Game 82 Thread / Cubs @ White Sox (3 of 3)

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SP *Sean Marshall SP *Mark Buehrle
  0-1, 5.40, 12 K, 8 BB, 13.1 IP
5-6, 4.04, 57 K, 27 BB, 104.2 IP
RF *Kosuke Fukudome SS Orlando Cabrera
SS Ryan Theriot C *A.J. Pierzynski
1B Derrek Lee LF Carlos Quentin
3B Aramis Ramirez RF Jermaine Dye
DH Geovany Soto DH *Jim Thome
LF Mark DeRosa 3B Joe Crede
CF *Jim Edmonds 1B #Nick Swisher
C Henry Blanco 2B Alexei Ramirez
2B Ronny Cedeno CF Brian Anderson












 About a week ago, the Cubs set an ugly precedent by losing three in a row to the Rays. I see no good reason to set another today by losing their fourth in a row.

Sean Marshall takes the mound and it could be his last start for awhile. When Zambrano returns, Marshall could be headed to the bullpen to give Lou another lefty while Eyre nurses his sore groin or he'll head back to Iowa. Unless he does something special today and someone craps their pants before a decision has to be made (looking at you Marquis).

Back-to-back ESPN Sunday night games and I'll be watching this with one of my oldest friends who's visiting for a few days. I've tried not to hold it against him that he's a White Sox fan all these years. But sometimes I can't help it...


This game looks really, really bad on paper. I'm hoping for an exremely pleasant surprise from Marshall or a bad start from Buehrle, which he is sometimes capable of.

They busted Aramis in on the hands all day yesterday, and he never adjusted. I'm interested to see how he comes back today.

As I stated yesterday, I fully expect a sweep. The teams will split the series. We need reinforcements badly. Reed, Z, Fonzy, and another pitcher (a good pitcher).

ya know how did i know cedeno would swing at first pitch bases loaded do ya think buerlie knew he would swing how many gams in a row has he started at least all 3 this series.

He needs an ear full. "This is the reason you will go back to Iowa when the injuries come back." something to that effect.

Huh? Then who do you think will be the backup SS? Cedeno will be on this team until they can find a better backup SS option, and they don't have that in the Cubs system.

These bullshit umps are the very reason why the subject of instant replay constantly come up in discussion. They've been terrible all weekend, too. I say f-them and their union. Bring in instant replay and bring back motherfucking questec.

ump has been calling crap all game... he's calling low/left-outside for a strike (even stuff a bit outside the zone) and is NOT calling high/left-outide for a strike (even stuff that is IN the zone).

I can't take this crap. I'll check the box score after the game. Christ.

sox have definatly been getting outside of plate calls that homeplate ump has alot of balls throwing lou out whae his backis turned. but it is fun reading lou lips.

if lou didnt come out to the 1st base ump and blow up about the zone he wouldn't have been tossed. you can't just charge the field and then start questioning the call on the game and have it technically not count cuz you're not bitching at the guy who was doing it (which is the guy he should be bitching at anyway). lou did something stupid and now he gets to take a shower. there were plenty of ways to deal with that other than what he did, but given how explosively stupid it was it was probably just some reactionary stuff he wasn't thinking about...unless this is another one of his "i decided next time i saw..." things. he hasn't been prone to those like in the past, though. 1st base ump gets a solid add to the "wtf umps?!?!" list after that call that almost got tram tossed. geez.

Everyone in the ball park saw it was a bad call. I saw it was bad call. You saw it was a bad call. Two people on the face of the planet had another opinion and it was the shit umpires. Absurd.

Two people on the face of the planet had another opinion Make that three. Joe Morgan proclaimed himself undecided until he saw a replay from some other angle -- right after he saw the perfect replay from the perfect angle showing that Cedeno was safe.

Poll question: At the end of this road trip, what place will the Cubs be in? 2nd seems the most likely (after they get swept in St. Louis), but 3rd is not out of the question. About to lose their 6th straight road game.....Grow some balls, gentlemen -- they will come in handy.

Step off the ledge...

Don't you mean step back from the ledge? Stepping off the ledge would certainly keep him from panicking but there may be other side effects to contend with.

Probably best not to go out on the ledge in the first place and avoid all this confusion.

Heh. Yea - you are right. Unless I want people to step off of the ledge...

Hahahahahahaha. God, this series -- err, week -- sucked.

Nice move by Trammell to let Ascanio face Thome. Good thinking there, Alan. "Bench coach" suits you well.

Too bad there wasn't a lefty ready in the pen. What, you mean Cotts was up and ready? Well, shucks. Go back to sleep Alan.

you seriously think lou isnt calling the shots in this game from the clubhouse? if lou wasnt responsible for the pitching changes he must not be watching the game at all...

You are probably right -- sorry, Alan. I was upset. But, still -- WTF? Why have Cotts get ready? Man -- what an ugly week for the Cubs.

Marshall deserved better, at least this time.

The Cubs did nothing this series to ease the concerns about this team that I stated after the blowout loss in the Baltimore finale. For some reason, this Sox series had a kind of playoff air about it - good opposing lineup, decent to good opposing pitching, great bullpen. And the Cubs responded about as well to all that as they did last October. Ah, well. Better luck on the Bay.

Last weekend: A-Ram is 6-for-13, kills the Sox. This weekend: 0-for-13, can't get the tying run in from 3rd yesterday. His home/road split is huge -- about 100 points difference in BA. Weird.

- SIGH - I called this sweep before yesterday's game. They just cannot continue with Cedeno, Fontenot, DWard, a hurt Edmonds, and the over-matched, inconsistent pitchers w/out Big Z. DLee also has to figure it out again. Or, bat 6th. Fukudome looks terrible, for a while... Hopefully, we'll get it together.

I don't have a clue what you are talking about with Lee and Fukudome? Lee has been solid as a rock recently, ncluding a 5-5 day yesterday...did you miss that? Fukodome is just plain bad against lefties, but he's still getting on base at a big clip and still looking at pitches. Only thing I agree with you on in your post is the concern about our starting pitching.

Fukudome vs. LHP: .288 avg., .388 OBP He looks real bad when he whiffs and does his little whirly dance, but his numbers are pretty good. No HRs, tho.

Lee was 5-5, but watch the replays on Two were solid hits. Of the other three, the first one was one of those soft singles to right that Lee settles for too early in the count.The next was a grounder to short that took a bad hop. Then there was a bloop over first near the line. Lee has two homers away from home this year.

5-5 is always good hitting no matter how you break it down. Even Ted Williams needed a lot of those "lucky" or seeing-eye grounders to hit .400. are you gonna say next that Williams didn't deserve to be a .400 hitter because some of his hits were bloop singles or bad hops that a fielder couldn't handle? of course not. Even if only 2 of Derrek Lee's hits were "solid", that's still .400 hitting, dude. I'll take that any day and even on off days.

Huh? DWard is a problem? Edmonds is a problem? Fukudome looks terrible? Lee has to figure it out? Interesting.

Even with the injury, Edmonds is still our hottest hitter. I also don't know what he's talking about. Again step off the ledge.

Fukudome is hitting lefties ok, I guess, but he looks SO bad when he K's, and he has come up in many key situations in the last 10 days and just utterly flopped. With two outs, and RISP, he is batting .194. DLee is went 5 for 5 - Yes. After eclipsing last year's GIDP totals from all of 2007. Are you watching the GAMES, or only the ones you want to talk about? Edmonds is injured. He IS our hottest hitter, but needs a break. We do NOT have a replacement for the platoon guy who is in alot of pain trying to run the bases. The guy is 38! I'll step off the ledge when the team manages to stop getting swept, or can learn how to get back to a .500 team on the road. I can only assume with the DL folks coming back to the team soon, the Cubs SHOULD be able to kick it up a notch again. And the pitching during the last week has sucked.

Did you expect to go through the whole season without a bad week? Has there ever been a team that went through a whole season without a bad week? Stop getting swept? They've been swept twice..yes twice.

"I'll step off the ledge when the team manages to stop getting swept" PUSH!

The sky is falling! The sky is falling! E-man, do yourself a favor and Look at Lee's stats this month. It's funny that you claim we are only looking at the games we want to look at, when clearly you are basing your comments off of individual games, or even individual at bats. Nothing in your initial post made sense. Lee, Fukudome, Edmonds, Ward are the least of our problems now.

That was a nice serving of humble pie. Some thoughts: - Lou knew exactly what he was doing and wanted to try to get his player riled up a bit. He knew he was getting tossed there. - What's the old adage about making sure a ball gets through the infield before you get too far off the base? That's just bad baseball....twice. - Our bullpen is starting to scare me big time...make that our whole pitching staff. Way too many 2 out or 2 strike mistakes.

Our bullpen is starting to scare me big time...make that our whole pitching staff. Way too many 2 out or 2 strike mistakes. Not sure why an outing by the Cubs 8th or 9th bullpen guy is that much to be concerned about.

I'm not talking about just today...I'm talking about over the last 12 games. The problems start with Marmol, but Eyre was awful in his last few appearances, Howry can't get his stuff consistantly together, cotts is Cotts. Ou bullpen was incredible with Marmol and Wood lights out...but with Marmol regressing to Mediocre over the last 2 weeks, the whole bullpen looks weak to me.

Marmol had two really bad outings. Yesterday he made a good pitch that Quentin got lucky on. He is and will be fine. Eyre was bound to have a bad outing or two. I am not worried about Howry, he should be fine. And Cotts? He has been pretty good for the Cubs this year.

why is it that the law of averages doesn't like us as much as STL? This is their first big team slump, and its like everyone is blaming injuries. man up.

Uh, Z, Soriano, Reed, all pretty big pieces of this team. You can't ignore their absence.

You certainly can not ignore the injuries and the impact it is having on this team. we could whether a few injuries, but now it's adding up and difficult to overcome. However, at the end of the season, no one cares about injuries. You have the most wins, or you don't. The Cards and brewers are ready to pounce if the Cubs keep faltering.

sure IF the Cubs keep faltering. Its too early to call this 5 out of 6 some kind of ongoing problem. I think none of us were too worried about this team just a week ago. I'm sure everyone would have taken first place and 2.5 game lead half way through the season.

I think we are going against the right team at the right time with the Giants coming up and facing Zito on Monday. We take 3 out of 4 from the Giants and I'm confident we can be in first place at the All Star break. Its not going to be easy but I think they can do it. Little by little Soriano, Zambrano and Johnson will come back the team will be alot better for it.

What makes you think that in its current state the Cubs can take 3 of 4 from ANY team on the road - they couldn't do this even against the Pirates yet! Sorry, but I gotta play this like the State of Missouri - "Show Me"!

The Cubs swept the Pirates in Pit. The Cubs haven't played a 4 game series against the Pirates. Again, I can't even fathom what you are talking about.

I think Lou and Jimbo need to have a conversation about Murton. This is simply ridiculous -- unless he was either sent down or traded before the game (?), or some team is looking closely at Cedeno, it makes no sense for him not to start tonight. Murton's no great outfielder, but he's better than Derosa. He's no offensive dynamo, but he's better than Cedeno. Makes no sense.

If we don't see Murton against Zito tomorrow then you really gotta wonder whats up.

I agree completely. If there was ever a time for Murton to get some playing time, it should have been today against Buehrle. If Murton is not going to see the field, send him down to AAA to continue to get some work and bring up someone like Jake Fox.

Seems to me like Murton is crabby about not getting traded and has made up his mind that he is just not going to try anymore. He is a totally different hitter this year. His last few at bats have all been first ball ground outs. I think he's given up on the Cubs. I dont know what he is doing on the roster.

I agree that Murton's recent ABs have looked dispirited and sad, but it seems unlikely that he's tanking his career intentionally. Wouldn't he want to raise his game, either to make himself indispensable to the Cubs or make himself easier to trade?

Yeah, I see your point. I just get the idea that he did all he could over the last 2 seasons only to see the cubs bring in a zillion dollar outfielder each year. And the Cubs couldnt/wouldnt trade him in the off season. I gotta think that he's just trying to get released now.

BTW... while is sucks to be swept by the Sox, the Cubs couldn't catch a break. They had several balls hit very hard right at guys today. They got screwed by a couple of bad calls. It happens. They will be fine. I am not sure why anyone really takes the results of a Cubs/Sox seriously anyway. They played in such an atmosphere that they are somewhat meaningless in terms of how we can use the games to analyze the team.

Bobby Jenks is a lucky man. Didn't strike out a batter, walked one and gave up three crushed balls.

I woke up in the same mood. Big HRs by the likes of Alexi Ramirez (somebody check the bat) and Brian Anderson, too many Cub line drives caught by Sox infielders, a cold 3 games for Aramis and Dempster's first bad outing of the year add up to a sweep. Still like Ascanio's arm -- a bad pitch to Thome, but he has hit a few of those in his career. Also, Ceda has cranked it up since returning to the pen and getting moved up to AA -- 8.2 IP, 1 ER, 2 BB and 15Ks. The young power arms will help. Sox have a good team -- power, good starters and a very good bullpen. A Chicago WS is not out of the question.

That 50th win has proven to be elusive but I have no doubt that Zito will give it to us.

I sense a lot of manic-depression considering we just went 3-3 against the WSux. ...and Zambrano pitches friday July 4th, bring your sparklers.

so is lou gonna put derosa in left edmonds and fukudome vs. zito monday and again put cedeno at 2nd the choice is easy either you start cedeno or murton.

I love reading rokfish. It's as if e.e. cummings were a baseball fan.

ARam on leave of absense x3 games in SF ...the article doesn't say what the family problem is but it implies some explanation as to why he was so ineffective this past weekend. Murton will probably get his chance

so we should get to see cedeno and murton tonite. WOO WHO cedeno finally got that elusive 20th rbi.

I don't get all the doom and gloom - Marshall gave you a good start yesterday, and Gallagher righted himself during the 7th the day before. No falling apart with either of them, and both were pressure games. Good things sometimes are hard to see when they first appear, take heart.

Is that you voice of reason?

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  • Dolorous Jon Lester 2 hours 51 min ago (view)

    I understand why it feels unsettling. I remember the series well (though I, unlike Theo, actually was in high school). Anyway, I view it as a chance to right previous wrongs in the same way we stomped StL out of the playoffs in 2015, or the way the Nationals got to burn through two teams last year that had dumped them out of October in previous seasons.

    But if we lose, of course that was 17 years ago so it's two extremely different organizations.


  • Arizona Phil 6 hours 52 min ago (view)

    DJL: All players on Optional Assignment to the minors must be recalled on the day after the conclusion of the MLB regular season, even if the player has not spent at least ten days on Optional Assignment. Players cannot be optioned to the minors again until Spring Training. 


  • Arizona Phil 7 hours 13 min ago (view)

    CHAMP: No option year is spent just by calling up a player to MLB. An option year is spent only if a player on an MLB 40-man roster is optioned to the minors for at least 20 days in a given season. 

    Also, Brailyn Marquez is (was) eligible for selection in the Rule 5 Draft in December, so the Cubs were going to add him to the 40 on 11/20 anyway. They just did it a couple of months early.  


  • bradsbeard 10 hours 23 min ago (view)

    Not sure if serious, but Theo became the Red Sox GM in 2002. It's true though, there probably aren't many people in the organization besides Ricketts and Crane Kenney who have any strong feelings about that series. 


  • Craig A. 11 hours 21 min ago (view)

    I wonder if anyone on the Cubs cares or even remembers the odd events when the Marlins played the Cubs in 2003. I think Theo was in high school. To this old fart it will be more than a little unsettling to watch this post-season match-up. At least we can be fairly certain there will no fans grabbing for foul balls. 


  • bradsbeard 14 hours 49 min ago (view)

    Which is kind of annoying. Nobody really picked the Cubs to win this division pre-season. I guess Mattingly gets some credit for guiding the Marlins through their positives but even just letting them play that one game with half the team sick should knock him out of consideration. Meanwhile Ross kept a tight ship and the Cubs has no positives all year. I'd say Ross or Tingler should get it over Mattingly. 


  • crunch 16 hours 6 min ago (view)

    cubs finish 34-26 (1st, division)...they play MIA on wednesday.

    good start for d.ross, but the manager of the year is most likely going to d.mattingley (MIA) or j.tingler(SD).


  • crunch 16 hours 43 min ago (view)

    ...or he won't make it out of the 8th

    0.2ip 2h 3bb 1k, 5r/er...2 wild pitches

    there's some great stuff in that arm.  mid/high-80s slider, "changeup" around 90mph, fastball 97-99mph...all effortless.  21 years old and never pitched above A-ball.


  • crunch 16 hours 49 min ago (view)



  • crunch 16 hours 53 min ago (view)

    rough debut...doubt we're going to see him in the 9th.


  • Charlie 17 hours 17 sec ago (view)

    Reminds me a little of Jeff Samardzija's debut. Adrenaline throwing straight gas but all over the place. Samardzija threw a fastball all the way to the backstop in his debut (2008).


  • crunch 17 hours 3 min ago (view)

    back to back 3-2 count 6-pitch walks.

    he's not in the zone.  he's throwing almost totally fastballs, too.


  • crunch 17 hours 3 min ago (view)

    alzolay's gotta be locked in for a start given what he's done lately.

    i wonder what role j.lester will be given.  if he's starting, hopefully he's the 3rd/4th starter, if at all.  someone will probably give him a 2021 contract if he doesn't retire...hope it's not the cubs giving that contract, though.


  • crunch 17 hours 6 min ago (view)

    dude's thrown a 97mph and 98mph fastball to start and both looked like he was barely expending effort.

    unfortunately, neither were near the plate.


  • Charlie 17 hours 9 min ago (view)

    So, Alzolay gets at least one October start, right? He'd be a weapon out of the pen if the Cubs had more than two believable starters ready.


  • crunch 17 hours 10 min ago (view)

    Q goes 2 effective (2ip 2h 1bb 2k, 0r/er) and here comes b.marquez...