying put.

    Rob G. 34 min 54 sec ago view
  • Well put, both your remark, and Crunch's.

    Transmission 36 min ago view
  • I saw the Gordon HR. It was like a funeral where the mourners were made to play baseball. So sad...

    CTSteve 40 min 11 sec ago view
  • i wanted to watch more of it, but it started to feel like i was going beyond witnessing a human experience that isn't often seen into an uncomfortable voyeurism. these guys are in pain.

    crunch 59 min 19 sec ago view
  • wow I am glad I missed the start of the MIA game.  I would have been sobbing.

    Transmission 1 hour 8 min ago view
  • Baez!!

    Brick 1 hour 12 min ago view
  • baez grand slam!

    crunch 1 hour 12 min ago view
  • lulz, MIA with a 5-0 lead after 2 innings.

    crunch 1 hour 40 min ago view
  • d.gordon leads off MIA inning with a HR...came up to bat wearing j.fernandez's helmet.

    he barely made it back into the dugout after crying his way around the bases.

    i can't watch this game anymore. it's too much...too real.

    crunch 2 hours 2 min ago view
  • FLA really doesn't look like they're mentally/physically prepared for this game. never seen anything like's not just a few people in the dugout still feeling it large, it's pretty much everyone.

    i doubt it will lead to some kinda error-filled little league quality game, but everyone looks drained and still draining.

    ...and onto the cubs game. go #100.

    crunch 2 hours 9 min ago view
  • The Marlins organization is obviously affected deeply by this. I feel for the people there. And I understand circumstances have changed.

    But retiring his number. Wow. Literally a week ago the rumor mill was fast and furious about how Fernandez was going to be traded this winter, with the front office in response doing almost nothing to deny it. And to turn around and retire his number, just like that, when they obviously felt the organization would have been better long-term without him, just reeks of insincerity.

    John Beasley 2 hours 46 min ago view
  • jose fernandez's number is going to be retired by FLA.

    there's custom jerseys on their way to tonight's game (and hopefully will make it on time). all the marlins are going to wear #16 tonight.

    this still sucks.

    crunch 4 hours 17 min ago view
  • probably saturday depending on what they do with hammel (assuming friday for ham).

    crunch 9 hours 14 min ago view
  • Lester is going to get one more start, right? It sure would be nice to see him get a shot at 20 wins.

    Charlie 9 hours 45 min ago view
  • Nicely done! I think in my 10-14 games I went .500 or a little over. Strangely, I went to the Cards games they mostly lost (incl Saturday) and the one SF game they lost, plus a couple Brewers games they lost, too. I should have gone to just Reds games. But still - saw mostly very good baseball on the North Side this year. Regardless of what happens come October - the Cubs are positioned for some good times in the next 3-5 years.

    The E-Man 11 hours 10 min ago view
  • Attaboy!

    billybucks 12 hours 2 min ago view