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The Ryan Dempster Experience

Submitted by Rob G. on
How's that for September baseball? The Cubs a mere three outs from being once again tied for the NL Central lead, handed the closer duties to the always entertaining if not frightening Ryan Dempster, the night after he went one+ innings and took the loss. The potential for catastrophe loomed large. I was well on my drive home at this point and got the Astros-filtered version through known Cub-hater Milo Hamilton. Here's the 9th inning paraphrased recap of Milo Hamilton and my brain: Milo: Mark Loretta with a chopper down the right field....OHHH!! it hit the bag (blah blah blah I hate Harry Caray). The Astros FINALLY catch a break, it seems like that's a play that would happen to us. My Brain: F***; 30 comments waiting at TCR about Dempster blowing this now. And the Astros suck this year that's why your team can't catch a break, Milo. Milo: (Still droning on about the Astros finally catching a break). LAMB WITH A LINE DRIVE TO RIGHT CENTER AND PIE OVERRUNS THE BALL (bunch of old man jibberish). Lamb with a triple. My Brain: F***, F***, F***. Somehow folks at TCR are going to still blame Dempster for letting the ball hit the bag and Pie misplaying one. Milo: Scott with a little dribbler down to third annnnddd...he just gets him. Lamb would have been a dead duck if he tried to score. My Brain: This would be a helluva Houdini act if Dempster could get out of this. Maybe we should bring Blanco in here to save the eventual wild pitch that Dempster's about to throw though. Milo: BALL FOUR IN THE DIRT! My Brain: I wonder what we're having for dinner. Milo: The team has to get that runner home from third, Pence waiting on deck. My Brain: We're doomed. Chinese food sounds good. Milo: Munson with a shot to first, Lee throws to second (long, long pause....voice trailing off) and the game is over. My Brain: (Multiple fist pumps) YEAH!!!! Someone will still be calling for a new closer in the comments. Quite the ballgame to say the least, huge effort from Rich Hill tonight after two straight sub-par starts. The Big Red Dog had a nice night too with a booming homer and a triple and another flyout that he seemed to just miss. A chance to win the series tomorrow with Steve Trachsel on the mound (insert throwing up in mouth cliché).

Comments

Submitted by dave on Wed, 09/12/2007 - 09:31 pm

Ha! I gotta' say my thoughts were very similar to your thoughts!

Submitted by blockhead25 on Wed, 09/12/2007 - 09:47 pm

I am not calling for a new closer, because I think Marmol has been brilliant where he has been pitching, which is very critical too, so at this point, probably not worth making a major change. But, as I posted in the previous thread...Dempster is in an extended bad stretch (by closer standards) following a brilliant stretch in August, that does not have me confident that he has much gas left in the tank. 8/10 - 8/28 10 Games, 9.1IP, 2H, 0ER, 0.00ERA Since 8/30: 8 Games, 8IP, 10H, 8ER, 9.00ERA (Gave up ER in 5 of 8 Games)

Submitted by nohit on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:37 am

Dempster wavers between brilliant and painful, and rates somewhere between Lee Smith and Antonio Alfonseca on my ulcer scale. That said, his only transgression tonight was that pitch in Lamb's wheelhouse. Pie helped tighten the thumbscrews on that one, too.

Submitted by The Real Neal on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:35 am

I didn't have any problem with Pie's play, he was trying to keep the hit a single, to keep the tying runner out of scoring position. It wasn't a misplay or error, in my estimation, he just didn't get there. Maybe he could have taken a different angle and held it to a double, but it was an error of aggression that made 'baseball sense' so even though I wasn't crazy about the result, I thought he did the right thing. Pinch hitting Munson was pretty stupid, and doesn't speak well to Cecil's acumen as a big league manager.

Submitted by Nomo on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:18 am

I have no idea why the Cub bullpen can't seem to have a 1-2-3 inning. Demster has never been a great closer but it may be to late in the season to put Marmol in. I think Marmol can be one of the great closers of all time.We may just have to ride this one out. All that said the offense has a lot to do with it. We must be leading the league in LOB's. Also the Astros and Pirates giving us trouble drives me crazy. At age 62 I am getting worried I may never see us win it all.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:13 am

We must be leading the league in LOB’s. I have said this before and I will probably have to say it again - LOB is a somewhat meaningless stat. The best offenses leave the most runners on base, as they have the most opportunities.

Submitted by Jedi Knight on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:44 am

I almost fell asleep during the top of the ninth. After that game, I couldn't sleep for an hour. I think I'm laying off fried foods for the rest of the season cause Dempster is bad enough for my heart.

Submitted by Jedi Knight on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:47 am

And for the record, I don't think Dempster is horrible. Not great, but not horrible either* How many times does a chopper turn into a hit like that? 1 in 100? 1 in 1000? *Statement not valid vs. NYM

Submitted by O. Julius on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:03 am

Nomo, seems like the pen had about 4 1-2-3 innings the other night vs. the Stros. The only problem was there was one more inning of baseball. Jedi, I went to bed at about Inning 8 (?) - Cubs up 3-1. Slept peacefully. Checked the score this am, 3-2, thought: Whew, and my adrenaline level never budged. That's heart-healthy Cub following.

Submitted by Ryno on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:14 am

Personally, I just assumed the runner from 3rd was going to score, my thoughts were, "gee, how is Demp going to keep the runner from first scoring?"

Submitted by carmenfanzone on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:37 am

Mr Obvious here: When Dempster gets ahead in the count he does alright. When gets behind, like the 2-0 pitch to Luke Scott (?) the night before, he grooves them in. He doesn't have overpowering stuff to compensate for his lack of control. Howry has a much better fastball and Marmol has a much better fastball and curve. So, do you stick with the third best just because he has the "chops" to close? The good news for tonight is Howry and Dempster most likely won't pitch. Marmol is the choice tonight if needed. With Trachsel going, I'd say we need to score at least 6 runs tonight to win.

Submitted by mannytrillo on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:42 am

Man, what a seesaw season and a seesaw last couple weeks. And I expect the last 2.5 weeks to be no different. Right down to the end. Go Cubs!!!!!

Submitted by The E-Man on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:58 am

Can Trachsel throw an "Estes" game cir. Sept., 2003? It was one of a handfull of games the lackey pitcher won for the team that year, but "stubborn-as-an-old-mule" Dusty pitched him in the middle of a race - and he came through! Imo, I really haven't been too bummed about the pitching staff, other than the first two months with the 'pen. And Oh-Man! of course. But the timely hitting has just vaporized in Sept.

Submitted by mannytrillo on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:02 am

I don't think you change closers this late in the season, as we really don't have anyone that can definitely do it. You go with what you got. He is not a very good closer, but hope he can skate by. If he can't get the job done, then in the offseason, whoever the GM is, should address it then.

Submitted by StanleyKobeBlue on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:16 am

RobG., Do you live in the Houston area? I do. I was on my way home from the airport and caught innings 6 & 7 with Milo. Did you hear him reading his notes? Some one must've been playing jokes on him because he wished Lacey Underall a happy 39th birthday and then welcomed Danny Noonan and his group from Chicago to the game. It was hilarious.

Submitted by Rory on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:16 am

The Cubs have 17 games left - so how many games will it take to win this division - other than one more than any other team in the Central.

Submitted by Dr. aaronb on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:17 am

In fairness to dempster, he really deserves some sort of pass for the last 2 games. Tuesday's Triple to Scott was more a result in having to throw fastballs to keep the runner from taking 2nd on Kendall. In a tie game on the road it only took 1 to lose. In yesterday's game. Loretta's hit was the biggest fluke ever. No runs score if Pie doesnt overrun that play in Center. I can live with plays of aggression if they are going to lead to an out. Plays of aggression where you half-assedly reach down for the ball and then jog past the play while its still live doesnt get a pass in my book. Cut the damn ball off. End ' O Subject

Submitted by DC Tom on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:29 am

Given that both Howry and Dempster had trouble last night and they have both pitched two days in a row, today would be the day for Lou to give the ball to Marmol in a high-leverage or closing situation today. With the Cardinals collapsing, anyone else like me and wishing we hadn't rejiggered our rotation to throw out Traschel today? I'm worried that we will end up running through our bullpen if Traschel can't go much more than 4-5 innings. Saturday's double-header looms. Let's hope Traschel steps up or that Kevin Hart gives us 3-4 innings in relief today.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:46 am

You wanted Chinese food too? Well... I did have Chinese food, but that was before Dempster was pitching! :)

Submitted by Wes on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:49 am

The more I think about the rotation change, I realize that he not only did it to pitch Z and Lilly against the Cards, but they also now pitch in the final series of the year against the Reds.

Submitted by jacos on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:50 am

If the Cubs don't beat the snot out of Woody f'ning Williams tonite I will personally drive down to St Louis and kick each on of them in the sack.

Submitted by Ted Lilly Fan Club on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:52 am

That wasn't the first time we punched and then hugged our Dempster growth chart poster in the same inning.

Submitted by Arizona Phil on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:53 am

DC Tom — September 13, 2007 @ 8:29 am With the Cardinals collapsing, anyone else like me and wishing we hadn’t rejiggered our rotation to throw out Traschel today? =================== DC TOM: Yes

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:04 am

Although I saw the replay later, over the radio Milo made it sound like Pie completely overran the play and misplayed a single into a triple. Didn't even mention it hitting his glove. And no I don't live in Houston, although that's a funny story. I've got XM radio and was listening to it on the drive home. They usually carry the home announcers.

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:05 am

I did have Chinese food but homemade, no fortune cookie. Brown rice, chicken potstickers and some chicken/broccoli.

Submitted by djchi on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:07 am

dave sez: I have said this before and I will probably have to say it again - LOB is a somewhat meaningless stat. The best offenses leave the most runners on base, as they have the most opportunities. It sure would be nice to hit a home run once in a while though and clear off some of these base cloggers.

Submitted by BillyBucks on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:19 am

Anybody have a link to Santo's call of the game-ending DP. A friend said it was some great Ronnie.

Submitted by Dmac on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:19 am

So we're stuck with the retread tonight - can Hart start instead? Can't see how that could be any worse. As for Pie, that was a terrible play in a critical situation - one more inch to his right and that ball's an inside - the - park homer. You cannot take late - inning chances like that in that park. He's not helping his cause with Lou right now. Milo was one of the worst announcers ever to sit in the Cub's booth - even way back in the early 80's, he was nothing but a hackneyed, cliche' - filled doofus. What kind of a play - by - play man uses the terms "that was right in his wheelhouse!" Gee Milo, nice use of a term that went out of style in the 19th Century.

Submitted by Vegas Brian on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:31 am

And no I don’t live in Houston, although that’s a funny story. I’ve got XM radio and was listening to it on the drive home. They usually carry the home announcers. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Same here. I really wish they could change that and broadcast both teams. I can't stand listening to Hamilton or I usually have to listen to the first few innings until I get home. I hate Hamilton enough to not listen to his broadcast. I'd rather just follow the game on my phone. The same really goes for Shannon & Rooney (STL) and the Brennamans (CIN) - I have come to loathe Thom...

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:35 am

Well, I would say that today's starters and their matchups suggest that we probably won't lose any ground to the Cardinals when Trachsel gacks up another 5-hour 4-inning loser of an outing. Kip Wells is pitching for the Cards, against Harang, who has been pretty solid this year.

Submitted by Arizona Phil on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:37 am

Try saying "Right in his wheelhouse" five times fast. The best thing about Milo Hamilton is that he really knows how to hold a grudge. Bygones are never bygone. His Map of Life shows no high roads. And of course he hates the Cubs for purely selfish and petulant reasons. Other than that, I like the guy.

Submitted by Arizona Phil on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:49 am

With the cozy Crawford Boxes in LF at Minute Maid Park and three not-exactly-elite pitchers starting for the Astros, I would think this series would have been the perfect time to get Geovany Soto and his HR bat a couple of starts behind the plate. Oh, well...

Submitted by StanleyKobeBlue on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:50 am

I've only been in Houston for 3 months; I relocated from the Chicago area and haven't had much time to listen to Milo - I hardly remember him from the early '80's except for "Holy Toledo". He's very cherished here among the locals but listening to him is a chore... ...any other Cub fans living in Houston? I'm looking for a local hangout for the playoffs if/when we can make it there. Any Cubs-friendly places?

Submitted by Bleeding Blue on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:02 am

I also had Chinese Food last night, but I was enjoying it while Hill had the ball. By the time Dempster was in, I could blame the queezy feeling in my stomach on the Hot and Spicy Shimp.

Submitted by Bleeding Blue on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:04 am

Santo's call was vintage. They replayed it on Mike and Mike this morning. The words "Oh my God" were used at a high volume...

Submitted by Dennis on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:06 am

The best bar to watch the Cubs in Houston is probably Ernie's on Banks. (Ba-dum pish!) I don't think they carry Extra Innings, but they do have a bunch of TVs, a fair amount of Cubs paraphernalia (some Astros stuff too, to be fair), and show most playoff ball games. I watched the Red Sox WS there. Now that I have an HDTV, I just watch at home. If there are lots of other Cubs fans in Houston, I'd be willing to host a game viewing or two during the playoffs (keeping my fingers crossed).

Submitted by The Real Neal on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:24 am

You know, I just watched the replay of the triple a couple times, and every time I watch it I see the same thing. Pie runs to the correct spot, the ball takes a funny bounce and gets by him, and Jones backed him up. Plays of aggression where you half-assedly reach down for the ball and then jog past the play while its still live doesnt get a pass in my book. You wanted Pie to turn around and chase after the ball? To what purpose?

Submitted by Vegas Brian on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:27 am

I also had Chinese Food last night ------------------------------------------------- I miss good Chinese Food. I've lived in Las Vegas for 8 years and haven't found good Chinese food yet (excluding P.F. Changs).

Submitted by hellfrozeover on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:28 am

I have to agree with Neal....in my opinion a different outfielder likely doesn't get there at all. Pie was racing as fast as he could to get there. He only missed the play because he was quick enough to make it there in the first place. It's like saying Omar Vizquel in his prime isn't as good of a fielder as say, John McDonald because he has more errors. Well, he wouldn't have those errors if he didn't have the great range to get to the ball in the first place.

Submitted by Wes on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:31 am

But does the different outfielder take the correct angle to the wall and hold him to a double?

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:34 am

DITKA! on ESPN 1000. There are few things that are more entertaining to me than listening to Bears fans fawn over him....

Submitted by hellfrozeover on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:35 am

I don't think so, if you can get there you should really cut off the ball before it gets to the wall which he was trying to do. Plus if he slows down and waits for it to ricochet off the wall, Lamb probably still gets a triple and Pie gets blasted for not hustling on the play. (And if Pie runs at a further angle backwards, his momentum is still taking him directly away from second base and doubtful that he can hold lamb to a double in that scenario either.) Of course that's just my reaction from watching it last night. I don't THINK my memory is skewed, but it could be.

Submitted by mannytrillo on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:42 am

Bleeding Blue: "Santo’s call was vintage. They replayed it on Mike and Mike this morning." Yes it was, vintage Santo. And if anyone ever wonders why he will never win get into the HOF as an announced neither, take a listen.

Submitted by Virginia Phil on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:51 am

AZ Phil said: I would think this series would have been the perfect time to get Geovany Soto and his HR bat a couple of starts behind the plate. Oh, well… This is a side of Piniella I hadn't seen before but was worried about when they signed him. I guess any old manager is going to turn into Dusty in September. Reduce the number of starting pitchers, reduce the number of players who can ever start a game. If the players show the same risk-averse tendencies as the manager, this could be the beginning of a September swoon. Whatever good reasons Lou may have to prefer veterans in September, I can't help suspecting that his real motive is to deflect criticism. If Kendall screws up, no one will blame his manager. If Soto screws up, Lou will be criticized for not playing the experienced guy. Avoiding criticism is not the same as trying to win. Maybe he thought Prior was the best guy to pitch out of his own 8th-inning jam in October '03, or maybe Dusty just felt less exposed to criticism if Prior stayed in. Same with Grady Little and Pedro. Try not to make any moves, they might backfire. Meanwhile we get beat by the Pences, the Loneys, the Ethiers, the Ankiels, the Brauns. I'm hoping that someone besides the players in the starting lineup last night, plus Monroe against lefties, ever gets to start.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:58 am

Meanwhile we get beat by the Pences, the Loneys, the Ethiers, the Ankiels, the Brauns. Well... being that the Cubs' don't really have Pence, Loney, Ankiel, or Braun, or probably even an Ethier, I am not really sure what your point is.

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:04 am

I wold like to see Soto in the lineup today. I think he has earned at least a start in every three games.

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:07 am

I’m hoping that someone besides the players in the starting lineup last night, plus Monroe against lefties, ever gets to start. I'm hoping the Cubs make the playoffs and somehow win the World Series. Crazy me.

Submitted by Dmac on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:08 am

"But does the different outfielder take the correct angle to the wall and hold him to a double?" Bingo, that was my thought as well. But I didn't see the replay, so perhaps his speed made the resulting misplay a moot point. Still, it looked bad to my vantage point. Funniest story I ever heard about Milo: when he was sharing the booth with Caray during Haray's first season, Haray made a comment about a play, which upsetted little Milo so much that he ripped off his earphones, and stormed out of the booth during the inning, exclaiming for everyone in the press box to hear; "I'm sick of this shit!"

Submitted by Dmac on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:09 am

Whoops, I should've asterisked that last word, sorry about that. Good times.

Submitted by Dr. aaronb on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:22 am

Wes — September 13, 2007 @ 10:31 am But does the different outfielder take the correct angle to the wall and hold him to a double? .................................................................... Exactly, If Pie rounds that thing off from the start it is most likely a single. Its not like Mike Lamb is a speed demon. It all worked out in the finish. But it still doesnt absolve the poor outfield play. It also should absolve Dempster somewhat.

Submitted by hellfrozeover on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:26 am

Well you're entitled to your opinion re: Pie, but I don't think that was a bad play. In my opinion, the much bigger mistake was Soriano's bobbling the ball in LF. Yeah, they made an out on it, but that was just plain luck (twice in a row!). He needs to stop doing that. Half a second more and the runner would have been safe at 3rd and it's a whole different ballgame.

Submitted by Danville Joe on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:43 am

I recall twenty-some years ago, in a glowing essay about Harry Caray, Bill James commented that Milo was a model of fluency and comportment, and was about as interesting as The Weather Channel, to which he often turned when Milo was on. I thought that put it rather succinctly.

Submitted by Wes on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:43 am

Exactly, aaronb. I don't mind a guy like Pie thinking he can get to everything out there, because he essentially can. But you know what, when you have that attitude and play that style, you're going to misplay some balls and give up some extra bases. Sure, he'll get to 3 or 4 balls a week that Average Centerfielder doesn't. And that's a very valuable tool. But, every now and again, he's going to try to get one and can't, and he'll give up a triple. That's just part of it. And it's his fault just like it'd be Jacque's fault for the same play.

Submitted by jason on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:45 am

Next year put wood in as closer! Have Dempster as the long man down in the pen.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:47 am

Next year put wood in as closer! Have Dempster as the long man down in the pen. And what, based on what you have seen this year, would make you think that Wood would be better than Dempster?

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:48 am

Theriot on claims that he's tired and needed a day off... And forget that whole little-guys-wear-down theory, he said. "If anything, the little guys would be able to stay in there longer," he said. "We don't exert as much energy. We don't have as much mass."

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:51 am

Yeah, dave, I agree. There are some people that are still smitten by the '98 20 K outing, and think that he will succeed in any situation. This past couple of months has shown me that Wood is not even the Cubs' fourth-best reliever right now.

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:52 am

I think that Marmol is the most intriguing option as closer for next year. NOT this year. Putting him in that situation at this phase of the season is really a dicey proposition. Try him out for a little while next April, and see how he handles it...

Submitted by Indiana JJ on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:54 am

even Lou is bagging on Soriano’s free-swinging ways… =================================== I don't know...when I read that article it seems like the reporters were trying to goad Lou into bad mouthing Soriano's approach and he wasn't having it. He basically said he know Soriano's a free swinger and now is not the time to try and change that.

Submitted by BillyBucks on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:57 am

Reds have 6 hits and 5 walks in 4 innings vs. Kip Wells -- and have scored one run. Sound familiar?

Submitted by DC Tom on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:59 am

VA Phil wrote: Whatever good reasons Lou may have to prefer veterans in September, I can’t help suspecting that his real motive is to deflect criticism. If Kendall screws up, no one will blame his manager. If Soto screws up, Lou will be criticized for not playing the experienced guy. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- I don't think that's the case at all, VA Phil. First, if Lou wanted to avoid criticism, he would have stayed in the broadcast booth. The man clearly wants to win baseball games. Second, there is no disputing that Kendall getting on base at a steady clip as a Cub: .288/.381/.390. It's not like the Astros are a team of speed-demons, his ineffective arm has not been an issue in this series (only one SB attempt in two games). In general, I agree with you and think that "experience" is overrated. But the two positions where I think experience cannot be so easily dismissed are starting pitcher and catcher. It's not like playing giving time to a Pence or Ankiel in OF or a Loney or Braun at corner IF. If the battery is not in sync, a ballgame can be lost pretty quickly. That said, I think we will see a healthy dose of both Soto and Blanco this weekend in St. Louis.

Submitted by mannytrillo on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:01 am

Sun Times: "HOUSTON — When asked about the disappointing production from his aggressive-swinging lineup yet again Wednesday, an irritated Lou Piniella said the Cubs don't have selective hitters in September because they didn't sign them in December. "I don't know what you're trying to get me to say," the Cubs manager said after the third follow-up question on some of the hitters' approaches, especially at the top of the order. "The whole thing is if you want selective, patient hitters that look for a base on balls, you sign that type of player and then you've got it. You're not going to change what hitters do during the course of the year at the end of the season just because it makes a little more sense." That is exactly what I have been saying about the Cubs for years now. If you want patient hitters who walk, then go sign them. Soraino is not all of sudden going to stop swinging at everything no matter who the manager nor hitting coach is.

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:01 am

Terry Ryan to step down as Twins GM but stay within the organization as senior adviser per MLB.com

Submitted by djchi on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:06 am

How the hell would that ball had ever been a single? If he takes a different angle to get there, he's gonna get it deeper in right center, no? And that was likely a double anyway. The only way he could have circled it would have been running all the way back to the wall to get in front of it. And there's no way it's an inside-the-parker if he misses it completely, Jacque picks the ball up about the same time he actually did if not sooner.

Submitted by Chad on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:10 am

I don't know why we are obsessing over Pie's misplay. Should he have gotten it? Yes, cause he's Felix Pie and has blazing speed and has shown great ability in the field. Should an average center fielder got it? Probably not.

Submitted by Dr. aaronb on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:34 am

Can we propose a new man-law?................... There will be no critical comments in regards to Felix Pie or any other overly hyped cubs prospect until furthur notice............ Man-law

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:41 am

No reason to bag on Pie when we have a healthy and downtrodden Dempster all set up to go. :) We did win last night right?

Submitted by ScotThompson on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:48 am

AZ Phil, any information about the guy that the Cubs received from Reds to complete Buck Coats deal?

Submitted by Ryno on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:50 am

mannytrillo: If you want patient hitters who walk, then go sign them. But... no one here wants Pat Burrell. :(

Submitted by Ryno on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:51 am

Dr. Aaronb: Can we propose a new man-law?………………. There will be no critical comments in regards to Felix Pie or any other overly hyped cubs prospect until furthur notice………… Man-law Man-law.

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:06 pm

It feels very straneg watching a duel between Russ Springer, someone I thought still played for the Astros, and Coats, who has only been in Cincinnati for a few days...

Submitted by blargh on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:09 pm

Milo Hamilton is an ingrate. The man couldn't keep a job in any real baseball town for various reasons so he limps on down to Houston to become a "legend" in a second-rate baseball town that has never done much of anything. Bully for him. As for his opinion about Harry--no one will speak ill of Milo after he's gone because no one will talk about him at all, let alone write books or make documentaries about him.

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:18 pm

Cubs have a chance to put to Cards 5 back tonight... With Trachsel pitching, I will be surprised if any hope of that remains after 3 innings, but we can at least hope until game time...

Submitted by Andy on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:25 pm

Man, this upcoming series with the Cards has a whole different face than it did a week ago. Now the Cards are practically in a spoiler's role...weird. Knowing LaRussa, though, he'll be playing for the sweep anyhow, though I doubt that his whole team will be on board. It'll be interesting.

Submitted by BillyBucks on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:30 pm

Glad to see the Cards lose, but my convoluted logic says that it's unlikely that they will lose 11 in a row (because nobody does), so they will win at least one against the Cubs.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:35 pm

I for one would love for the Cubs to bring him in. He’s had a bad year, and seems overworked, but I’d love to see what Ryan could do with our payroll. Isn't that what people said about Andy McFail?

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:35 pm

Can't imagine anything happening with Hendry until a new owner takes over and that won't happen until early next year at the soonest. But nice to know Ryan is out there.

Submitted by Virginia Phil on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:39 pm

I’m hoping the Cubs make the playoffs and somehow win the World Series. Me, too. Just pointing out that it looks like only two under-30 everyday players will be invited to participate in the attempt. (Aramis will be 30 in June; Theriot will be 28 in December.) This is a Cub rule, not an MLB rule. The Dodgers started four first- or second-year players in their game last night: Abreu (22), Kemp (22), Loney (23) and Ethier (25). So we're not very good right now and not oriented toward the future. Can we at least fix the second problem?

Submitted by DC Tom on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:41 pm

If I'm owner of the Cubs, I would only give Terry Ryan an interview for a job with the Cubs if he could bring me definitive written proof that in December 2002 he wanted to sign David Ortiz to a contract and the club president forced him to release him and go with Matt LeCroy at DH for budget reasons. The Twins have been paying for that mistake ever since.

Submitted by The E-Man on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:46 pm

"Next year put wood in as closer! " That will be hard to do considering his time with the Cubs will finally be over. Hopefully. He's finished. Nothin' left in the tank if you have been seeing the same games I have recently. Nice guy. Wonderful person in the Chicago community. Gritty. But - $12,000,000 last year in a Jason Schmidt kinda way. For ZIP. Personally, I'd MUCH rather start grooming our young arms to take the spot he is clogging now.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:48 pm

The Dodgers started four first- or second-year players in their game last night: Abreu (22), Kemp (22), Loney (23) and Ethier (25). Who do the Cubs have who would be comparable? All of these guys are showing that that they can succeed at the big league level. Fontenot has done that to an extent, but he really isn't in the same league as the guys you listed. Pie has shown that he cannot hit at the major league level. Soto and Murton are really the only two young hitters on the Cubs who I think could help this team in a significant role down the stretch. Fontenot can still help in a limited role. Pie can come in for Floyd defensively, and that is about it. With that said... the Cubs have plenty of young players playing large roles, they are just mostly pitchers: Marmol, Hill, Marshall, Wuertz. I will say this - I like giving young players a chance. But the Cubs don't have young players that are better than most of the "old"players. Lee isn't going anywhere. DeRosa isn't going anywhere. A-Ram isn't going anywhere. Soriano isn't going anywhere. The Cubs don't have a better option than Jock. The only places you have real option are in RF and C - both of which I would be doing something a bit different than what Lou has done.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:49 pm

Personally, I’d MUCH rather start grooming our young arms to take the spot he is clogging now. Who exactly is Wood blocking?

Submitted by George Altman on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:54 pm

What I'm seeing from Lou over the past 3 weeks is that he only has confidence in 3 1/2 relief pitchers: Marmol in the 6th and/or 7th, Howry in the 8th, and Dempster to close. Since the All-Star Break, Eyre would be the '1/2' with his 1.08 ERA. I agree that Dempster scares the crap out of me too when he comes in to close (especially, with a 1 run lead). But if they move Marmol to closer, who gets him the ball?

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:59 pm

Yeah, George, I agree, but you'r also overlooking that Marmol has never been a closer, so we have no idea if he could do it. That is the primary reason that doesn't make sense right now. Do it next April...

Submitted by Bleeding Blue on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:01 pm

So we’re not very good right now and not oriented toward the future. Can we at least fix the second problem? The Cubs are in 1st place right now, right? Can we focus on making the playoffs right now, using the best players available regardless of their age? I want the Cubs to be oriented to the future: as in October 2007.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:04 pm

“Pie has shown that he cannot hit at the major league level.” really? I don't mean that Pie will never be able to hit at the major league level. I mean that Pie has shown this year that he it not yet ready to hit at the major league level. The Cubs have a very good chance of making the playoffs. Once they get there, anything can happen, and I believe that the Cubs could be a dangerous team (or they could fall on their faces). I don't want a guy who is going to hit .212/.268/.333 when the Cubs are trying to get to the playoffs, especially when they have a better option offensively who isn't much of a drop-off defensively in Jacque Jones.

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:08 pm

j.jones vs. pie? that's a good offseason topic. pie is a glorified pinch runner, defensive replacement, and occasional player at this point. doesnt mean that's his 08 role or lifetime role...right now he's just soriano-lite with a better glove and a worse eye for contact. team has a loaded bench and a nice crop of starters...now if they could do more than hit singles, gidp, and occasional doubles that'd be nice. odd that's their situation to me, honestly. but it is...

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:13 pm

btw...esp. this time a year there's a lot to be said for expendable pinch runners, imo. lost e.pat in that role due to...well, pattersonisms. pie/fuld seem to be the guys in that role this sept.

Submitted by TJ on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:24 pm

I think all evidence shows that Lou will play the players that produce regardless of experience level. He gave Pie a decent chance and he failed. If you know who was still managing Izturis would still be playing SS.

Submitted by Dr. aaronb on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:28 pm

Dave, Will you please observe recently enacted Man-Laws in any future post involving cub-hype toolsy youngsters. That is all

Submitted by Dr. aaronb on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:31 pm

I think you see what Felix Pie will develop into when he gets older. Jack Jones. Not horrible, But not Griffey

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:34 pm

I think you see what Felix Pie will develop into when he gets older. Jack Jones. Careful... some around here would argue that you are violating your own man law by comparing Pie to Jock! :)

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:35 pm

Dr. aaronb - I think that it is hard to say how Pie will turn out, given what we have seen this year. One thing that I will say will always distinguish him from JJ is his arm. The rest of his play does resemble JJ pretty closely. If he turns out to be like JJ, but with a better arm, that's pretty good. It is NOT Griffey, I agree. But it is better than JJ...

Submitted by jacos on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:36 pm

"I think all evidence shows that Lou will play the players that produce regardless of experience level." Except strangely enough Soto.

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:37 pm

anyone can compare pie to almost anyone...he's so young he's just not "done" (we hope) developing. so really...no one knows what will be, just what is now. you can probably assume he'll never take many walks and he'll play good D. you can probably safely assume he's a free-swinger type who currently has a very fast swing. will he get more control over his swing? see lefties better? change his stance/approach totally and surprise everyone with a new development route? *shrug*

Submitted by DC Tom on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:38 pm

It was reported or discussed last month that Pie and Murton were in competition for the "25th man" on the playoff roster, and that Pie would probably make it due to his speed and defense. Is that likely to change? Do folks think that plays like last night--combined with Murton's OPS of .902 since Aug 1--might cause them to drop Pie from the playoff roster? Playoff Roster (in my head): SPs: Z, Hill, Lilly, Marquis RPs: Marmol, Dempster, Howry, Eyre, Marshall, Wood, Wuertz, Ohman C: Kendall, Blanco IF: DeRosa, Lee, ARam, Theriot, Fontenot, Ward OF: Soriano, Jones, Floyd, Monroe, Pie/Murton Is it possible that Ohman gets left off the playoff roster in favor of Traschel or Piggy if Marshall steps up and Eyre continues to shock us by not sucking?

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:39 pm

soto will get to play...just wait for 08. heh... kendall's "the man" right now and there's a guy under contract for next year who's been robbed outta most of his season back to get some hacks, too. personally, unless hendry loses his mind, we're probably in for 3-6 years of soto even if he regresses and is useful for nothing more than bench. dude's definately worked his way into the cubs prospect top10 with his refined power and its doubtful hendry/lou are taking soto for granted or think he's a curious writeoff.

Submitted by cubster on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:40 pm

“We don’t exert as much energy. We don’t have as much mass.” ======= Dear Professor Theriot: (force) F = M (mass) x A (acceleration) As long as The Riot accelerates proportionately more than the big mass players, he'll be fine. Now, as to the other equation regarding Energy and Mass... which has something to do with the speed of light squared and therefore correlating with stolen base percentages. He's got to work a bit harder on that.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:41 pm

RPs: Marmol, Dempster, Howry, Eyre, Marshall, Wood, Wuertz, Ohman I don't think there is any way that the Cubs take 12 pitchers to the playoffs.

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:45 pm

only need a 3-4 man rotation. a 10/11 man pitching crew is more likely depending on how lou feels about what he wants/expects.

Submitted by mark on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:45 pm

Kendall has been very useful. Good obp, sensible game calls and a bit of veteran leadership. Think that he is a difficult out and adds value. Soto should be a Cub big leaguer if he continues to develop. As most people say, it may be 08 or longer till that happens. Will be nice to have a catcher with some pop that doesn't fight with his pitchers or other catchers.

Submitted by cubster on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:46 pm

oh-man not going to be on the roster (except for injury as a replacement)...he was brought back with the other Sept 1 callups. And if he somehow does get on the playoff roster, E-Man is likely to put out a contract on him (is Joey 'the Clown' Lombardo still available?)

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:51 pm

playoff rotation will be interesting especially if we face the Padres. Tough to give Rich Hill a start against them the way they pasted him.

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:52 pm

kendall has been great for everything except 1 thing and its a really serious thing. dude has more SB against him than games played. the mets for one could very seriously take advantage of this with some of their current guys (reyes, wright, beltran, castillo). LAD and PHI has enough speed to turn on a display when they feel like it (and if they make it)...etc...

Submitted by Dr. aaronb on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:56 pm

I see an 11 man Pitching staff and 14 hitters on any playoff roster, FWIW. Just seems to make the most sense with all the manager moves the playoffs tend to have.

Submitted by George Altman on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:59 pm

I believe the only reason Soto hasn't played more is Lou going with the veteran, Kendall, down the stretch. Except for LA, Blanco has 3 starts since coming back off the DL. You could argue Kendall and Soto on the playoff roster since I'm not sure Blanco is really healthy yet. I don't see Lou taking more than 11 pitchers which would give both Murton and Pie roster spots. I also don't see Ohman or Wood making the playoff staff. Pignatiello or Hart would seem a better fit.

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:01 pm

Eyre, Howry, Dempster, Marmol, Wuertz, Z, Hill, Lilly, Marquis are sure things. Cubs can pretty much do what they want from series to series though so it might depend on matchups. You probably want at least one long man ready in the pen in case a starter doesn't have it. I guess they'll flip a coin between Marshall and Trachsel and even maybe Hart. If they go 11 pitchers, I would assume Kerry takes it. My playoff roster today independant of opponent: C: Kendall, Blanco INF: Lee, DeRosa, Theriot, Ramirez, Fontenot OF: Jones, Floyd, Soriano, Ward, Monroe, Pie, Murton SP: Z, Hill, Lilly, Marquis RP: Marshall, Wood, Wuertz, Eyre, Marmol, Howry, Dempster I kind of scoffed at leaving Wood off the roster but it might make some sense to go 10 pitchers and let Soto on the team especially if he bangs a few more out of the yard. Be nice not to be handicapped at switching out the catcher if needed. I could also see Soto taking Murton's spot.

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:02 pm

leaving wood off the roster would create a media-storm that's probably more hell than its worth to leave him on the roster.

Submitted by mark on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:05 pm

Wood hasn't impressed me at all (he certainly hasn't shown closer potential). I would prefer an extra bat to him. And Marshall should beat Trashel to a playoff spot.

Submitted by cubster on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:05 pm

I don't think they could put Soto (or any of the Sept 1 callups) on the roster unless he was there replacing someone by injury...please correct me if I'm wrong.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:08 pm

According to wikipedia...
Players must be on a team's 40-man roster as of September 1 to be eligible for post-season play.
 Of course... it is wikipedia so who knows how accurate it is. But that is what I recall hearing/reading also.

Submitted by Sheffield/Cornelia on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:08 pm

Talking about the playoff roster before we even take a lead in the division smacks of completely jinxing ourselves...didn't we already get successful at the reverse-jinx with the advent of batting order bitching? On more pressing matters--do you guys think Lou's going to give Theriot that day off and play Cedeno one of these days?

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:13 pm

the * to any postseason callup who hasnt been here is mark prior and his DL assignment. basically, they could use anyone as an injury replacement.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:15 pm

This is from another random site:
Playoff Rosters: Playoff rosters must be set at 25, not including disabled players, on August 31. For each player on the 60-day DL, teams may add players to the eligible list during the playoffs at the same position, provided that they were in the orginization on August 31. This is why some teams will bring up injured minor-league players and put them on the 60-day DL. Teams must choose 25 players from their playoff eligible list before each round of the playoffs.
The Cubs only have pitchers on the 60 Day, but there would be a chance Pagan would be moved to the 60 Day, which I believe would allow Soto to get added to the roster as a bench player (even though it is a different "position").

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:15 pm

Cubs can do whatever they want with the playoff roster because they have players on the DL as long as the player was within the organization by Sept 1st. They don't even have to be on the 40-man.

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:17 pm

okay, didn't realize there was a position stipulation. I still think Soto can sneak in there if needed. I'm sure AZ Phil will come around to correct us all. :)

Submitted by DC Tom on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:17 pm

Sheff/Cornelia, It's not a jinx that I brought up playoff rosters, because I was eating Chinese food when I wrote the post. Moo goo gui pan. Angel Pagan and Mark Prior's main contributions to this year's playoffs are the fact that they are on the DL, which gives the Cubs the ability to basically call up anyone they want and put him on the playoff roster as a "replacement" at that "position".

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:17 pm

Cubs can do whatever they want with the playoff roster because they have players on the DL as long as the player was within the organization by Sept 1st. They don’t even have to be on the 40-man. Rob... from what I have read, and from I recall someone (prob. AZ Phil) saying previously, the player added needs to be play the same "position" as the player on the 60 day DL. There is some obvious flex in this with hitters, but I am not sure that they could replace a pitcher with a hitter.

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:20 pm

well if the position thing is strict, throw 1b glove on Soto or put him in RF for an inning during the next blowout.

Submitted by jacos on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:22 pm

"leaving wood off the roster would create a media-storm that’s probably more hell than its worth to leave him on the roster" Radio here already has Wood off the playoff roster. (Somewhere Gabby Hartnett smiles).If the Cubs are in the playoffs that will dwarf any Wood on/off bs. I think Wes and I had this discusion(arguement) last night on Parachat. I rather have Trachel who is bad but doesn't need a whole inning to warm up and can go a couple of innings if needed. Both are bad but one is healthy.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:23 pm

well if the position thing is strict, throw 1b glove on Soto or put him in RF for an inning during the next blowout. Or have him pitch for an inning! :)

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:24 pm

Radio here already has Wood off the playoff roster. Who? The Score? And they are right how often?

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:26 pm

while I give Lou props for wanting to put his foot on the Cards throats, it's pretty much a waste of time right now. As has been mentioned, just let Z start tonight and screw the rotation tinkering. Lilly would still have to go on 3 days next week, but there's no reason to mess around with Z now. 2.5 hours to come to your senses Lou.

Submitted by Chad on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:26 pm

Is that picture from the Marlins game for real? If real, that picture alone is enough evidence of why the Marlins should be contracted.

Submitted by Rob G. on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:28 pm

didn't see anything in the papers about Wood and the playoff roster. I do recall your mention of it and the discussion in parachat yesterday. Was it just WSCR speculating or were they citing a source? Seems the wording might be important on that one...

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:28 pm

I rather have Trachel who is bad but doesn’t need a whole inning to warm up and can go a couple of innings if needed. Both are bad but one is healthy. Wood is capable of going more than one inning (he has done it three times this year), and with the added rest in the playoffs he would be available in back to back games most of the time. And how do we know how long it takes Trachsel to get warm? He has one relief outing in his career, going 1.2 ip, 2 hits, 1 bb, and 1 run. I am more confident that Wood could get the job done than Trachsel. But lets be honest - the 10th and/or 11th pitcher are not going to be used much in the playoffs anyway.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:29 pm

Is that picture from the Marlins game for real? Yea... it is real. The Washington Post said that there were maybe 400 people there.

Submitted by Sheffield/Cornelia on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:30 pm

I agree with you Chad, I've long thought that baseball has too many teams and the quality of play has been significantly diluted. I'd like to see 2 or 4 teams contracted too, but for some reason cutting both Florida teams doesn't seem right for the game, as there's a lot of high school and college-age athletic talent in the state of Florida that could be lost to other sports (football) if there's no team down there to maintain a presence.

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:32 pm

asking southern florida people to go watch baseball at an open air football stadium in july-sept. is a stretch to begin with. when they're a bottom spender out of the picture and playing WAS that dont help, either. believe FLA played @WAS earlier this year in one of the lowest attended RFK games so far.

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:32 pm

Yeah, I would not argue either way about Trachsel and Wood, although the notion of Wood pitching in the playoffs does not seem to me to be as big a gaffe as having Trachsel on the mound. At least there's the chance of him throwing a pitch that could get someone out...

Submitted by jacos on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:33 pm

Dave/RobG- Speculation on Wood being left off. But I was answering crunch about the media uproar if Wood was left off. Let Wood go already.

Submitted by cubster on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:37 pm

It seems like Rick Ankiel's slump (I think it's at 0-18 now and he made the last out in todays cardinal loss) is correlating with his HGH controversy (of course it could be coincidence, but I doubt it). Mike Lupica wrote about it last sunday...blasting the doctor who Ankiel used to get the HGH. It will be interesting to see if the cardinals take any responsibility in getting him referred to that physician (Dr Wm Gogan). Plus getting a years worth of HGH seems pretty irregular particularly when it's for "off label" usage. This firestorm has just started. http://tinyurl.com/ypo2ll

Submitted by Chad on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:38 pm

re 162 and 163 Fine then lets get rid of the Marlins and the Nats. But aren't the Nats getting a new stadium next year? So that is impossible. The two Florida teams need to go.

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:40 pm

ankiel was getting it done, but it wasnt pretty. ive never seen so many *-2 counts on someone resulting in hits/homers in my life.

Submitted by Jace on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:42 pm

Yeah, I agree about the Florida teams. This should be grouped with a move to rearrange so that there is the same number of teams in the NL and AL, and the divisions are as even as they can be. It is absolute Bullshit that there are 6 teams in the NL Central, and only four teams in the AL West... I actually think that is more of an urgent issue than the two Florida teams....

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:43 pm

k, only 1 of his homers occured on a *-2 count...memory deceives. ...and after 0-2 is the only time he really shines in the situation. he's done a lotta damage on the 0-1.

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:44 pm

oh yeah, and he really shines as a 1st pitch hitter...11 hits in 19ab (damn).

Submitted by DC Tom on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:46 pm

Chad, what I like about your idea is that it fixes what I think is a huge disparity in the current league set up. There are 6 teams in the NL Central and only 4 in the AL West. That means that by "default", the AL West teams have a better chance of making the playoffs than NL Central teams. To make the playoffs out of the AL West you only have to be better than 3 teams, while we have to be better than 5. It is a significant difference in a sport where most teams hover around .500. I suspect what is more likely is that the Marlins move off to Vegas and possibly the AL West, and the Devil Rays move up the interstate to Orlando or Tampa proper. The problem with the Devil Rays is the stadium, which is absolutely atrocious and across a friggin causeway from the main business district of Tampa.

Submitted by jacos on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:47 pm

If the Marlins had retractable dome in Miami, I think they would get better turn out, imo. Tampa not so much. Diamondbacks have not been drawing either.

Submitted by The Real Neal on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:49 pm

Yeah the game is only clearing a billion a year, the time is right for contraction. I agree it's pitiful, but comparing a team that has been around 12 years to one that's been around 112 years isn't really fair. The Cubs have the advantage of having 25K people show up, no matter what.

Submitted by DC Tom on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:57 pm

Contraction won't happen, the union gave the owners one last shot at it a couple years ago and the owners didn't do it. The only problem with evening out the leagues with 30 teams is that you have to end this fallacy of interleague play as a "special event", because there would have to be an interleague game every day of the season. To equalize things, baseball either has to add two teams (which is not crazy, teams could do well in Northern NJ and Vegas) or it has to abandon the two-league structure and have six divisions of five teams each. Two wild cards, then you seed the playoffs based on overall record. Oh, wait. Abandoning the league structure would force baseball to rejigger the All-Star Game. Sorry, what a silly idea of mine, we can't mess with the tradition of the ASG "counting" for something. (When the hell does this game start today? This board is ancy.)

Submitted by ARM on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:04 pm

Two thoughts: 1) Lou is not going to change his mind about tonight's starting pitcher with only a couple of hours to go to game time. Z is not pitching tonight. 2) Ankiel I think is in trouble. It looked like he was booed mercilessly at Wrigley Field on Monday. He can expect that everywhere he goes through at least the end of this season and probably beyond. This is a guy who had psych problems of some kind that resulted in him not being able to throw a pitch over the plate with any consistency. If he is prone to psych problems, the boos surely are going to get to him or to continue to get to him.

Submitted by Chad on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:18 pm

"jacos — September 13, 2007 @ 3:47 pm If the Marlins had retractable dome in Miami, I think they would get better turn out, imo." How did they fare in August/September of 03 or 97? Actually I'll go look it up. "The Real Neal — September 13, 2007 @ 3:49 pm Yeah the game is only clearing a billion a year, the time is right for contraction. I agree it’s pitiful, but comparing a team that has been around 12 years to one that’s been around 112 years isn’t really fair. The Cubs have the advantage of having 25K people show up, no matter what." 1. I doesn't matter how much baseball makes. Baseball is too watered down and the talent disparity is insane. We have 4th and 5th starters that shouldn't even be in the bullpen let alone be counted on for 35 starts a season. 2. 400 people. I don't care how long you have been in existence. I'll bet if we had a TCR softball game we could draw more than 400 people.

Submitted by Chad on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:21 pm

ok jacos, you may have a point even in the thick of a playoff chase only 10,000 showed up in september. BUT that is even more reason to get rid of them. They can't draw when they are winning.

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:21 pm

well, ankiel did have to deal with an extremely out of control father and not much else going for support at a younger age when his mental stuff was going down. dunno what's more damaging to him...his lack of family support for various reasons, the fans turning against him, his own mental disappointment of his performance...*shrug*

Submitted by crunch on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:25 pm

that part of florida, pretty much from june-sept, is high 80s/low 90s and high humidity...and its still 80 degrees at midnight so its not like the sun going down helps much. it also doesnt help the stadium they play in is not only open air, but also has a lack of overhang shade. to add insult to all that the seats are set up for football where the game is played on a "box" and not angled to the "diamond" that baseball plays on...the further down the line you get the more annoying it is to slightly turn your neck for 3 hours slightly shifted into a tight seat.

Submitted by dcf on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:25 pm

Milwaukee plays the Reds at home this weekend, with Sheets going for them tomorrow. Cubs have 4 in St Louis. Not sure how the Cardinals/Cubs series will go, as far as how St Louis will play. The Cardinals have their backs against the wall, and could be desperate. Cubs could bury the Cardinals this weekend with 3 wins or a sweep. Cubs need to win tonight and at least split in St Louis. Brewers follow the Reds series with 3 on the road v. Houston, then 4 in Atlanta (which may be practically out of contention by then). After that, Brewers finish at home with 3 against St Louis (which may be out of it by then) and 4 against the Padres. Of course all this scorbeboard watching could be moot if the Cubs don't win.

Submitted by Wild Thing on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:42 pm

Only 2 of the next 9 games are on WGN. Bunch o' horseshit. At least I can watch some of the games on FSN-Midwest, as painful as that is.

Submitted by dcf on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:49 pm

After the last series with the Cubs, the Brewers won 3 of 3 against Pittsburgh at home, 2 of 3 against Houston at home and 2 of 3 against Cincinnati on the road. The Cubs would do well to emulate this. Up until their last series with the Pirates, the Brewers had gone 7-2 since the Cubs series (8-4 after including the Pirate series), and have righted the ship following a fairly dismal late July and August.

Submitted by dave on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 09:59 pm

It looked like he was booed mercilessly at Wrigley Field on Monday. Not really. I was there... he was definitely booed, but it in no way would be characterized as "merciless." Pujols got booed more than Ankiel did.

Submitted by The Real Neal on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 09:01 am

Ankiel took a doctor prescribed medication that wasn't banned from MLB at the time. What's the problem?

Recent comments

  • Arizona Phil (view)

    This was Jaxon Wiggins previous "live" BP on 4/5: 

    JAXON WIGGINS: 
    ONE INNING (20 pitches - 10 strikes) 
    one batted ball in play (F-9 by Stevens)
    one walk (B. Davis) 
    one HBP (B. Davis)
    two strikeouts (Peralta & Escobar - both looking)
    three swing & miss 
    two fouls 
    four called strikes
    nine called balls 

  • Arizona Phil (view)

    Prior to the Cactus League game at Papago Park, three Cubs pitchers threw "live" BP on Field 1 at the Cubs Sloan Park complex, including RHRP Ethan Roberts (June 2022 TJS) and Cubs 2023 2nd round draft pick RHP Jaxon Wiggins (February 2023 TJS).  

    Wiggins last threw "live" BP three weeks ago before being shut down for a couple of weeks, and this was the first time Roberts has thrown to hitters in almost two years. 

    JAXON WIGGINS: 
    ONE INNING:
    25 pitches (11 strikes)
    no batted balls in play
    two walks (Suriel and J. Diaz) 
    three strikeouts (Carico, Lubo, and Escobar - all three swinging)
    six swing & miss
    two fouls 
    three called strikes 
    14 called balls 
    one WP 

    ETHAN ROBERTS: 
    ONE INNING 
    15 pitches (7 strikes) 
    two batted balls in play (G-3 by Carico and L-9 by Suriel) 
    two walks (Lubo and Carico)
    no strikeouts  
    no swing & miss 
    two fouls 
    three called strikes 
    eight called balls 
    one WP 

    Mat Peters was bumped by Justin Steele from his scheduled game work at Giants, so he threw two innings of "live" BP with Wiggins & Roberts. 

    MAT PETERS: 
    TWO INNINGS 
    44 pitches (23 strikes) 
    five batted balls in play (F-7, L-7, F-7, G-6, G-3) 
    three walks 
    two strikeouts (both Lubo and both looking)
    six swing & miss 
    three fouls 
    nine called strikes
    21 called balls 
    three WP 

  • crunch (view)

    wall stole a HR from busch...double.  nice to see him destroy a curve ball.

    upon further viewing, that might not have been a homer in too many parks...it had a lot of hang time, though.

  • CTSteve (view)

    I’m at the game—woot!

    If the streak breaks, it’s not my fault.

  • Cubster (view)

    Brewers lose Wade Miley to Tommy John surgery.

  • crunch (view)

    25 games played with a -85 run differential.  insane.

  • Cubster (view)

    White Sox DFA Bailey Horn. I'm thinking the Cubs would love to get him back although they probably won't have a decent chance of claiming him without another swap.

    WSox also call up former Cub Rafael Ortega (and additionally Tommy Pham). They are hurting and having a gawd awful April.

  • Childersb3 (view)

    White Sox DFA'd Bailey Horn.

    He wasn't producing good results in Charlotte (AAA).

    But Jed might bring him back with that open 40man spot. Then try the "sneak him thru waivers" gambit.

  • Cubster (view)

    Oh my, now I will have nightmares of me sitting in the bowels of the Wrigley security detention cell.

  • Cubster (view)

    One more thing...

    One of the reasons I come to this site...

     ...in addition to Arizona Phil, who is, as we all know, a treasure trove of well-written fresh information, honest evaluation, and sneaky-subtle humor regarding the entire Cub organization...

    ... is CubbyBlue and Tim's fantastic and timely visual takes on the Cubs (to be fair, he does have a much broader Chicago-flavored brush well beyond the Cubs).  Thanks for so many memorable images.  I am fortunate to own (one of my prize possessions) a print that I framed (55/200) of "The Last Out" with KB's shit-eating grin as he fields the series winning out of the 2016 WS.  

    https://images.app.goo.gl/WvFQs6P5UvuhgVqS8

    Tim, will you visit me if I do the text security thingy and description: Tim S? Or will I find myself in a Cub detention cell.

    i.e. "or send a text message to 773-839-**** with the keyword "Friendly" and include your seat location and a description of your issue.

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