John Henry is mad about premature media reports?

 

So it's come to this.
Apparently Boston Red Sox owner John Henry got mad and is further delaying the Theo Epstein to the Cubs deal because of "premature media reports"?

Sit back and put yourself in the shoes of a Boston Red Sox owner.
Your team gags at the end of the season and doesn't even get in the playoffs - the biggest slow motion choke in the history of baseball.
Your manager leaves amid rumors of pill popping and perhaps a lack of leadership.
You hear rumors your team was ordering Popeye's and drinking in the clubhouse during games.
And your general manager wants to leave what was just a couple years ago a world championship team and organization to go to the most famous loser franchise in baseball.

John Henry's not mad about any stupid premature media reports.
He's mad because his toy broke and he's lashing out.

I heard that Bud Selig may go try to be the adult at the negotiations and save the day.

Whatever.
Honestly, I can't wait to hear what the hangup turns out to be, and surely the Cubs won't be portrayed very nicely, either.
My guess is it will be something silly.

 

Submitted by CubbyBlue on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 12:23pm

Comments

Submitted by CubbyBlue
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 12:25pm

Rob, hope I didn't step on the previous post.
Is there like, a 2 or 3 hour rule or something?

Submitted by Rob G.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 12:33pm

sometimes, but not today

what I wrote were just some links to keep the conversation going as the comments were filling up in the previous post.

carry on...

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 1:38pm

This might actually mean something...

The Associated Press is reporting the deal is done and will be officially announced today.

http://www2.turnto10.com/sports/2011/oct/21/r...

Looking for confirmation, but unlike Kaplan and others, the AP usually doesn't speculate, that I'm aware of.

---

It's been updated, they're just regurgitating ESPN Chicago news from Bruce Levine. Bastards.

Submitted by The E-Man
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 1:46pm

Double Bastards.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 1:37pm

As Rob and I argue about the value of getting Theo into the office as soon as humanly possible, it made me wonder what the guys on staff are doing.

Do you suppose Ari Kaplan has suddenly become the most popular guy in the office?

Knock, knock: "Hey Ari, have you got some time to show me about this Sabermorphics this week?"

From Ari's website:

Ari combines technology, statistical analysis and business acumen for a fresh look at evaluating players for maximum return on a baseball club’s investment both on and off the field. He has worked with some of the top-tier baseball Managers, coaches, and players to understand strengths, weaknesses, and habits of players.

It sounds like a good part of his work may be in evaluating the kinds of returns a free agent will bring, both on the field and in marginal revenue.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 1:50pm

someone joked on twitter to the effect, "Hey Ari, you can move your office out of the bathroom stall now."

Submitted by VirginiaPhil
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 2:04pm

Nothing preventing the Cubs from doing the (probably easy) deal with Moorad for Hoyer and installing him as GM, except that Epstein might prefer they wait a little longer. (He wants to get on with his life, too.)

Once the Cubs have Hoyer, it's an untenable situation for the Bosox. The Cubs have a new GM, they're still waiting.

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 3:19pm

Cafardo update:

Sox-Cubs working hard this afternoon to get a deal done on Theo Epstein compensation. There appears to be some progress.

Submitted by John Beasley
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 5:23pm

I jumped another 1800 spots on the season ticket waiting list this year, after jumping about 2700 the year before that. I moved up a total of 65 spots the three years prior to that.

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 5:41pm

Where are you at now?

A few years ago there were supposedly 10,000 people on the waiting list. I wonder what that total number is, pre-Theo.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 5:55pm

Your current place on the Wait List is 66851.

I want to say I was in the mid 70,000's when I started

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 6:21pm

Yikes. I guess 10,000 was way off. Maybe 100,000?

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 6:21pm

BTW, what's a person in L.A. doing on a Cubs season ticket waiting list? :)

Submitted by Rob G.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 6:22pm

for the fun of it...

maybe my kids will have moved there by the time I can buy some.

Submitted by Charlie
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 6:44pm

Or grandkids. That'd be a fun Christmas present.

Submitted by Newport
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 8:53pm

I moved up 4k last year and got them. Surprisingly made 80-85% of my money back and went to about 10 games. Now I have to come up with another $11k by January. Ugh.

Submitted by John Beasley
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 7:57am

Surprised it was so much you got back. It was definitely a buyer's market for Cubs tickets this summer. Can't wait until I'm competing with your seats in the marketplace.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 8:33am

That's awesome, congrats.

It makes me wonder if you can get a loan against them.

I would also think that the new front office signing will generate enough fan interest that it will be another slow year on the list, even if they don't sign Fielder (or Wilson or Sabathia).

Submitted by John Beasley
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 6:39pm

13K-ish

Submitted by Leningrad Cowboy
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:11am

I'm guessing the big rush was after the 2007 and 2008 playoff appearances--I managed to beat the rush somewhat by signing up in February 2007. I was number 39,321 at the time and I remember only moving up less than 200 spots or so for a couple of years. As of this month, I'm up to 34,740.

Submitted by John Beasley
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:39am

I'm been on the list since sometime around 2004-05. The only way I seem to make decent progress toward the top is following a hopeless season. But even after 2006 I didn't really move up much. So if this franchise can put together any kind of reasonable streak of success under Epstein, I may not even get a call for a few decades yet.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 5:28pm

@CSNMooney
There is optimism on #Cubs side that several issues have been resolved in Epstein talks, though deal is not yet complete.

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:10pm

BREAKING: Cubs and Red Sox have just released a joint statement:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/breaking...

Other sites now reporting the same thing:

Theo Epstein has resigned from the Boston Red Sox in order to become the new president of baseball operations of the Chicago Cubs, the teams said in a joint news release Friday night.
The Red Sox and Cubs will both hold press conferences on Tuesday -- the Red Sox to announce their new general manager and the Cubs to introduce Epstein.

The teams said they would forego further comment until Tuesday out of respect for the World Series.

http://www.cbs42.com/sports/story/Theo-Epstei...

Submitted by The Joe
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:13pm

Awesome! Now we just need some players and we've got a team.

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:16pm

Interesting that the press release includes this:

"...The Clubs also have reached an agreement regarding a process by which appropriate compensation will be determined for the Red Sox and that issue will be resolved in the near term."

---

So what, they narrowed down the list of players, or agreed to the actual players, and need to wait until A) players pass physicals and B) the next WS off day, OR, Selig stepped in and uncharacteristically got involved in actually making a decision? I highly doubt Bud did anything.

Submitted by The Joe
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:20pm

Why would Selig step in? This has nothing to do with the Brewers or the World Series.

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:23pm

It's been speculated for a few days that Selig might get involved and decide the compensation or prod the two sides into an agreement, which Selig himself said today in an interview that he might have to do.
--

Other news, Boston's Pete Abraham tweets:

Just to be clear on this: compensation has not been decided yet.

Submitted by The Joe
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:16pm

I just read the beginning of this article on Cubsdotcom:

"McNutt surprised by inclusion..."

Got scared, then read the rest...

..."in Epstein talk".

Stoopid Cubsdotcom, don't scare me with your wording.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:08pm

ESPN bottom scroler says that Epstein resigned and is the president of the Cubs eddective immediately.

Submitted by big_lowitzki
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:20pm

Its official... Epstein will be the President of Baseball operations for the Chicago Cubs:

http://chicago.cubs.mlb.com/news/press_releas...

Submitted by big_lowitzki
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:22pm

Or what TRN and Paul Noce said while I let the page sit for 20 minutes.

Submitted by The Joe
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:22pm

They've finally announced it, Jason Schmidt is the new Cubs President. Reportedly he'll be receiving $44M over the next 3 years.

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:24pm

Awesome! I hope we bring in Darren Dreifort as the pitching coach.

Submitted by Tony S.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:27pm

Ahahhaaahahahahaa!!!!

CLASSIC!!

Submitted by Little Nate Lewis
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 2:20pm

Schmidt and 3/44 - Never. Gets. Old.

Submitted by Cubster
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:23pm

here is the red version...

http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/news/press_relea...

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:29pm

A look at the drafts Jason McCleod had when running Boston's scouting dept (from a few days ago):

http://www.chicagonow.com/cubs-den/2011/10/ja...

--
That said, he was an Asst. GM in SD and is expected to come to the Cubs with Jed Hoyer. Will he be Asst. GM here or in the scouting dept. or what? I don't even know if that article is accurate and McCleod was in charge of SD's drafts. He does seem to have more productive drafts than Wilkens has had.

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 9:35pm

Ok, McLeod (misspelled above) did run the Padres scouting dept.

This is from when he was brought to SD by Hoyer 2 years ago:

"Jason is an outstanding evaluator and an excellent leader," said Hoyer. "He built a top-notch scouting staff in Boston and the results of his draft picks have been a significant part of the Red Sox success. The Padres are very fortunate to bring him back to his hometown to oversee scouting and player development."

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/press_releases/press_...

So if he does come to the Cubs, will he replace Wilken?

Submitted by Rob G.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 10:31pm

this was part of the previous post

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 12:41am

In my best Steve Martin impression...

well excuuuuuuuse meeeeeeee

:)

Submitted by The E-Man
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 10:32pm

PTBNL - I guess this is it afterall.

Some of you may enjoy this pretty nice Theo Vid. Primer by Tim Kurdjian of ESPN:

http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/story/_/id/713...

Submitted by navigator
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 11:56am

I told you all yesterday....PTBNL.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 10:33pm

believe Red Sox wanted Theo to negotiate his own compensation anyway, so probably why they agreed to it.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 10:34pm

Twitter says...

Padres have a pre-agreed list to choose from for compensation for Hoyer and McLeod.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 10:40pm

Under Epstein's guidance, Boston went 839-619 (.575) in the regular season and 34-23 in the playoffs, winning more than 90 games in all but two seasons.

Submitted by jacos
on Fri, 10/21/2011 - 11:10pm

It will take a few years but Cubs finally on right track.

Submitted by The Joe
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 12:24am

Till Theo comes in and says, "Just kidding, I've decided I really like toolsy guys, so we're going to sign five more guys who can play 2B and SS. We're also going to go hard after high upside/high injury risk pitchers."

Submitted by Ahone Ahtwo Ahthree
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 12:47am

"Oh, and by the way, I like to hand out NTCs like they were Halloween candy and I feel it is important to set the bar on contracts for mediocre middle relievers too..."

DOH!

Submitted by The Joe
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 3:07am

"Don't worry about payroll, I'm gonna back load these motherfuckers."

Submitted by jacos
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 6:59am

"I'm looking to keep up the legacy and great work Jim Hendry did here in the last decade."

"Now let's welcome the Cubs new hitting coach Milton Bradley; pitching coach Koyie Hill and manager Neifi Perez!"

Submitted by big_lowitzki
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 7:44am

If Koyie Hill makes pitchers throw 5mph faster as a catcher, imagine how much harder they'll throw with him as the pitching coach!

Submitted by The Joe
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 8:34am

Milton will be doubling as team counselor.

Submitted by crunch
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 4:53pm

minus neifi, plus alex cora.

Submitted by tbone
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 10:19am

Theo's first order of business should be to keep Hendry's fabulous banjo-hitting mediocre defensive pipeline from LSU open. Then wrap up a couple of flame throwers with bad mechanics and we're set.

Submitted by Dr. aaron b
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 12:47pm

Hopefully they all play football as well.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 12:58am

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball...

compensation expected to be settled within 10 days

Muskat says Cubs officially granted permission to speak to Hoyer and McLeod.

Submitted by Cubster
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 3:40am

Theo's first move?

Bob Howry signed as pitching coach, Stevie Eyre signed as pitching coach for left handers.

Howry: "My philosophy is to throw only fastballs."

Eyre: "We need more guys like John Grabow. I saw a flaw in his mechanics and he should be fine now."

Submitted by Cubster
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 3:42am

Theo's first move?

Manager change?

Free agent signing?

Salary dump?

Nope, it's...trade for Theo!

Submitted by Ahone Ahtwo Ahthree
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 7:57am

He will trade only top-level prospects for himself to make his new organization as strong as possible...

Submitted by Old and Blue
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 8:06am

I don't remember who posted this URL, but there's a funny bit in it:

With Gonzalez entering his walk year and determined to test free agency unless he got a deal he couldn't refuse, Hoyer dealt him to the Red Sox for three prospects and utility man Eric Patterson, who for the Padres did more harm than good, both on the field and for team chemistry.

http://insidethepadres.blogspot.com/2011/10/h...

Submitted by Rob G.
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 10:08am

I think Epstein out-negotiated his former protege in the Gonzalez talks. For the Padres, the trade will be defined by how prospects Antony Rizzo, Casey Kelly and Reymond Fuentes perform. None, at present, is viewed by non-Padres scouts as a good bet for stardom. Among some scouts, Fuentes needs a bounceback year to regain prospect status..

tough crowd...

Rizzo in a half season at age 21, put up a OPS over 1.000 in AAA with 26 HR's in 413 PA's, near a 10% walk rate and about a 20% K rate for his minor league career.

Kelly wasn't his normally dominating self in AA, but certainly not a bad season.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/play...

Submitted by crunch
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 4:36pm

casey kelly is a f'n pimp...years away without tweaking/refinement, though.

he's got more upside than mcnutty, that's head over heels for sure.

Submitted by Old and Blue
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 8:32am

Edgar Renteria, Daisuke Matsuzaka, Carl Crawford, and John Lackey. Crawford is especially disturbing. It's Boston's Soriano, maybe worse because Crawford's assets are built around speed and defense, and he's 30. You guys out there know better than I but I seem to remember that being a 7 year contract - too lazy to look it up.

Levine on espn.chicago was trying to suggest the Cubs need to go after CJ Wilson, who wants a ton of money and surely a long term contract.

I really don't know much about the guy, other than what I see in the stats, and he's had 2 good seasons of 200+ inning baseball. Prior to that, no more than 74 innings. I assume he was a reliever before.

I don't like long term contracts to any pitcher, really, and it's one area where it's important to develop the farm system. Something Hendry actually did well for a little while.

I'm not going to be one of those who gets excited about a CJ Wilson signing.

Theo has his work cut out for him if he wants this team to turn it around any time soon. I hope he (and we) show a little patience and doesn't make any dumb ass long term signings.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 8:44am

Crawford was 28 when he signed a 7-year deal (through his 35 season). Soriano was 30 when he signed an 8 year deal (through his 38 season). To make a rough comparison, how much more would you have liked the Soriano deal if it just expired?

Wilson is going to get ace money, but he's really a #2 starter (and yes, he was a reliever prior to 2010). Sabathia who is old (30) and probably will get a six year ($150 million) deal if he opts out and Darvish, who may not get posted but will probably cost something approximating Daiske's contract ($110 million) are the only ace caliber starters on the market. The Cardinals may not re-up Wainwright, but I expect they will.

That being said, there's no ace pitching in the world series.

How fun would it be if the Cubs signed Sabathia (.627 OPS) and got Dontrelle Willis (.665) to go along with Carlos Zambrano (.646), though?

Submitted by The E-Man
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 9:01am

That being said, there's no ace pitching in the world series.

Carpenter is an Ace and pitches like one. See 2011 Philles v. Cards, Game 7, a 1.26 whip + 191 K's this season and Cy Young under his belt, for further info.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 10:45am

Carpenter finished 26th in SIERA (Wilson 22nd, Sabathia 7th). That's not an ace.

It was a nice start against the Phillies (game five, by the way), but one start doesn't make an ace, any more than a nice World Series makes Craig Counsel an All-Star.

Submitted by The E-Man
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 11:43am

He's an ace and recognized by myriad baseball writers and managers as such.

I guess that "Ace" is somewhat subjective b/c there is no definitive, absolutely agreed upon definition by every person, connected with the sport.

He performs on the big stage, like other "Aces" have done throughout baseball history - not like Ryan Dempster.

Many evaluators and armchair GM's like yourself (well, not like you) will go by Whip, K/BB, and era. AND, the intangibles of how tough the pitcher is under duress.

Zach Grienke is an "Ace" and imploded when the team needed him the most.

Give me Carpenter any day. CY + 2nd in CY 2009.

Here is his Post-Season resume:
4 Seasons (9 Series) 8 2 .800 3.10

Including a .643 WHIP in 2 WS starts.

We'll have to agree to disagree.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 11:59am

I'd agree that he used to be an ace, but at this point he's a pretty good #2 starter. Time catches up to everyone. FWIW, of those stats you listed Carpenter didn't finish in the top 10 two of them, and finished 9th in the third.

Submitted by Old and Blue
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 11:48am

I guess the bottom line is that I'd be a crummy GM these days. Free agency is such a huge risk. I'd be nervous at almost any signing, even Albert. Who I consider an amazing player. At some point, you just have to take the plunge, and yeah, I'd like the Soriano deal ok if it just expired. I even really actually liked it at the time, but I did think it was a huge roll of the dice. Hendry gambled that they could win it all and he lost.

Submitted by Newport
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 8:51am

http://www.cjwilsonisadouche.com/

Submitted by johann
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 10:08am

Both Crawford and Lackey had excellent stats before the signing. Sure the deal for Crawford was too long but there was no reason to expect he would fall off this fast. If he had continued to perform even close to what he had before coming to Boston the Red Sox would be in the playoffs and if they won another World Series no one would care if he wasn't that good in 3 or 4 years.

Trying to blame Theo for these players completely falling off is some major revisionism in my opinion. While 2007 was certainly an outlier for Lackey, he had nothing lower than a 115 ERA+ before going to Boston. He dipped a tiny bit in 2009 but I don't like using one year to judge someone good or bad (Cubs seem to think if someone has one good year, you should sign them for lots of money). Carl Crawford, outside of 2008, consistently had an OPS+ of over 110. Very good batting average, not great OBP but not bad. I would have supported both signings for the Cubs if we had a team where a couple signings like that would get us to the World Series because you already have so many other pieces. Red Sox had that.

Submitted by John Beasley
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 11:39am

I'm a lot more forgiving on the Crawford deal. It seems like Lackey was one of those where everyone who was not a Boston fan was just glad it wasn't their team. See Howard, Ryan.

Submitted by Old and Blue
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 11:54am

I'm not slamming the whole Theo thing, I'm just aware that he's not God, and fixing the Cubs is gonna be a tough nut for him to crack.

I'm glad about what the Cubs are doing right now. I feel strongly that Ricketts is putting together a good team of professionals to fix a very bad organization. I'm pretty hopeful that the team will get some better teachers into the minor leagues, that kind of thing.

I'm also a realist when it comes to modern free agency. Crawford was not a good signing IMO, but Boston was pretty stacked, and they can actually afford a signing like that. Last year's drop off may have also been an aberration. He may bounce back.

It would have sucked if the Theo deal had fallen through. Now all the guy has to do during his 5 year contract is bring a World Series to the Cubs.

Piece of cake.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 12:44pm

Lackey deal seemed a little odd, if only because he seemed to always get shelled at Fenway

maybe they were just trying to keep pace with Yanks signing AJ Burnett.

http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/columns/stor...

his LOB% the last 2 years have been something awful...

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 2:10pm

.339 BABIP speaks of some bad luck too. 4.50 SIERA isn't evil bad (better than Randy Wells, for example), but it's certainly not worth what he's being paid.

Submitted by garsky
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 5:28pm

Edgar Renteria, Daisuke Matsuzaka, Carl Crawford, and John Lackey

The way I see it, Theo made his mistakes for another team, and will learn from them while operating on the Cubs dime.

Submitted by Old and Blue
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 6:53pm

I'm not sure people around here are going to know what to do if we can't have a front office that makes us slap our foreheads and drink heavily.

Submitted by jacos
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 5:28pm

So @LynchieWCVB reports Cubs prez Crane Kenney was holding up Theo talks 'for his own interests' and is in hot water with Commish #redsox

He atleast deserves a shoe to the sack.

Submitted by garsky
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 5:30pm

He's the Dwight Schrute of the Cubs front office.

Submitted by jacos
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 5:43pm

HAha

Submitted by crunch
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 5:49pm

he deleted that almost as soon as he wrote it almost 20+ hours ago.

no followup by anyone yet...boston sportswriters have been trying, though.

ABC-Boston seems confused even though they have their source and repeaters in-house.

damn weekend.

Submitted by Cubster
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 9:32pm

Scott Miller at CBS sports gives more info on the "process" to resolve the compensation for Theo.

http://scott-miller.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/b...

That process, sources with knowledge of the talks said Saturday, will involved Commissioner Bud Selig serving as the arbiter if the clubs cannot agree on compensation. Most likely, that would happen fairly quickly after the World Series.

Submitted by johann
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 9:44pm

Just to put in perspective the kind of player Theo was signing to Boston before he collapsed, here is Lackey before Boston vs Garza with ERA+:

Lackey:
2006 129
2007 150
2008 119
2009 115

Garza
2006 78
2007 117
2008 119
2009 110

Lackey had been the better pitcher. Sure he's making a lot more money, but if you have the money to spend and know your team is good enough to win a World Series and spending all that money can help that happen how can you possibly say that's a bad move? The bad move is when you give a contract like that on a team that doesn't have much chance of winning a World Series.

I would just like to know how Theo could have predicted such a fall off and how he can possibly be blamed. I can guarantee you if the Cubs were oh so close to winning a World Series and could sign a pitcher putting up those kind of numbers even if it were for too much money but with a very good chance they could help us win it all now and for the next couple years we would back it. Especially if the payroll and roster were such that it wasn't preventing us from filling real needs at other positions.

Submitted by crunch
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 9:53pm

...and 2 seasons in a row of shoulder/elbow/back injuries with lingering issues.

he was/is a slightly less broken jake peavy.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 11:30pm

The same Jake Peavy our fired GM almost traded a third of our farm system for?

Submitted by crunch
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 11:52pm

no, the one our fired GM walked away from when they wanted too much and they wouldn't take jason marquis in return.

z/dumpster/harden/lilly/marquis were already on board...it wasn't a pressure situation.

COL took marquis eventually.

Submitted by Jumbo
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 7:38am

Could Carmine help in that decision? I'm not sure if it's designed for free agents or just player prediction in general...

Submitted by crunch
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 9:20am

im not sure anyone knows what "Carmine" actually does besides theo and his oldschool crew...well, and the current RSox front office. if any incarnation of it came to the cubs they'd have to rename it "Navy" or something anyway.

pay no attention to the computer operator behind the green curtain. =p

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 9:21am

There was one article that said... or maybe it was that radio interview... anyway it said Carmine had "a place at the draft table", which really makes me wonder what it does. You'd think you would run a draft with a spreadsheet.

Submitted by crunch
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 9:24am

since it spits out numbers it basically is a spreadsheet...even if it attempts to quantify things like self confidence of a player based on how ugly his girlfriend is (lulz, Moneyballs).

btw, having met many scouts...the "ugly girlfriend thing" is something i can believe was actually said.

Submitted by Cubster
on Sat, 10/22/2011 - 10:37pm

More on compensation speculation by Boston Globe's Peter Abraham...

In the end, the Red Sox will likely get two or three prospects. Or a prospect and a guy like Jeff Baker. That's what precedent suggests. The Red Sox will get some potentially helpful players, not a windfall of talent.

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/...

Submitted by Rob Richardson
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 7:50am

http://m.espn.go.com/mlb/story?storyId=7134646

"But I love playing in Chicago. I love being a Chicago Cub, and I want to be here for the rest of my career. I'm happy that Theo is going to be in charge now and really looking forward and excited and getting an opportunity talk with him. And hopefully it's not just picking up an option for this year, but I'll go out there and play the best I can and be here for a long time."

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 8:16am

Well that's good. Three more years of Dempster for about $38 million wouldn't be the end of the world, if the Cubs aren't intending to blow things up.

Submitted by Rob Richardson
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 8:48am

These first few months under new management should be interesting.

Submitted by Charlie
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 10:12am

I'd welcome Dempster back on a 2- or 3-year deal. This club is pitching starved, and nobody (not even McNutt) seems to be on the way out of the minors until at least 2013 or so.

Submitted by Paul Noce
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 10:56am

Dempster blows and is declining. Signing him for 2-3 years would be a mistake. Better to get rid of him one year early than guarantee multiple years at 10 mil+ when he's going to be just another albatross of a contract. I'd highly encourage him not to even pick up his option. Tell him he'll be the batboy if he picks it up.

Submitted by Dr. aaron b
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 11:16am

He's a type A free agent. I'd go year to year with him at this point.

Submitted by Charlie
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 12:10pm

That makes some sense too. But let's say he picks up his option this year. He probably has to have a really good 2012 to get picked up by another team for more than what he could get in arbitration, especially if that teams risks losing its top draft pick.

Either way, would any of us be furious to see him stay or to see him go?

Submitted by Dr. aaron b
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 2:02pm

I'd hate to see him get a 4/52 deal again.

Submitted by Charlie
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 3:45pm

I have a hard time imagining that would be on the table. It's not like he just had a career year. I would hate that too if it happened, though.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 12:31pm

if he loves Chicago so much, he'll happily go on a year-to-year below market value deal

Submitted by crunch
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 12:34pm

speaking of...i wonder how much or how many years k.wood is going to cost the cubs based on what he did last year for cutting the cubs a huge break.

it'll be especially interesting since there's an entirely new regime and technically whatever hendry worked out with wood isn't on the table anymore.

that said, i fully expect the guy to be back on a multi-year deal without ripping off the club.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 12:55pm

believe Wood already said he's either a Cub or he'd retire...

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 2:02pm

Yep, he's just going to go year to year. He's made enough money that he doesn't need the security of a 3 year $10 million contract, or whatever he could get shopping around. Our version of Wakefield.

Submitted by George Altman
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 4:39pm

I really don't care if Dempster comes back in 2012 or not. I'm more interested in 2013 and beyond, and having Dempster signed through 2015 at $30+ million.......well, I would hope Theo and his posse are smarter than that.

Submitted by Cubster
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 7:55am

Nick Calfardo of Boston globe tweets that Theo has a full page ad in the Boston paper Monday

Submitted by John Beasley
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 9:38am

World Series ruined. Baseball season over.

Submitted by crunch
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 12:29pm

via rotowurld:

"Jamie Moyer (elbow) still plans on playing in 2012." ... "The lefty has been throwing 60-pitch bullpen sessions and will soon contact teams that might want to watch him throw."

via crunch:

"VIVA MOYER! HELL YEAH, DUDE."

he turns 49 next month, btw...julio franco, take that...satchel paige, you're next.

Submitted by crunch
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 12:32pm

via rotowurld, via buster onley's for-pay-espn-insider blog...

Z is not favored by the marlins because of a decline in his stuff, but they're expected to make a run at TB's j.shields.

Submitted by Dr. aaron b
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 2:05pm

I'd just assume we bring Z back for 2012. He will be dealing with a new manager, and pitching for his next contract.

Probably the best comeback candidate in the NL.

Submitted by crunch
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 2:09pm

unless they can save significant bucks...at least 5+ million...i'm personally not interesting in moving Z, myself.

dumpster and Z would have a little hugging it out to do, though...probably some others...

when Z does blow up he's usually calm about "taking his medicine" at least. be nice if he didn't have to take so much f'n medicine, though.

Submitted by Dr. aaron b
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 2:29pm

He has the same perception issue that Soriano has. Their contracts reflect that they should be stars. However both guys are still useful parts.

Z is still a really good NL 3rd/MLB 4th starter. Just figure the overpayment of his 2012 salary as a sunk cost.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 2:32pm

Even then, what pitcher are we going to get for $5 million who's capable of 200 innings and a low 4's ERA?

Fire Quade and keep, Zambrano, it's cheaper and it makes the team better.

Submitted by George Altman
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 4:47pm

I'd have to agree with that. Assuming Theo can hire a manager who wouldn't put up with Z's usual act, I don't see how the Cubs get a FA pitcher in the $5-7M range who would put up better numbers than Z over 175-180 innings.

Also, Z would be pitching for his next multi-year contract so I would think even he would understand the importance of not being an ass for one season.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 5:07pm

It's actually a pie in the sky scenario anyway. If there was a pitcher to be had for that who could replicate Z's numbers the Marlins (or whoever this trade partner is), would sign that pitcher, rather than paying $12 million for a year of Z.

Submitted by Jumbo
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 5:17pm

I don't think the solution to Z is to get a manager who won't put up with his act. The solution to Z is to minimize the effect of his act. Had the Cubs not made a gigantic issue of him leaving the clubhouse, or had just lied and said that he was given permission, they wouldn't have nearly the issue they had. Of course they went out and smeared him in addition, but other teams have this kind of things happen all the time and just keep it all in house.

If the guy ever wants to pitch again he has to put it all out there next season. You have to keep him and let him be your #3 starter behind Garza and Dempster. You'll never get him to be more self motivated than in a contract year, even if he says he'll retire.

Submitted by George Altman
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 6:15pm

That's really the point I was trying to make - Z should perform and want to perform in 2012 to get his next multi-year contract. To see a 30-year old pitcher saying he's going to retire after this contract seems a lot disingenous to me.

Submitted by navigator
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 6:32pm

Given the degradation of his pitching arm, this makes a whole lot more sense if Z is closer to 33 than 30 as rumored.

Submitted by Dr. aaron b
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 7:52pm

1,853 pro innings before you turn 28 will age an arm pretty fast. Especially the Don Baylor/Dusty Baker 130+ pitch count 210+ inning workload he faced in his early 20's.

Submitted by Ryno
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 7:51am

The "capable of" and "performing consistently" gap has always been the problem for Zambrano. He reminds me a lot of Livan Hernandez.

Submitted by Dusty Baylor
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 9:28am

I would also like the Cubs to make a run at Shields...
Any opinions?

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:11am

Is this sarcasm? What font are we supposed to use for that again?

Submitted by Dusty Baylor
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:21am

You mean sarcasm about Shields? Well he puts up innings...he's a solid starter. 72-63 with a 3.96 ERA, 1.233 WHIP, 3.64 K/BB ratio in his career..and he's only 30 in December.

self-edit Shields has a $7million team option...never mind.

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:39am

Yeah, I thought you meant as a trade target. I don't think we'll be making any more Garza-type trades for a couple of years.

Submitted by Dusty Baylor
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:17am

Agreed 100%....
Now if only some Cubs minor leaguers would stay healthy/develop a little quicker...

Didn't Jay Jackson pitch pretty well his last 8-10 starts or so?

Submitted by Dr. aaron b
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:43am

Kevin Slowey seems like a reasonable, low cost/risk pickup.

Submitted by Ryno
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:57am

I'm okay with Slowey if they don't expect him to be a #1 or #2 pitcher in the rotation. He's a nice back-of-the-rotation option.

Submitted by Rob G.
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:20am

absolutely, I'd like a pony and Jedi powers as well.

/these are not the prospects you're looking for (waves hand)

Submitted by Dusty Baylor
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:22am

Yeah brilliant work on my part....oops. So he's not a FA...lol.
Er..I mean Sabathia? Theo making a big splash?

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:50am

I would guess it's Fielder or nothing on the big name free agents.

Wilson may be appealing to Theo, but his ERA last year was a bit lucky, overstating his value to conventional GM's, and he's not going to live or work in Illinois because of the gun laws.

Pujols and Sabathia are too old for the seven year deals they'll probably get. It may be that Fielder's body type is a red light to the new gang as well. We'll see.

Submitted by Cubster
on Sun, 10/23/2011 - 9:50pm

Boston writers getting Theo news withdrawal?

McAdams tweets:

http://twitter.com/Sean_McAdam/status/1282401...

"...no more dialogue between #RedSox and Cubs on Theo compensation until after Tues. press conferences."

Submitted by QuietMan
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:12am

Cubs and Red Sox have until Nov.1 to settle or Uncle Bud will settle it for them.

http://www.csnne.com/blog/redsox-talk/post/Se...

Submitted by QuietMan
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:15am

oops.

Submitted by Cubster
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 5:58am

SF writer with some early free agent frenzy thoughts...

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/...

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:03pm

MLB Trade Rumors mentioning us as a possible landing spot for Jackson. Not too far fetched.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/10/free-ag...

Longish article no how great Pujols is and how his 3 HR game may tip some more owners into the pursuit.

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball/profe...

It will be interesting to see if there's some gamemanship by Theo and Hoyer in trying to bid the price up on St Louis, just to make sure they finally have to pay something approximating fair value for Pujols.

Submitted by Cubster
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 7:53am

Wittenmeyer article praising current acting GM (at least for one more day) Randy Bush

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/...

Submitted by The Real Neal
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 9:25am

AKA as a "Thank for the Tips Over the Years" article, though I agree with the basic sentiment.

As some point you're going to have to get rid of some entrenched Hendry guys just to implement change. If they leave too many of the top guys in place it will be a problem.

Submitted by Tito
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:41am

Epstein press conference is 11 a.m. Central on Tuesday.

Submitted by Ryno
on Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:01pm

Not a huge fan of the 'baseball management by spreadsheet' mentality, but I am stoked to see some fresh blood in the front office. In the small amount of video I've seen of Theo, it sounds like he gets it when it comes to defense- but I'm skeptical in the ability to quantify and predict defensive performance.

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