Dead or Not Dead

So ends the saga of Jake Peavy to the Cubs for 7 or more players. But is the deal really dead? In fact, even the Brian Roberts deal isn't exactly dead. These kind of non-transactions take a "life" of their own. So I thought we might play a little game. One of the more common cliche's is "the best trade is often the one not made". So I'm asking for you to reach back and see what you can remember as to rumored trades that never occurred but if they had been made, would have been one gigantic mistake for someone or maybe even a timeline changer in the course of baseball history. Sosa for Soriano circa 2000 comes to mind. I'm sure there are some good one's out there to remember. Please help.

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I remember this rumor as much because of the number of people who wanted Hendry burned at the stake even for allowing the rumor to exist:

Mark Prior (plus some combo of Pie/Cedeno/Hill) for Tejada and Bedard back in the 05/06 offseason.

Mark Prior still hasn't pitched any meaningful innings since then. Tejada would have be a major upgrade from the Ne!f!/Cedeno combo and Bedard had 2 really nice seasons before being traded for most of Seattle's farm system.

I think the Cubs would have been pretty happy had they found a way to make that work. Baltimore, not so much.

There were Mark Prior for Bobby Abreu rumors, as well, in the 05-06 Winter. If I remember, the Cubs thought they would be giving up too much.

Jim Frey kicked around the idea of trading for Dave Winfield and the package would have included Dunston or Sandberg and I don't remember who else.

If I'm not mistaken, there was some discussion as to whether to trade Mark Grace instead of Rafael Palmeiro in the deal to Texas, circa 1988.

This altered timeline gives me visions of Gracey with Canseco, followed by MG becoming muscle bound and homer happy.

December 5, 1988: Rafael Palmeiro traded by the Chicago Cubs with Drew Hall and Jamie Moyer to the Texas Rangers for Mitch Williams, Paul Kilgus, Steve Wilson, Curtis Wilkerson, Luis Benitez (minors), and Pablo Delgado (minors).

The Cubs probably felt Jamie Moyer was getting a little long in the tooth back in '88.

The Cubs almost had Piazza in 1998, but the Mets outbid Lynch.

ATLANTA What would it have taken for the Cubs to get Mike Piazza instead of the Mets? It may have been pitcher Jeremi Gonzalez, minor-league catcher Pat Cline and one of their last two first-round draft picks - pitchers Todd Noel and Jon Garland.

But despite several conversations between Florida Marlins general manager Dave Dombrowski and Cubs general manager Ed Lynch, the Mets came out of nowhere Friday to get Piazza with outfielder Preston Wilson and minor-league pitchers Ed Yarnall and Geoff Goetz.

======

edit: Pat Cline, who was going to be the next Johnny Bench. hahahahahahahahahah

I wonder what Jeremi Gonzalez thinks when he looks back at those days?

Not much thought from him I assume.

I guess Jeremi is an appropriate mention under this threads title

ooo...

I don't know if I should laugh.

Steve Wilson...
__________________

is the Cubs current lead Far East/Asia scout.

Milton Bradley does not approve of your tag line, and he will retaliate as soon as he figures out the internet equivalent of charging into the stands with a bat in hand.

Holy shit, I hadn't figured out the racist message in Cubster's signature. Hell will break loose!

TCR is about to make it into USA Today again!

not a trade, but didn't McFail say something like the Cubs wouldn't be outbid for Mike Hampton...and promptly were by the Rockies.

tag lines can change (thankfully)

from Phil Rogers sundapy notes (whispers):

The sports book at the Bellagio lists Boston and the Cubs as favorites to win the 2009 World Series.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-14-rogers...

that's absolutely retarded considering it's...ya know...early december.

then again gambling is built on retardation.

WHO WANTS LOTTO TICKETS?!?!

NO, SERIOUSLY, POKER IS A GAME OF SKILL!

heh...

did you equate poker to the lottery?

really?

you don't think that poker is a different game than all the other casino games?

i was over-generalizing.

still...it's a bit overused by people who think they're pros rather than joes...

The Cubs are always a lousy bet in Vegas, because everybody wants to bet on them, so the house doesn't have to offer good odds.

Turning this thread's question around a bit -- the best trade (or signing) that I thought was "blah" at the time --- Mark DeRosa. Honorable mention to Eric Karros and Jim Edmonds.

and Rogers continues to make inane comments:

If the Cubs could trade Alfonso Soriano, Ramirez would look good in left field at Wrigley Field.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-081213-ph...

What the fuck?! Yeah, 3rd basemen are easier to come by than LF'ers.

I think he meant Manny Ramirez.

Ah. That makes much more sense. Stupid idea, but more sense.

Santo almost traded to Angels...

Santo was the first player to invoke his privilege under the "Ten and Five" rule, which states that a team cannot trade a player who has been in the league at least 10 years and been with that club for at least five, without his permission. In December, 1973, the Cubs wanted to trade Santo to the Angels for two young pitchers, but Santo refused. Less than a week later, the Cubs dealt Santo to the White Sox for Steve Stone, Ken Frailing, Steve Swisher and Jim Kremmel (December 18, 1973). Santo agrees to the deal.

http://www.thebaseballpage.com/players/santoro01.php

This is so 3/44.

Pictures of Wrigley from the few days ago, covered in snow.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/gallerylanding.htm?id=7149&...

There are also some artist renderings of how it'll look with ice on the diamond.

Dug up some more on the Winfield to the Cubs trade rumors. From the NY Times, December 7, 1988:

"With chances of making a trade with Minnesota or Toronto growing highly unlikely, the Yankees turned to the Cubs and, a source familiar with the talks said, offered a package that included Winfield and Rick Rhoden for Rick Sutcliffe and either Shawon Dunston or Ryne Sandberg."

I'd call that a blockbuster.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=940...

Eric Karros and Mark Grudzielanek for none other than Todd Hundley. Hendry's first Triumph. At the time it was our garbage for their garbage...who woulda thunk Grudzielanek would be still around. I'm surprised the Dbacks haven't knocked on his door yet.

Gerald Perry talks Milton Bradley.

Edit: Can't get it to link, go to here:
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/index...

and then click on it.

Rick Morrissey from the Tribune now wants players (Bradley and Randy Johnson) who will punch him out and break his fingers. Cool, what a good idea!

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs...

Given the club's glee-club image, that unpredictability is exactly what the psychiatrist ordered for the Cubs...

I want you to understand the personal sacrifice I'm willing to make here. Do you see the risk a sports columnist takes by championing a Bradley signing? One moment your faithful scribe could be writing a column that says Wrigley Field is a dump, and the next Bradley could be breaking all of said faithful scribe's fingers. All I do is give...

I know how all of this sounds, especially coming from someone who regularly has bemoaned the crime-and-punishment motif of professional sports. But I'm not talking about the Cubs' need for thugs here. I'm talking about attitude...

Johnson might be 45, but it's a mean 45...

One rumor I remember was the Orioles offering Milt Pappas to the Cubs for Billy Williams shortly after Leo Durocher was named Cubs manager post-1965, but Leo (who was the de facto player personnel boss) said no, and so the Orioles ended up trading Pappas to the Reds for Frank Robinson instead.

Then F. Robinson proceeded to win the Triple Crown and A. L. MVP and led the Orioles to a four-game sweep over the Dodgers in the 1966 World Series (and I'm sure the Orioles were very grateful that Leo declined the deal!).

Also from early in Leo's time with the Cubs - I remember Durocher saying a deal to trade Billy Williams to the Orioles for, essentially, supposed can't miss prospect Mike "Superjew" Epstein was all but done and the Cubs backed out at the last minute. Durocher said he hadn't realized how great Williams was until he managed him.

Bradley = Carl Everett

Good for a year or 2, then see ya before he loses his cool...

It's MB's injury history that worries me more so than his anger issues. As a hitter, he'll be a nice addition particularly as a switch hitter in the middle of the lineup.

Career numbers...

Everett (14 seasons): .271 .341 .462

Bradley (9 seasons): .280 .370 .457

and career RH vs LHP splits: .303 .387 .504 .890; LH vs RHP splits: .270 .362 .436 .799

Bradley is coming off of one of his best seasons (Arlington Stadium probably was helpful); But Everett in addition to anger management issues entered the realm of the really bizarre whereas MB's issues are mostly anger management. There was the incident with Jeff Kent (when he was with the Dodgers) questioning Kent's off field leadership.

"At no time am I going to let somebody question my hustle, my injury or question my motivation for playing," Bradley said. "I watch him on the field, and I follow in his footsteps and the things he does on the field. As far as off the field, he has no clue about leadership.

"If you're going to be the leader of the team, then the need to mingle with the team and associate with the team. I mean, you can't have your locker in the corner, put your headphones in and sit in the corner reading a motocross magazine. He's in his own world. Everybody else is in this world."

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2141482
----------------

and I found this interesting blog for the NY Times Bradley wrote last year. It's about a really good moment in his life last year.

http://bats.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/07/07/milton-br...
----------------

from Wiki (on Everett):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Everett

Everett is an outspoken man... (you think?)

Perhaps the best-known of these was his denial of the existence of dinosaurs. He was quoted as saying, "God created the sun, the stars, the heavens and the earth, and then made Adam and Eve. The Bible never says anything about dinosaurs. You can't say there were dinosaurs when you never saw them. Somebody actually saw Adam and Eve. No one ever saw a Tyrannosaurus rex."

Everett has also made controversial remarks about homosexuality. He once said that if he had an openly gay teammate that he would consider retiring, or, at the very least, "set him straight." In the 2005 season, he told Maxim that he has had gay teammates and accepted them, but, "Gays being gay is wrong. Two women can't produce a baby, two men can't produce a baby, so it's not how it's supposed to be. … I don't believe in gay marriages. I don't believe in being gay."

In 1997, Everett and his wife Linda were charged with abusing their two children, Shawna and Carl IV. The criminal charges, which stemmed from allegations that Linda had applied "excessive corporal punishment" and that Carl had chosen not to intervene, were ultimately dropped. A judge in New York Family court, however, placed Shawna in the care of her maternal grandmother, where she currently remains.

Everett is currently on the roster of the Long Island Ducks of the Atlantic League of Professional Baseball. Through July 22, 2008 Everett was hitting a remarkable .342 with 15 HR and 52 RBI in only 67 games.

"It's MB's injury history that worries me more so than his anger issues."

same.

for all the talk over many many many years of "wtf bradley?" his teammates (most anyway) actually seems to have his back after his initial years of being a loner with his head down every time he's in the clubhouse.

he's got anger/impulse issues, but they don't seem to be the result of some "i'm better than this" gangsta crap as much as it is him being unable to process and respond appropriately to being pushed into a corner...even if that "push" is stuff his peers have to deal with, too.

it's been kinda...sad/creepy...his last couple incidents. he's cried to reporters (like, the kind with tears) over his frustration over living down his past vs. dealing with any new thing he creates for himself. a lot of it is his fault, but it doesn't seem to be a clubhouse distraction...oddly or not.

If it were just the anger issues, I think management could take some steps to protect against a MB meltdown. What I'm afraid of most is the injuries. Plus, Wrigley is a pretty great place to play as long as you are playing well--once he gets hurt, though, the fans might turn on him, and then coming back could be difficult for a guy with anger/confidence issues.

Ken Rosenthal on finalists for Bradley. Cubs vs Tampa Rays.
-------------------
For Bradley, the choice appears simple. The Rays' Joe Maddon almost certainly would be a better manager for him than the Cubs' impatient Lou Piniella, and staying in the American League would allow him to protect his oft-injured body by serving as a DH.

With the Rays, Bradley could bat cleanup between Carlos Pena and Evan Longoria, offer above-average defense in right field and fit well on a young, high-energy team.

The question is whether the Rays will meet Bradley's price.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8938060/Yanks-s...

Brewers trying to downgrade from Cameron to Melky Cabrera and the Yanks trying to send Igawa their way too (according to Rotoworld). Sounds great to me. Get that done, Melvin.

I'd almost do that if I were Melvin. Provided that the Yanks took Bill Hall and sent back Eric Duncan,Ramiro Pena, and a low level bullpen arm.

Seriously, I mean wow, how fast have the Brewers taken it on the chin? For most of 2008, they're the NL's 2nd best team, now for 2009, they'll be fortunate to post a 500 record. This team now looks like a repeat of the 2006/2007 bunch, only with Ben Sheets and a bullpen subtracted. Prediction: Pain.

Pittsburgh can have the Indian flame throwers, Cubs can sign the Middle Easterner who throws with sole-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWt3-kPBQ4A

He missed his target, twice...yeah, he would fit right in with the Cubs. Maybe Rich Hill can take him under his wing.

Either Rich Hill or Julio Castillo.

What? Too soon?

Is Willie Taveras a possibilty now that he was NT'd? He stole 67 bases last year, in a down year for him.

"He stole 67 bases last year, in a down year for him."

That could be a somewhat misleading statement. It was a down year for him in batting average (hits per AB are just about his only stat that is really down--his isolated slugging is about in line with his career and he walked twice more than his previous career high), but his 67 bases this year is nearly double his previous high of 34.

Is the chance of him rebounding as a hitter worth bringing him in as a 4th (ermm... 5th/6th if the Cubs sign a RF) outfielder?

His career BABIP is .334, last year's was .296. In 2007, when he hit .320 for the Rockies, his BABIP was .370. In 2006, when his BABIP was at .330 and closest to his career average, he hit .278 and had a .333 on-base percentage. With his speed and defense, that would be a damn good backup CF. But we already have Reed, right?

I just think there are better fits for Taveras. Like, Colorado. Oh.

San Diego Writer, Tom Krasovic who covers the Padres, describes what gap in the players discussed lead to the Braves leaving the Peavy trade talks...then he gives this about LouPa:

– By one unofficial count, Cubs manager Lou Piniella, amidst his wanderings throughout the Bellagio hotel at the winter meetings, said at least 23 times that getting a left-handed hitter was far more important to the Cubs than getting Peavy.

http://www3.signonsandiego.com/stories/2008/dec/13...

I hope Lou gets his LH hitter soon.

If you could have any left-handed or switch hitter in baseball, who would you want?

I have to say, I think I'd like to have Curtis Granderson over just about anyone else. Sizemore has him beat on offense, but Granderson is a phenomenal fielder too.

*sigh*

How much more would it take to acquire either of those guys than Peavy?

Ichiro!

Ruth.

Especially since he plays RF.

But if he's not available, I'd take Markakis (who, like Ruth, was also a pretty good pitcher).

As a hypothetical-- who would you be willing to trade to get Markakis?

Jason Marquis
Fukkakidome
Felix Pie
Rich Hill
Ronny Cedeno

5 for 1 blockbuster

I am getting a little impatient with Lou: What wins playoff series is usually TWO STUD PITCHERS . . . I see this "I need a left handed hitting left fielder more than Peavy" bullshit as some kind of scapegoating of Lou/s and the team's performance in the playoffs the last two years.

Hey Lou the reason the Cubs lost so pathetically this year was threefold: 1.) The Cubs peaked too early and lost swagger when their top two pitchers talent wise (Zambrano and Harden) went down in August. 2.) The manager's approach to a short series underestimated the importance of game one: shouldn't have left Dempster in past the 3rd inning. 3.) The team was not emotionally prepared for the series and were not prepared for the pressure and expectations.

That said if you were able to throw Peavy and a healthy Zambrano, (Dempster, Harden and Lilly arent bad either!) out there regularly you are gonna win some playoff games. Anyway ain't gonna happen now anyway.

it's always makes me chuckle when someone mentions the Cubs need Peavy for the playoffs...

 

why is he notoriously bad in the playoffs?

He has been, yes.

Submitted by Charlie on Sun, 12/14/2008 - 11:39pm.

If you could have any left-handed or switch hitter in baseball, who would you want?

=============

Hamilton?

Utley.

Nick Markakis!

If switch hitters count I'll take Beltran.

For a pure lefty, at this time I guess I'd want Hamilton. Wish the Cubs could've figured out some way to get THAT guy.

Sabathia.

it's amazing what a drug addiction and finding Christianity will do to a guys reputation...and the HR derby.

all left-handed/switch hitters I'd take before Hamilton

Utley, Markakis, C. Jones, L. Berkman, C. Beltran, Teixeira, Morneau, Sizemore, Bradley's probably a tie with Hamilton

and that's not even counting guys I would take just as hitters: Fielder, Dunn, Howard for example... 

I was assuming guys like Chipper, Berkman, Teixeira and Morneau were off the table because we can't fit them onto our current club configuration.

Just read the questions differently, I guess.

# Re: Dead or Not Dead
Submitted by John Beasley on Mon, 12/15/2008 - 12:57pm.

I was assuming guys like Chipper, Berkman, Teixeira and Morneau were off the table because we can't fit them onto our current club configuration.

Just read the questions differently, I guess.

============
Yeah, I was kind of viewing it like Hamilton would be a nice fit if we could acquire him now. While I have no idea what the cost would be, something makes me think it would be more do-able than Utley.

But, yeah, if it's like a Christmas gift and we're starting from scratch, I'd definitely agree with Utley over Hamilton, no question. But assuming we get to keep the player for future years, vets like Chipper and Berkman would be lower than Hamilton for me.

Are you basing this on his drug addiction problems?

I believe he would have a hard time with Wrigleyville.

I'm basing it on that Josh Hamilton is a better story than he is a baseball player.

He's good and yes, would be great in RF or CF for the Cubs right now, but if we could have any left-handed hitter out there, there's quite a few I'd pick ahead of him.

on talent alone Hamilton is better than "good", the only tool he doesn't have is base stealing ability but he's not a slow runner either. I'm not going to compare him to the more veteran players based on a year and a half of production but he's at least on par with Markakis offensively, if one wants to rate his power vs Markakis' base stealing abilities. I'd put Hamilton slightly above Morneau as well. Morneau's numbers in 07 were mediocre - .271/.343/.492 and as good as he was this year RBI wise he still didn't reach a .500 SG% despite racking 47 doubles.

Hamilton's awesome and the proof is in the pudding, Rob. I wouldn't have traded for him if he wasn't awesome. When's the last time I made a bad trade in the keeper league?

I would take Hamilton over Bradley, Morneau, and Dunn, but the rest of those guys are definitely ahead of him, as is Granderson in my opinion.

Barry Bonds has not come up yet...

especially at his current price

yet he's too good to go play indie ball.

there's a top dollar paycheck (in the indie leagues) waiting for him from many teams out there if he could manage to be a superstar in a small pond rather than a huge distraction of a superstar on the main stage.

rickey henderson loved the game and it showed no matter how egotistical he was. i miss henderson's brand of self-worth over the pampered/privileged brand of self-worth.

No Furcal?

"One rumor I remember was the Orioles offering Milt Pappas to the Cubs for Billy Williams shortly after Leo Durocher was named Cubs manager post-1965, but Leo (who was the de facto player personnel boss) said no, and so the Orioles ended up trading Pappas"

Durocher confirmed the almost Williams trade to the Orioles (in his autobiography, "Nice Guys Finish Last"), but stated that Earl Weaver (also the de facto GM of the club at the time) backed off at the last minute. Durocher cornered him at the Winter meetings, called him an SOB, but later thanked the heavens that Weaver backed out.

"Durocher confirmed the almost Williams trade to the Orioles (in his autobiography, "Nice Guys Finish Last"), but stated that Earl Weaver (also the de facto GM of the club at the time) backed off at the last minute. Durocher cornered him at the Winter meetings, called him an SOB, but later thanked the heavens that Weaver backed out."

According to the Bill James Historical Abstract - O's GM Hank Bauer thought he could get Billy Williams cheap after Williams batted .276 in 1966. The Cubs demanded phenom Mike Epstein be part of the trade and Bauer backed out. I had it backwards in an earlier post thinking the Cubs backed out.

This is a different trade than the one AZPhil referenced involving Milt Pappas since the Pappas trade was between the '65 and '66 seasons. Seems like the O's really wanted Williams even after getting Frank Robinson. Robinson, Williams and Blair would have been quite the outfield.

Well, there's the answer to the trivia question that's been bothering me for years:

What does 'Welcome Back Carter' have to do with the Cubs?

Welcome Back Kotter?
Juan Epstein?

Loved it growing up.

Up your nose with a rubber hose.

playing for Team Japan in WBC via Rotoworld

Anyone heard if there is any progress with the Peavy talks?

there is a shocking lack of "sizemore" in that whole "what lefty would you want" fantasy question.

he is 26, ya know.

he's in there, mentioned by some guy named Rob

"The Cubs peaked too early and lost swagger when their top two pitchers talent wise (Zambrano and Harden) went down in August..."

I don't understand the premise here at all - are you saying that even though they wound up winning their division, all of a sudden they started on a precipitous slide? Granted, they didn't look like world - beaters at the end of September, but they didn't look like they'd fold immediately in the first round, either.

that's exactly what I meant and I said as much before the playoffs even began when Zambrano was injured. Look it up . . .

Abreu seeking 3 years\$48 million according to Rosenthal.

Good for him if he can get it, but some scouts apparently feel that while he still has a RF arm, he has lost RF wheels.

"Word from WSCR 670 in Chicago is that the Cubs will sign outfielder Joey Gathright. We've heard the same from a source."

lol..."we've heard the same from a source."

yeah...WSCR 670.

ah, mlbtraderumors...you so crazy!

why?

i wanna know why their "source" can't at least say if it's a major league or minor league deal.

it could be either, but unless pie is on his way out in trade a mlb deal don't make sense.

I would guess it's a minor league deal to compete with the other three for CF time in ST.

It could mean that the Cubs are giving up on the big name FA outfielders and are going to sign Furcal with their $10 million.

Or it could mean that the season ticket sales are going shitty and they just dropped their projected payroll.

Or it could be a baseless rumor.

With a 30,000+ wait list for season tickets, I'm pretty sure that can't be the reason.

If it is, maybe they can get all the way down to me at around 16,000...

32,921 for me. I've moved about 70 spots in the last year...

I started at about 4500 after the 2004 season. I'm now at 3200ish. I also only moved 70 or 80 spots last year.

*groan*

Heard a WSCR report about this a couple of hours ago that explicitly stated (conjectured) that Gathright would be "taking Pie's roster spot" and that Pie was "on his way out."

And now, some grains of salt: . . . . . . . . . .

Cool.

Cubs dump Fukudome (after eating some money) and Gathright becomes one of the two reserve OF-ers? Count me in.

Pie has speed, but has not learned to translate it into successful SB ability. Gathright can. He's also a fine defensive OF, not quite Pie level, but reasonably close. He'd be a fine bench player.

Don't forget that Gathright would be very helpful in shagging balls in center in Wrigley when they install a Mitsubishi Gallant in right-center and a BWM in left-center (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cySfw8f0beg)

skim82 posted this insight on Gathright (on mlbtr.com)...

As a Royals fan who has seen Gathright play for the last few years:

pros
-he's really fast
-he can jump over cars (youtube him) it's amazing

http://mlb.mlb.com/media/video.jsp?mid=20080611289...
(two great catches, ranked him #2)

-he's a great guy
-he puts pressure on the opposing infield (shift)

cons
-he takes bad routes to the ball in the outfield
-his OBP is horrible
-he's a slap hitter with no power
-although he's really fast, he can't really steal many bases.

He's a great 4th outfielder or 5th outfielder. That's about it. We gave up J.P. Howell to the Rays for Gathright..DOPE!

wscr has been covering monday night football so if they did a report it must have been before 7pm cst tonight...

Indeed it was. About 6:30. They also breathlessly announced the official addition of Darrin Jackson to the WSCR White Sox broadcast team.

for those with XM, Gary Hughes is going to be interviewed by Holden Kuchner momentarily.

Gathright mention on Cubs.com now...just that he's on their radar screen and that he played for Piniella in Tampa

http://cubs.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081215&...

Gary Hughes (special asst to the GM) interview on XM:

Disappointed over the Peavy non-deal. Can't get into names on the table but overwhelming as to what they were being asked to give up.

LH bat, Milton Bradley... tremendous talent. Hughes seen 2 of Bradley's most famous games including when he tore his ACL and threw a plastic bottle.

LH bat, hopes we'll get the Fukudome he scouted back. Doesn't know what it was that went wrong, he just didn't finish well.

Bullpen, How ready is Marmol? He will be an outstanding closer but Kevin Gregg will be a factor. Also resigned Chad Gaudin, expect him to be a big factor for us. Loves Sean Marshall. Neal Cotts also a factor.

Reed Johnson, GH grandson dove for a ball reminding him of the Reed Johnson play. He was a great pickup for us.

Micah Hoffpauir, he'll take DWard's role. Some time at 1B backing up DLee plus OF on occasion. UnGodly year at Iowa. Another LH bat.

We're going to add a speed guy too (Joey Gathright reference?)

Discussed scouting players with declining skills (ie. Garrett Anderson, Omar Vizquel) Is there a lineup he can fit in? What happens if he can't hit, Vizquel certainly can still field.

Felix Pie, often youngest guy on any team he's been on. 23 yrs now. Felix needs to separate himself on the positive side.

Playoffs. Bang we hit a wall. Block that out of your mind for next year.

Shark. Starter role? He could be a starter or reliever based on our need. He could even start at Iowa until the team needs a starter.

Regarding Shark, I hope the Cubs take a page from the Twins and how they treated Johan Santana. The first 4 seasons he saw MLB time, he split time between starter and relief, slowly increasing his MLB innings pitched. He didn't make 30+ starts/200IP until his 5th season(2004)and he has hit those marks every year since.

If the Cubs are going to add someone to the roster in order to add some speed, it makes a lot more sense to try to sign Taveras than Gathright. Gathright has never stolen more than 22 bases in a season in the majors, and he currently sports about a 75% success rate to Taveras's 82+%. Pie makes more sense on the roster than does Gathright. Pie is 4 years younger, a better defender, has outslugged Gathright in his young career and has nearly matched his OBP (plus he looks to improve). Gathright just doesn't make sense, unless he's on a minor league contract.

Pie makes more sense on the roster than does Gathright.

True enough, assuming he remains a Cub.

For that matter, Pie makes more sense on the roster than Fukudome does. Fuku isn't just a bust, he's a bust for the ages. And if history is a guide, he's going to be worse in 2009. Only one active Japanese position player did better at the plate in his second MLB season.

As for Gathright, he had a grand total of 4 extra base hits in 279 AB's in 2008. I thought Hendry said he was going to improve the team.

You're dumb.

...sorry, interview was Joe Castellano on XM

I like Hughes saying Fukudome finished poorly. To me, finishing poorly means maybe a bad September or final six weeks. But to stink from Memorial Day until October, two-thirds of a season, is one hell of a bad finish. One might even say it makes for a shit season. Although finishing poorly does sound more hopeful.

I just have to wonder where you and Hughes are getting your info from.

Pie hit .300 .391 .450 in September and October for the Cubs.

Fukudome, not Pie

Whoops, missed the topic change.

Anyway, it wasn't that pitchers suddenly figured Fukudome out (the logic that MLB pitchers are smarter than NL pitchers is flawed at best), it was that Fukudome un-figured himself out.

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